Sox starting pitching thread

[Station 13]

Agree, last 2 Months he's been Pitching real good. I count 9 quality starts (Including yesterday's) in a row. Like the way he pitches, on a not real good team too. His ERA was 2.77 for the Months of June and July, before yesterdays game. Some balls yesterday at Fenway, might have been difference makers, though. Be careful of Ballpark Pitchers Pitch in.

At Home 2.69 ERA

Road 4.44 ERA

This year.

 

Correct. Game is different if he pitch in a smaller ballpark last night and we trot out a B lineup.

[jacksonianmarch]

Fiers is the kind of guy you need. He’s not flashy and will probably get his s*** lit against HOU or NYY, but you need a guy who can take the ball every 5 and not be a total burn on the pen. He fits the bill

[FredLynn]

Fiers is the kind of guy you need. He’s not flashy and will probably get his s*** lit against HOU or NYY, but you need a guy who can take the ball every 5 and not be a total burn on the pen. He fits the bill

 

I think he is the kind of guy YOUR team needs. If ERod makes it back we are set for SP. Meanwhile, once you get past Severino, you have Sabathia, who, while pitching well so far, is a disaster waiting to happen. Then you have Tanaka (4.54), Gray, who has been a joke most of the time (5.34), and German-even worse than Gray (5.68). The Yankees are going to need to upgrade by at least one SP, probably two...and the cost will be very high.

[vegasbob]

Odd how the Red Sox and Yankees are on track for 105+- wins with very shallow pitching staffs, and Houston with the GOAT rotation may win fewer games in the same league, different division.

 

But if you think the Sox will prevail in any 4 game series with just Sale , Price and Porcello , try again. Far worse in the era of 5-6 inning starters is the current bullpen featuring some of the most unreliable arms you can assemble outside of Kimbrel, and he has a few moments when he looks like Ryne Duren warming up.

 

Dave Roberts of Red Sox fame, now managing the Dodgers said as much about his team after another blow up where he had to use 4 pitchers in the 8th inning, then his closer Jansen. " Still don't have a clear idea of which reliever can be counted on from one night to the another. To be honest we are still trying to figure it out" Sounds like Cora. All contending teams are searching for one or more consistent pitchers who throw effectively.

[Bellhorn04]

Odd how the Red Sox and Yankees are on track for 105+- wins with very shallow pitching staffs, and Houston with the GOAT rotation may win fewer games in the same league, different division.

 

But if you think the Sox will prevail in any 4 game series with just Sale , Price and Porcello , try again. Far worse in the era of 5-6 inning starters is the current bullpen featuring some of the most unreliable arms you can assemble outside of Kimbrel, and he has a few moments when he looks like Ryne Duren warming up.

 

Dave Roberts of Red Sox fame, now managing the Dodgers said as much about his team after another blow up where he had to use 4 pitchers in the 8th inning, then his closer Jansen. " Still don't have a clear idea of which reliever can be counted on from one night to the another. To be honest we are still trying to figure it out" Sounds like Cora. All contending teams are searching for one or more consistent pitchers who throw effectively.

 

Barnes is having a fine season, with a 2.30 ERA and a 1.09 WHIP. Workman has been outstanding.

 

Fans have unrealistic expectations.

[Spudboy]

Barnes is having a fine season, with a 2.30 ERA and a 1.09 WHIP. Workman has been outstanding.

 

Fans have unrealistic expectations.

 

Yeah no disrespect to Vegas but I think the pen , overall, has been fine.

 

They are relief pitchers, after all. If they were consistently good these guys would be starters.

[vegasbob]

Barnes is having a fine season, with a 2.30 ERA and a 1.09 WHIP. Workman has been outstanding.

 

Fans have unrealistic expectations.

 

OK, I will concede to the stats presented by the Matt Barnes Fan Club and acknowledge his great contribution to the Sox success this year. But one final note, Matt Barnes will be the losing pitcher in the last game played by the RedSox in 2018 , which has bigger implications than his stats .

[Spudboy]

OK, I will concede to the stats presented by the Matt Barnes Fan Club and acknowledge his great contribution to the Sox success this year. But one final note, Matt Barnes will be the losing pitcher in the last game played by the RedSox in 2018 , which has bigger implications than his stats .

