Fire alex cora

[Kimmi]

When I hear posters say that DD deserved to get fired I want to ask a couple of questions.

 

1) What do you think the job of a GM is in the off season?

 

2) Where did DD fail at that?

 

If someone asked me that I'd say that the job of the GM is to build a team that, on paper, should and could contend for a World Series Championship.

 

Where did he fail at that? He didn't. The biggest "crime" he can be accused of is not having his Magic 8 Ball calibrated properly so it would point out over the winter that our pitching staff would implode.

 

I 100% agree with this. Dombrowski did his job during the offseason.

[Bellhorn04]

https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2019/10/alex-cora-keeps-defending-boston-red-soxs-spring-training-plan-says-some-top-mlb-starters-had-tapered-workloads-is-he-right.html?fbclid=IwAR2TChi0PcrD0cd9bL6PiTViEnzdn41UzoURcibssuDmzoDN-UnIA5wqmII

 

More bad reporting. This guy makes it sound like a certainty that Sale, Price and Eovaldi got injured this year because of the spring program.

 

But he fails to even mention the injury problems these three have had in the very recent past.

 

And what sidelined Eovaldi this year was the identical 'loose bodies' issue he had last year.

 

Very annoying.

[Bellhorn04]

I 100% agree with this. Dombrowski did his job during the offseason.

 

But he basically did nothing of any note after signing Eovaldi and Pearce very early on.

[Kimmi]

i actually get and am ok with the EO signing as he was a FA. but the Sale extension looks premature. i believe we definitely could have resigned him for less$$ and or years if we waited until after this season.....

 

I actually did not have a problem with either the Eovaldi signing or the Sale extension, though I thought both were a year too long.

 

I am on board with most of what Dombrowski did after his first two years with the team.

 

His biggest problem this year was not providing much needed depth.

[Kimmi]

Granted I never read any book by Francona or anyone else in the Sox. So I don’t know the sources.

 

But it seems to me Lucchino’s biggest crime was being thoroughly unlikable and therefore easy to blame. Maybe it was his history or winning everywhere in multiple sports. Maybe his off-putting “I know business not sports” demeanor. Maybe it was his scaly skin and forked tongue. But there was something about the guy that made putting the blame on him just feel right...

 

I don't doubt that he is an extremely knowledgeable baseball man. It's just that his goals were different than Theo's or Ben's. His goals were business oriented rather than baseball oriented. Theo pretty much said as much after he left, and it's also the reason for the gorilla suit affair.

[Kimmi]

depends. what did the teammate do that they were sticking up for him? i'm not digging TB12 sticking up for AB.

better ways to "protest" instead of cutting up an MLB jersey IMO.

 

Cutting up the jerseys was flat out childish and wrong, no matter the circumstances.

[Kimmi]

I don't know. Maybe we should stick to the current example of DD. I don't think he's being smeared.

 

Yeah, he kind of is though. Smeared might be a bit strong, but the impression that we are getting of the way Dombrowski ran the FO is not a pleasant one.

[cp176]

I am opposed to that of course but I am confused by so many who have such a great concern for how that guy spends his money.

 

I'm not sure some of us are concerned in the way you think we are.

 

I rarely "take the owner's side" or defend corporate America. I think they got richer while the rest of us stayed even at best due to getting out of paying their fair share in taxes, but the way I approach the Sox and their budget is based on what I think Henry wants and is going to do. It doesn't mean I agree with him or love the guy.

 

If it was up to me, he'd use some of the profits not to hire more FAs, but to lower prices, so the average Joe can afford to go see a game again.

 

I'm concerned over our spending, because I know there is not a limitless budget.

 

Hey I actually do agree with you here. What I would really like to see JH do is in some way make the Fenway experience more cost affordable and in my personal case a little more comfortable. The last time I was in Fenway my wife and I were wedged into our seats between two people who should have paid for two seats apiece. I realize that I should be happy that I can still fit nicely in one of the seats but unfortunately it is getting to the point where much of America can't. Now with all of that said - the rules of baseball dictate in many instances the size of the budget making it limited to a certain extent. With respect to much in his life, JH has very few budgetary constraints. I'm not jealous because life is good and I appreciate what he has done with the team. I'm just not sure that I like him much.

[Kimmi]

But he basically did nothing of any note after signing Eovaldi and Pearce very early on.

 

I don't think there was much else to be done. The team looked very good, on paper.

 

I do agree that he should have been continually looking to add inexpensive pitching depth, both starter and reliever.

[Bellhorn04]

Yeah, he kind of is though. Smeared might be a bit strong, but the impression that we are getting of the way Dombrowski ran the FO is not a pleasant one.

 

But where is the info coming from, and how much of it is reading between the lines stuff?

 

Furthermore what if it's just the plain truth?

