The Pen

[notin]

Okay . But my guess is that Wohlers' opinion would not be shared by most relief pitchers / closers past or present . And Speier is still a dweeb . He wouldn't know a slider from a hoagie if it hit him in the butt .

 

 

1) Tough call. His opinion might be more popular than you realize. Heck maybe he was quoting another closer himself.

 

2) Like Speier or not, dweeb or not, are any of our opinions - which this is a whole forum for - any better?

[cp176]

1) Tough call. His opinion might be more popular than you realize. Heck maybe he was quoting another closer himself.

 

2) Like Speier or not, dweeb or not, are any of our opinions - which this is a whole forum for - any better?

 

No they absolutely are better than mine - only speak for myself. I kind of like him but my guess would be once again that there likely are former players out there with every bit as much expertise as he has. He happens to be here. Given the option - and if I actually cared about this stuff - the analytical expert with the playing experience would be the one that I would hang my hat on. You see it really is all about personal choice. There are people here who do feel as they they have to prove a point when it comes to this crap. i don't worry much about it. If my automobile needs work, it is likely that a person who has studied the mechanism thoroughly but has never actually worked on a vehicle would not get my business. I would sooner opt for the person who has done the studying and had some practical experience as well.

[Slasher9]

one of the greatest baseball players of all time was a terrible manager.

see: Williams, Ted.

one of the greatest baseball managers of all time was a horrific player.

see: Anderson, Sparky

 

to say Alex Speier cant be an "expert" on baseball because he never played an inning of MLB is just dumb.

[TylerD]

one of the greatest baseball players of all time was a terrible manager.

see: Williams, Ted.

one of the greatest baseball managers of all time was a horrific player.

see: Anderson, Sparky

 

to say Alex Speier cant be an "expert" on baseball because he never played an inning of MLB is just dumb.

 

Agreed completely with this. There are brilliant men out there that have never played the game, but can build a winning team like you wouldn’t believe. Sure it helps if you player the game, but that doesn’t mean you will be or won’t be a good manager.

[notin]

No they absolutely are better than mine - only speak for myself. I kind of like him but my guess would be once again that there likely are former players out there with every bit as much expertise as he has. He happens to be here. Given the option - and if I actually cared about this stuff - the analytical expert with the playing experience would be the one that I would hang my hat on. You see it really is all about personal choice. There are people here who do feel as they they have to prove a point when it comes to this crap. i don't worry much about it. If my automobile needs work, it is likely that a person who has studied the mechanism thoroughly but has never actually worked on a vehicle would not get my business. I would sooner opt for the person who has done the studying and had some practical experience as well.

 

 

The best former-player-turned-analytical-expert I can think of is Steve Stone, who was MLB’s equivalent of Tony Romo before Romo even started playing football...

[cp176]

one of the greatest baseball players of all time was a terrible manager.

see: Williams, Ted.

one of the greatest baseball managers of all time was a horrific player.

see: Anderson, Sparky

 

to say Alex Speier cant be an "expert" on baseball because he never played an inning of MLB is just dumb.

 

No one is likely to argue that Alex Speier knows what he is talking about. If someone said that, I could have missed it. If you are on the field and actually showing someone how to do something it is helpful though if you can sort of do it. You don't have to expert in it since it isn't life or death but it does help. For the record, I kind of like him.

[cp176]

The best former-player-turned-analytical-expert I can think of is Steve Stone, who was MLB’s equivalent of Tony Romo before Romo even started playing football...

 

 

thanks for that - i do like Speier but once again if you have someone who really is good at what they do, my persoanal preference would be to go with the guy with the on field experience.

[Bellhorn04]

Former ballplayers often make excellent color commentators - Tony Romo, Dennis Eckersley - and a lot of that has to do with their playing experience.

 

But the majority of good sportswriters were not players.

 

It's just different skill-sets.

[BillyWilliams]

One scout's take on the bullpen:

 

“The gulf is wide. The Yankees’ bullpen is the best in the game,’’ a second scout said of the Yankees main quintet, who have a combined 432 saves. “They have four and five guys who can lock down a game from the sixth inning on. The Red Sox need help. Thornburg has been hurt and it will be hard to depend on him. The Yankees are a major league bullpen and the Red Sox are at a Double-A level as far as the gap.’’