 

Lol. Ye of little faith!

[FredLynn]

OK, I will concede to the stats presented by the Matt Barnes Fan Club and acknowledge his great contribution to the Sox success this year. But one final note, Matt Barnes will be the losing pitcher in the last game played by the RedSox in 2018 , which has bigger implications than his stats .

 

He might....but didn't Chris Sale get pounded by the Astros in game one of the playoffs last year? Does that negate what a fine season he had?

[vegasbob]

He might....but didn't Chris Sale get pounded by the Astros in game one of the playoffs last year? Does that negate what a fine season he had?

 

We all have players we like to see in the game, Fred Lynn being one of those, and Mark Bellhorn as well. Just not feeling it with Matt, but obviously wish him and the team well throughout the season and playoffs leading to a ring. Hopefully Sale will have some gas in the tank in October and that Barnes doesn't give everyone gas , lol

Edited July 22, 2018 by vegasbob

[d-money]

Come the playoffs this starting staff needs to step up. Houston looks good but you have to find a way and beat good pitching.

[Kimmi]

If the Sox have indeed fixed a mechanical flaw with Thornburg, that could be a huge boost to our pen.

 

Either way, Dave needs to get us a solid, late inning reliever.

[a700hitter]

If the Sox have indeed fixed a mechanical flaw with Thornburg, that could be a huge boost to our pen.

 

Either way, Dave needs to get us a solid, late inning reliever.

Yes, they found a mechanical flaw. The solution is to not have him not release the ball.

[cp176]

Yes, they found a mechanical flaw. The solution is to not have him not release the ball.

 

Perhaps they have realized that he has a chronic condition - bats attract his pitches. lol

 

No joking though - Our bullpen has been fine for the most part. All of this talk about playoff performance ain't making it for me. First of all you have to get there and secondly if you do a new season begins. i don't even consider what anyone has done in prior playoff seasons. How many times have I been lectured here about how good or maybe even great players tend to play to the level that the stats say they should? There are no playoff only superstars. I like tough guys who get it done during the regular season. We have a bunch of them including the pitchers. If we get to the playoffs and we are not successful, it will have nothing to do with what any of these guys have done in the past. it is all about right now. i like our guys.

[Spudboy]

Perhaps they have realized that he has a chronic condition - bats attract his pitches. lol

 

No joking though - Our bullpen has been fine for the most part. All of this talk about playoff performance ain't making it for me. First of all you have to get there and secondly if you do a new season begins. i don't even consider what anyone has done in prior playoff seasons. How many times have I been lectured here about how good or maybe even great players tend to play to the level that the stats say they should? There are no playoff only superstars. I like tough guys who get it done during the regular season. We have a bunch of them including the pitchers. If we get to the playoffs and we are not successful, it will have nothing to do with what any of these guys have done in the past. it is all about right now. i like our guys.

 

A f***ing great post.

[cp176]

A f***ing great post.

 

It kind of reminds me of what one of the very best coaches I ever have worked with used to tell me - said coach also had a stellar playing career in high school as well as college. Rest is necessary and good for sure but - "what I had I gave because what I saved I lost".

I think that Cora has done a great job managing pitcher's innings so far. Limiting pitch counts and maybe skipping a few starts to provide a little rest to get through the rest of the way makes sense but just not to an extreme. I'm really not sure that it makes any difference at all. I don't tend to look ahead much, day to day for me. If Sale says he feels great, good enough for me.

[Bellhorn04]

Yes, they found a mechanical flaw. The solution is to not have him not release the ball.

 

You are really not a Thornburg fan LOL

 

I'm a little surprised to see you give up on a player so quick.

[Dojji]

Thornburg's problem is twofold. He's not making a good first impression, and he cost us a player a lot of us feel we could have used this year and last. Shaw hit 30 dingers last year and is on pace for similar production. He's leading the Brewers into playoff contention and is one of their best hitters. Given the issues with Devers, who is simply young and hasn't come into his own yet I for one am still not 100% over that trade.