[a700hitter]

Let me smear DD -- 3 consecutive Division Titles (never been done by the Red Sox) and a World Series and one .500 + flop. To the gallows with him.

 

Maybe they will name LaRussa GM who will fire Cora and hire Matheny as manager.

[cp176]

Cutting up the jerseys was flat out childish and wrong, no matter the circumstances.

 

childish yes I agree but wrong no matter the circumstances? Did you know something that the rest of us didn't. I'm not on the high ground looking down. Judging this man because of that particular incident is what is wrong.

[cp176]

Let me smear DD -- 3 consecutive Division Titles (never been done by the Red Sox) and a World Series and one .500 + flop. To the gallows with him.

 

Maybe they will name LaRussa GM who will fire Cora and hire Matheny as manager.

 

 

I think I need you here.

[moonslav59]

childish yes I agree but wrong no matter the circumstances? Did you know something that the rest of us didn't. I'm not on the high ground looking down. Judging this man because of that particular incident is what is wrong.

 

I thought it was funny, at the time.

 

I still do.

 

You all know how I like Sale.

[cp176]

I thought it was funny, at the time.

 

I still do.

 

You all know how I like Sale.

 

I'll admit that at the time of the incident I was not impressed but after learning a little more about the situation my thoughts became a little more neutral. After watching him compete in Boston, I think that there is a lot more to this story than I ever knew. Placing a gifted highly competitive athlete in a lousy situation can lead to all sorts of bad things. i am very hesitant to judge a person before I get to know them or at least in Sale's case see him in action. I am so very happy that we have him on our team. he looks like everything an athlete should be.

[Bellhorn04]

I think I need you here.

 

If DD got fired based on the 2019 results alone, that would be wrong and would make no sense.

 

For me, trying to figure out exactly why he did get fired is just something to talk about here, something to pass the time. Seriously.

 

There's nothing any of us can do about any of this stuff.

 

I was a big fan of Epstein and Francona. They're gone. I'm a fan of Cora. He'll be gone someday too.

[moonslav59]

I'll admit that at the time of the incident I was not impressed but after learning a little more about the situation my thoughts became a little more neutral. After watching him compete in Boston, I think that there is a lot more to this story than I ever knew. Placing a gifted highly competitive athlete in a lousy situation can lead to all sorts of bad things. i am very hesitant to judge a person before I get to know them or at least in Sale's case see him in action. I am so very happy that we have him on our team. he looks like everything an athlete should be.

 

I couldn't agree more.

 

BTW, those uniforms he cut up were clown suits. He had the balls to expose them for what they were. Couple that with what was going on at that time, it's totally understandable what he did, whether you agree or not.

 

The guy is a fierce competitor, and for people to be righting him off so quickly and slamming the contract extension before it has even kicked in are likely to be eating crow.

[Kimmi]

But where is the info coming from, and how much of it is reading between the lines stuff?

 

Furthermore what if it's just the plain truth?

 

I don't know where the info is coming from, and some of it is speculation, for sure. Even if it is the truth, that's the type of thing the FO should keep a lid on. Regardless of any of that, do you ever hear the FO come out and publicly refute what the media has said?

 

I know the media tends to blow these things out of proportion, but I also can't overlook the pattern of bad press that follows when some of our players, managers, and GMs leave the team.

[Kimmi]

Let me smear DD -- 3 consecutive Division Titles (never been done by the Red Sox) and a World Series and one .500 + flop. To the gallows with him.

 

Maybe they will name LaRussa GM who will fire Cora and hire Matheny as manager.

 

And maybe LaRussa will hire Dombrowski back as his right hand man.

[Kimmi]

I couldn't agree more.

 

BTW, those uniforms he cut up were clown suits. He had the balls to expose them for what they were. Couple that with what was going on at that time, it's totally understandable what he did, whether you agree or not.

 

The guy is a fierce competitor, and for people to be righting him off so quickly and slamming the contract extension before it has even kicked in are likely to be eating crow.

 

There is no defense for cutting up the uniforms. It was childish and wrong, regardless of the circumstances. That's the way a 5-year old would react, very tantrum like.

 

If you were an employer and you printed up t-shirts for all your employees for some special event, then one of your employees decided that he didn't like them and didn't want to wear them, so he cut them all up, would that fly? No way in hell. Don't excuse Sale because he's an athlete that we love and admire.

 

I am not trying to take away anything from Sale as a player, a pitcher, or a competitor. I love Sale and what he brings to the team both on and off the field. But in that incident, he had a lapse of judgment. He was wrong. It happens to the best of us.

[Kimmi]

I couldn't agree more.

 

BTW, those uniforms he cut up were clown suits. He had the balls to expose them for what they were. Couple that with what was going on at that time, it's totally understandable what he did, whether you agree or not.

 

The guy is a fierce competitor, and for people to be righting him off so quickly and slamming the contract extension before it has even kicked in are likely to be eating crow.