 

https://nypost.com/2019/02/15/yankees-bullpen-edge-over-red-sox-could-tip-scales-in-al-east/

[Slasher9]

One scout's take on the bullpen:

 

“The gulf is wide. The Yankees’ bullpen is the best in the game,’’ a second scout said of the Yankees main quintet, who have a combined 432 saves. “They have four and five guys who can lock down a game from the sixth inning on. The Red Sox need help. Thornburg has been hurt and it will be hard to depend on him. The Yankees are a major league bullpen and the Red Sox are at a Double-A level as far as the gap.’’

 

https://nypost.com/2019/02/15/yankees-bullpen-edge-over-red-sox-could-tip-scales-in-al-east/

 

the best takeaway from that article:

After finishing eight games back of the Red Sox and losing the ALDS in four games to their blood rivals last season

[Nick]

After we win the Division, I will happily proclaim that

 

Despite finishing second (AGAIN), Yankees have the Best Bullpen Ever Assembled!

[BillyWilliams]

i think it's cute that you guys have learned how to change font size..........

[cp176]

Former ballplayers often make excellent color commentators - Tony Romo, Dennis Eckersley - and a lot of that has to do with their playing experience.

 

But the majority of good sportswriters were not players.

 

It's just different skill-sets.

 

Kind of like the stay in your lane comments that I hear so often.

[jacksonianmarch]

If you could build an ideal manager, you’d pick a guy who spent time in the show but was not a star. A guy whose talent didn’t get him beyond reaching the professional level. You need a guy who knows what being the 25th man is like. Stars have trouble relating to non stars. It’s hard to teach someone how to be great when the talent discrepancy is insane between the former star now manager and the players under him.

 

I still think a guy like Billy Beane is the beat type of GM. Highly intelligent who knows what it’s like to be a ball player. A Gm who doesn’t embrace analytics is gonna be a goner soon enough. But a former ball player who embraces analytics will have more staying power

[harmony]

thanks for that - i do like Speier but once again if you have someone who really is good at what they do, my persoanal preference would be to go with the guy with the on field experience.

Big Data will exploit those who ignore it.

[Nick]

i think it's cute that you guys have learned how to change font size..........

 

It's a big deal at my age..nice deflection by the way.

[Kimmi]

one of the greatest baseball players of all time was a terrible manager.

see: Williams, Ted.

one of the greatest baseball managers of all time was a horrific player.

see: Anderson, Sparky

 

to say Alex Speier cant be an "expert" on baseball because he never played an inning of MLB is just dumb.

 

Amen, Brother Slash.

[Kimmi]

Big Data will exploit those who ignore it.

 

!!!

[cp176]

Big Data will exploit those who ignore it.

 

And this comment relates to me how? if you are suggesting that I ignore the use and emphasis on data in the game today, you would be wrong. I am sorry though that I am not in love with nor am I willing to fall all over the comments I read emphasizing data value at the expense of everything else. When this forum becomes driven by data folk only, i will bow out. It hasn't reached that stage quite yet. There are so many new and unique ways for data to be used by the people into that sort of thing to spew any idea that they chose to spew.

[harmony]

And this comment relates to me how? if you are suggesting that I ignore the use and emphasis on data in the game today, you would be wrong. I am sorry though that I am not in love with nor am I willing to fall all over the comments I read emphasizing data value at the expense of everything else. When this forum becomes driven by data folk only, i will bow out. It hasn't reached that stage quite yet. There are so many new and unique ways for data to be used by the people into that sort of thing to spew any idea that they chose to spew.

On-field experience will exploit those who ignore it.

[dgalehouse]

And this comment relates to me how? if you are suggesting that I ignore the use and emphasis on data in the game today, you would be wrong. I am sorry though that I am not in love with nor am I willing to fall all over the comments I read emphasizing data value at the expense of everything else. When this forum becomes driven by data folk only, i will bow out. It hasn't reached that stage quite yet. There are so many new and unique ways for data to be used by the people into that sort of thing to spew any idea that they chose to spew.