 

Patience with Devers will be rewarded in time, but in the meantime, there's some residual bad feelings that get directed at Thornburg because Shaw is no longer in our uni

[mvp 78]

Thornburg's problem is twofold. He's not making a good first impression, and he cost us a player a lot of us feel we could have used this year and last. Shaw hit 30 dingers last year and is on pace for similar production. He's leading the Brewers into playoff contention and is one of their best hitters. Given the issues with Devers, who is simply young and hasn't come into his own yet I for one am still not 100% over that trade.

 

Patience with Devers will be rewarded in time, but in the meantime, there's some residual bad feelings that get directed at Thornburg because Shaw is no longer in our uni

 

He's 5th on the team in OPS. Let's not overstate what Travis Shaw is any more than we already do. That team would be really good without him.

 

The Sox are leading the league in runs and OPS. They don't need Travis Shaw.

[OH FOY]

Thornburg cost us this kid too.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=dubon-000mau

 

Kid hit everywhere he has been. Before injury had 23 game hitting streak, and was going to be called up this year for sure, by the Brewers.

Edited July 23, 2018 by OH FOY!

[mvp 78]

Thornburg coast us this kid too.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=dubon-000mau

 

Kid hit everywhere he has been.

 

I would agree that Dubon is the bigger loss to this year's team as he'd be the starting 2b. He's out with an ACL injury this year.

[OH FOY]

He would have been playing SS for the Brewers.

[cp176]

I would agree that Dubon is the bigger loss to this year's team as he'd be the starting 2b. He's out with an ACL injury this year.

 

Of all the ones traded, Dubon was the one I least liked seeing go. After seeing him play, I was very impressed.

[mvp 78]

He would have been playing SS for the Brewers.

 

Probably.

[mvp 78]

Of all the ones traded, Dubon was the one I least liked seeing go. After seeing him play, I was very impressed.

 

Yeah, it was the only thing that made me wince about the trade at the time. The trade didn't work out, but I don't lament losing Shaw.

[cp176]

Yeah, it was the only thing that made me wince about the trade at the time. The trade didn't work out, but I don't lament losing Shaw.

 

Me either and I still don't. I'm the eternal hopetomist though. I still think that Thornburg could help us. Once again though, I would say that it is important to actually see these guys play a little before making a personal decision simply based on statistical information in my case. To me Dubon just looked like a future good one. But I kind of liked Shaw as well.

[OH FOY]

That Salem Team batting Moncada, Dubon, and Benni, were dynamic, for first 3 batters. I get the Moncada move, but DD seemed like Dubon was a throw in. Next year when Bogaerts contract runs out, nobody to fall back on. With Boras as an agent you better have it.

Sox will be paying big Bucks for Bogaerts, that's my prediction. Just glad he didn't Trade Benni too.

Edited July 23, 2018 by OH FOY!

[mvp 78]

https://www.sbnation.com/2016/7/23/12264116/chris-sale-sent-home-for-cutting-up-white-sox-throwback-jerseys

 

Happy 2nd anniversary to Chris Sale tearing the s*** out of those throwback jerseys and getting himself traded to the Good Sox.

[Station 13]

Devers, don't piss off Sale with an error ever.

[Dojji]

Yeah, it was the only thing that made me wince about the trade at the time. The trade didn't work out, but I don't lament losing Shaw.

 

I do. Even if you discount the home run factor, which can exaggerate Shaw's value I agree, he's a solid producer of offense at a position where we've needed one for awhile. Even with his inconsistency, which was on full display in his first and only full season in Boston, and has dragged him backward a bit in Milwaukee this year he's been putting up positive numbers on both sides of the ball and is a solid contributing piece to a baseball team.

 

As much as he isn't a superstar level player, if you put Travis Shaw at 3B, you don't have a hole at 3B. We've had a hole at 3B for awhile now, so I winced when he was traded, especially because it looked to me like he was traded mostly to give the Pablob one last chance to earn his contract, which is such a shining example of the sunk cost fallacy that it should need no further explanation from me as to why that was a bad idea.

 

I'm optimistic that Devers will grow into the role of Boston's everyday 3B given time, health and experience at the major league level, but he's not there yet, and until he is, we technically still have a hole at 3B. There's always going to be a regret factor with me around the Thornburg trade un til Devers comes into his own, which will probably take another year or 2.