 

Also, I have neither written him off, nor have I slammed the contract extension. In fact, I have repeatedly defended both Sale and the extension, though I have said from the beginning that the extension is too long.

 

I am one who believes our team will look much the same next year and will be a contender, meaning I believe in Sale, Price, and Eovaldi.

[Bellhorn04]

I know the media tends to blow these things out of proportion, but I also can't overlook the pattern of bad press that follows when some of our players, managers, and GMs leave the team.

 

I don't disagree.

 

But the relationship between the Boston media and the Red Sox has always been kind of a nasty one, with a lot of dirt-digging, going back to the days of Ted Williams.

[oldtimer]

Also, I have neither written him off, nor have I slammed the contract extension. In fact, I have repeatedly defended both Sale and the extension, though I have said from the beginning that the extension is too long.

 

I am one who believes our team will look much the same next year and will be a contender, meaning I believe in Sale, Price, and Eovaldi.

 

Just back from Budapest following a nice Danube cruise and catching up on the happenings. All I have seen so far is the firing of an assistant hitting coach. It is really difficult to assess the likelihood of major changes for next year until a new general manager is named and until some statement of direction is made (if the Sox choose to do that). I would think Sale, Price and Eovaldi are all moderate to high risk players going forward. With that in mind, I would think a reset is coming for 2020. A reset means dealing with Moreland, Holt, Bradley, Leon and Betts. It will also be affected by what jdm chooses to do.

 

The sooner the Sox take care of the GM naming and the establishment of a game plan the better. Things left undone will wind up done anyway, but maybe not to our liking.

[a700hitter]

And maybe LaRussa will hire Dombrowski back as his right hand man.

I like the role reversal, and bring back Ben for coffee duty.

[Kimmi]

Just back from Budapest following a nice Danube cruise and catching up on the happenings. All I have seen so far is the firing of an assistant hitting coach. It is really difficult to assess the likelihood of major changes for next year until a new general manager is named and until some statement of direction is made (if the Sox choose to do that). I would think Sale, Price and Eovaldi are all moderate to high risk players going forward. With that in mind, I would think a reset is coming for 2020. A reset means dealing with Moreland, Holt, Bradley, Leon and Betts. It will also be affected by what jdm chooses to do.

 

The sooner the Sox take care of the GM naming and the establishment of a game plan the better. Things left undone will wind up done anyway, but maybe not to our liking.

 

First off, good for you for taking what sounds like an awesome vacation! I hope you had a great time!

 

To be honest, I really have know idea what direction the FO is going to take. I know that that they are looking to reset, but I'm not sure how possible that will be, while at the same time keeping the team competitive. And I just can't see Henry allowing the GM to put a non-competitive team on the field. This is why I don't see a lot of changes coming about. The Sox don't seem to be in any hurry to hire a new GM.

 

I'm optimistic about our starting pitchers returning to form next season. This year, IMO, was very fluky.

[Kimmi]

I like the role reversal, and bring back Ben for coffee duty.

 

Ben the Coffee Boy is doing a very good job of building up the Jays' farm system. We should be so lucky.

[notin]

Ben the Coffee Boy is doing a very good job of building up the Jays' farm system. We should be so lucky.

 

He’s using the age-old trick “Draft the kids of stars.”

 

Such an obvious move, yet so few teams try it with such frequency...

[Bellhorn04]

Ben the Coffee Boy is doing a very good job of building up the Jays' farm system. We should be so lucky.

 

While Ben's been doing this, the MLB team has been in semi-tank mode:

 

2016 89-73

(Ben hired in Sept/16)

2017 76-86

2018 73-89

2019 67-95

 

We'll see if and when it all pays off.

[Bellhorn04]

He’s using the age-old trick “Draft the kids of stars.”

 

Such an obvious move, yet so few teams try it with such frequency...

 

He needs some kids of star pitchers now.

[oldtimer]

First off, good for you for taking what sounds like an awesome vacation! I hope you had a great time!

 

To be honest, I really have know idea what direction the FO is going to take. I know that that they are looking to reset, but I'm not sure how possible that will be, while at the same time keeping the team competitive. And I just can't see Henry allowing the GM to put a non-competitive team on the field. This is why I don't see a lot of changes coming about. The Sox don't seem to be in any hurry to hire a new GM.

 

I'm optimistic about our starting pitchers returning to form next season. This year, IMO, was very fluky.

 

the trip was on a Viking ship and they do a great job. Good food and drink and just enough fellow passengers.

 

I'm not as optimistic about our three high salaried pitchers going forward. I expect their quality to be about like this year, with limited innings and era's in the 4.5 region. I would like the team to remain as competitive as possible in 2020 while going for the reset. To me that means holding onto our best players who can be around in 2021 as well, and revitalizing the team but bringing up our best low cost propects and see where that lands us mid year.