The Pen

[harmony]

Right now, Jerry DiPoto (Seattle Mariners) is the only current GM to have played Major League Baseball. The position used to be held by former players all the time.

 

Now several GMs, including Mike Hazel, Dave Forst and Ross Atkins, played minor league baseball.

 

The dedication to analytical baseball might be one reason so few players hold the position, but skyrocketing MLB salaries could be a factor, too. Maybe as many former players may not need to work anymore as there used to be.

A baseball fan with 40+ hours to spare might be interested in the podcasts with Seattle general manager Jerry Dipoto:

 

http://seattle.mariners.mlb.com/fan_forum/podcasts/index.jsp?c_id=sea&podcast=wheelhouse

 

Dipoto might not always make the right decision but his podcasts are informative and often entertaining.

[kenmeister]

@PeteAbe

 

Per Alex Cora, the Sox plan to use Steven Wright only as a reliever.

 

For his career, Wright has a 2.99 ERA in 31 relief appearances and 4.00 in 44 starts.

 

But this is more about what they thinks works best given his knee woes.

 

Yes I'm excited to see Wright coming out of the pen everyone talks about Barnes & Brasier but he should also be very effective.

[mvp 78]

Yes I'm excited to see Wright coming out of the pen everyone talks about Barnes & Brasier but he should also be very effective.

 

The good thing about Wright being in the pen is that you can keep him out of weather related situations (i.e. whenever it's wet) and not have to worry about messing with the rotation. I'm not a huge Wright supporter as that knuckleball hasn't sold me.

[moonslav59]

Yes I'm excited to see Wright coming out of the pen everyone talks about Barnes & Brasier but he should also be very effective.

 

It could really mess with the hitters timing, even beyond their AB (or two) vs Wright.

[Kimmi]

IMO Alex Speier doesn't need to have played much baseball to be good at what he does, any more than Dave Dombrowski does.

 

Bingo.

[Kimmi]

I agree that Cora would have been a better " Alex " example. Don't agree with Wohlers and don't really care about his " insight ." As for Arnold Stang ; I don't think he ever really pumped much iron . However , he did make a forgettable flick with Schwarzenegger called " Hercules in New York ." I do think that people who actually do something and do it well have an advantage over those who just basically watch . Anyway , it was really just an ( admittedly lame ) attempt at humor .

 

If there is a person who has MLB playing experience and who is well versed in analytics, then that person would probably be a better source regarding baseball than someone who has one quality or the other.

 

Past that, there are obviously areas where a player with major league experience is going to know more than someone who hasn't played the game. At the same time, there are going to be some areas where the analytics guy has an advantage over someone who has played the game.

 

If I want batting lessons, I'm going with the major league player.

 

If I'm putting together a team, I'm going with the analytics guy every time.

[Kimmi]

finally!! we all have come to an agreement that the one guy watching every play and creating UZR is stupid and that robot umps are needed NOW.

i love you guys......

 

Don't get me started...

[Kimmi]

OK, now you must answer this question:

 

Does Dave Dombrowski's lack of playing experience impact his work as a team builder?

 

Someone once used an analogy that about how he would never presume to know more about having a baby than a woman.

 

Again, it depends on exactly what it is you want to know.

 

If I were going to have a child, who am I going to trust to deliver my child? A male doctor who has studied obstetrics for years but has never given birth, or a female who has given birth but is not an OB?

[Kimmi]

It could really mess with the hitters timing, even beyond their AB (or two) vs Wright.

 

I do like that aspect of Wright being in the pen. Wright is a guy who can pitch multiple innings, so he can pitch through most of the line up if Cora chooses to keep him in that long. Imagine having to face Sale, then Wright, then Barnes.

[Bellhorn04]

Someone once used an analogy that about how he would never presume to know more about having a baby than a woman.

 

Again, it depends on exactly what it is you want to know.

 

If I were going to have a child, who am I going to trust to deliver my child? A male doctor who has studied obstetrics for years but has never given birth, or a female who has given birth but is not an OB?

 

That's a good one alright.

[notin]

Someone once used an analogy that about how he would never presume to know more about having a baby than a woman.

 

Again, it depends on exactly what it is you want to know.

 

If I were going to have a child, who am I going to trust to deliver my child? A male doctor who has studied obstetrics for years but has never given birth, or a female who has given birth but is not an OB?

 

Is the woman who gave birth also a midwife?

[Kimmi]

Is the woman who gave birth also a midwife?