 

There is a certain superior snobbism that those who are devoted to analytics / sabermetrics display to those who don't quite buy into the whole thing . You will get their condescending attitude that you must believe the earth is flat and so forth . This applies to other subjects as well , but I'm not going there . In my view , skepticism is not something to mock . And always going along with the latest trend does not make one any smarter than the skeptic .

[cp176]

On-field experience will exploit those who ignore it.

 

lol - put them together somehow (I know you can) and we will have a winner.

 

Based on your last two comments, you likely headed in a political direction!

[cp176]

There is a certain superior snobbism that those who are devoted to analytics / sabermetrics display to those who don't quite buy into the whole thing . You will get their condescending attitude that you must believe the earth is flat and so forth . This applies to other subjects as well , but I'm not going there . In my view , skepticism is not something to mock . And always going along with the latest trend does not make one any smarter than the skeptic .

 

I will say that the people I converse with here and actually have a lot of fun with in many cases seem to be tolerant of the fact that there are multiple ways to view things. Not buying into something in totality does not mean that you don't see its value. On the other hand, maybe the ones who I communicate with accept me for what they think I am even though they might be wrong. I think that they have learned to tolerate me possibly because I am likely not going anywhere. i am a very firm believer that if we all saw things the same way, it would be quite boring. This forum thank goodness provides us with much more than a simple round table of the analytical world and what they do for us. There was a time that I might have agreed with you about the condescension piece but not so much anymore. Plenty of disagreement for sure but once again that can be a good thing. Personally I am just a fan of the game on the field. I like to talk actual baseball and baseball strategy. Much of what interests me does not need to be propped up with data.

[cp176]

I wish that it wasn't beginning to really look unlikely that Kimbrel will be coming back to Boston. Based on today's comments coming from management I guess it looks unlikely. This guy i will miss as much for his qualities as a teammate as well as his talent. We had a chance to see one of the best there has been do his thing for us. Hope everybody appreciates that.

[cp176]

One more thing - Based on John henry's comments from yesterday, I can see why you don't hear many players talking about the importance of analytics. They are obviously having a great impact on the business side of things. The number of free agents left unsigned at this time likely has as much to do with their importance as it does to overall budgets. Doesn't sound like collusion to me. Great for the owners. They are using the data available to them to make decisions based on monies available. I think that long term we are going to see either major changes or major problems.

[jacksonianmarch]

the best takeaway from that article:

After finishing eight games back of the Red Sox and losing the ALDS in four games to their blood rivals last season

 

You do understand that the yanks got better and the Sox have gotten worse. Your team will be in the wild card game in 2019

[S5Dewey]

There is a certain superior snobbism that those who are devoted to analytics / sabermetrics display to those who don't quite buy into the whole thing . You will get their condescending attitude that you must believe the earth is flat and so forth . This applies to other subjects as well , but I'm not going there . In my view , skepticism is not something to mock . And always going along with the latest trend does not make one any smarter than the skeptic .

 

I wish I'd said this^^^.

[Bellhorn04]

Big Data will exploit those who ignore it.

 

To me Big Data is just another annoying new catch phrase. What exactly does it mean in connection with baseball?

[moonslav59]

You do understand that the yanks got better and the Sox have gotten worse. Your team will be in the wild card game in 2019

 

That's your opinion.

 

It will be hard to beat 108 games, but I think our team is as good or better than 2018's.

 

Eovaldi, Pearce, Thornburg, Sale, ERod, Brasier, Betts, Bogey, vaz and others for a full season.

 

Pedey back.

 

Devers due to bust out.

 

JBJ finding consistency.

 

Beni still on the upswing.

 

Yes, there are questions, but every teams has those.

 

Losing Kimbrel will be made up for by the above list, and DD will pick up a good RP'er mid year.

[moonslav59]

There is a certain superior snobbism that those who are devoted to analytics / sabermetrics display to those who don't quite buy into the whole thing . You will get their condescending attitude that you must believe the earth is flat and so forth . This applies to other subjects as well , but I'm not going there . In my view , skepticism is not something to mock . And always going along with the latest trend does not make one any smarter than the skeptic .

 

There is snobbism on both sides.