 

Well I did make the point previously that if you had a person who has both the experience as a player and the background in analytics, that he/she would probably be your best choice.

 

This is an either/or decision.

[jacksonianmarch]

You take the physician 100% of the time. If s*** goes downhill, he can cut the baby out and ensure you both survive. The midwife can call an ambulance and get you to the hospital in time for them to cut a dead fetus out of you

[Kimmi]

You take the physician 100% of the time. If s*** goes downhill, he can cut the baby out and ensure you both survive. The midwife can call an ambulance and get you to the hospital in time for them to cut a dead fetus out of you

 

FTR, my kids were both delivered by a male OB/GYN.

[notin]

And where do storks come into play here?

[notin]

You take the physician 100% of the time. If s*** goes downhill, he can cut the baby out and ensure you both survive. The midwife can call an ambulance and get you to the hospital in time for them to cut a dead fetus out of you

 

 

Now you have to spin all that back into the “only the players are experts” context of the argument...

[dgalehouse]

Knowing what it takes to have a baby and knowing what it takes to deliver a baby are two entirely different things .

[Kimmi]

Knowing what it takes to have a baby and knowing what it takes to deliver a baby are two entirely different things .

 

The same can be said about having the skills to play baseball and knowing what it takes to assess, manage, or build a team.

[Bellhorn04]

The same can be said about having the skills to play baseball and knowing what it takes to assess, manage, or build a team.

 

Checkmate.

[cp176]

I wonder how this ever turned in to an either or argument? hmmm

I would bet that it is still possible to have the best of both worlds.

[Bellhorn04]

I wonder how this ever turned in to an either or argument? hmmm

I would bet that it is still possible to have the best of both worlds.

 

I think real world examples are the best way to support a point.

[notin]

I wonder how this ever turned in to an either or argument? hmmm

I would bet that it is still possible to have the best of both worlds.

 

 

Yes. You get Jerry DiPoto...

[Bellhorn04]

Yes. You get Jerry DiPoto...

 

And Derek Jeter.

[dgalehouse]

Checkmate.

 

Okay . Checkmate. But the comparisons kind of evolved here . I started out using Alex Speier as an example . Somehow , it changed to Epstein and Dombrowski. And ex players have done well as mangers and coaches . How would you like to see Speier replace Cora ?

[notin]

Okay . Checkmate. But the comparisons kind of evolved here . I started out using Alex Speier as an example . Somehow , it changed to Epstein and Dombrowski. And ex players have done well as mangers and coaches . How would you like to see Speier replace Cora ?

 

 

Now who’s moving the goal posts?

 

You expressed a lack of faith in Speier as a baseball writer because he hadn’t played the game. That had nothing to do with being an MLB manager...

[notin]

Okay . Checkmate. But the comparisons kind of evolved here . I started out using Alex Speier as an example . Somehow , it changed to Epstein and Dombrowski. And ex players have done well as mangers and coaches . =How would you like to see Speier replace Cora ?

 

 

This is very true. In fact almost all MLB managers are former major leaguers, and those who aren’t are former minor leaguers. Most of them are former catchers, for obvious reasons.

 

But this actually doesn’t support your initial supposition that non-players don’t know the game...

[dgalehouse]

Now who’s moving the goal posts?

 

You expressed a lack of faith in Speier as a baseball writer because he hadn’t played the game. That had nothing to do with being an MLB manager...

 

I am not the one who brought Theo and D.D. into the discussion. So , I am actually just putting the goal posts back where they were in the first place. I don't question Speier as a writer. Just as an " expert."

[notin]

I am not the one who brought Theo and D.D. into the discussion. So , I am actually just putting the goal posts back where they were in the first place. I don't question Speier as a writer. Just as an " expert."

 

 

Well the Stang/Schwarzenegger thing made it appear to be an overall generality, even though it was also a funny joke about Arnold Stang and his physique...

[notin]

I am not the one who brought Theo and D.D. into the discussion. So , I am actually just putting the goal posts back where they were in the first place. I don't question Speier as a writer. Just as an " expert."

 

 

Of course, by message board law, I did have to throw this back at you because I did once use player testimony that did not agree with your beliefs, so you in turn used some of his playing experiences to disqualify him as any type of expert.

 

I’d say we both should know by now, Mark Wohlers knows more about closing games than either of us are even capable of learning...

[dgalehouse]

Okay . But my guess is that Wohlers' opinion would not be shared by most relief pitchers / closers past or present . And Speier is still a dweeb . He wouldn't know a slider from a hoagie if it hit him in the butt .