Fire alex cora

[notin]

Do you remember the '14 games and counting' thread? That was in 2007. Someone went through all the game logs and with perfect 20/20 hindsight found 14 losses with moves or non-moves by Tito that may have cost that particular game. It was a classic.

 

Do you remember Bigfoot on BDC? He was actively ripping Theo (or “Guitar Boy,” as he called him) for destroying the Red Sox during the World Series!!!

[Bellhorn04]

Do you remember Bigfoot on BDC? He was actively ripping Theo (or “Guitar Boy,” as he called him) for destroying the Red Sox during the World Series!!!

 

I don't remember Bigfoot. I remember 'Law' (not Softlaw), and his 'Theo chicks' routine.

[notin]

I don't remember Bigfoot. I remember 'Law' (not Softlaw), and his 'Theo chicks' routine.

 

PumpsieGreen was another one who questioned everything and had all the answers. He’s over ruining the freeforums board now. Once on that board, he ripped Farrell for not bringing in Barnes and costing the Sox a game. Farrell later had a press conference and said Barnes was overworked and unavailable. Pumpsie refused to admit Farrell might know something about this and absolutely insisted Barnes was available. Absolute classic...

[Bellhorn04]

PumpsieGreen was another one who questioned everything and had all the answers. He’s over ruining the freeforums board now. Once on that board, he ripped Farrell for not bringing in Barnes and costing the Sox a game. Farrell later had a press conference and said Barnes was overworked and unavailable. Pumpsie refused to admit Farrell might know something about this and absolutely insisted Barnes was available. Absolute classic...

 

You should have seen Sawxheads. That was the ultimate message board horror show. It was an all-out war between the pro-Epstein/pro-Tito faction and the anti-Epstein/anti-Tito faction, which included PumpsieGreen, SeaBeachFred and Muggah.

[notin]

I made an account at Sauxheads but never made a single post. I typically limit my activity to one message board at a time.

 

That both PG and SBF post there isn’t selling me on that board...

[dgalehouse]

Do you remember Bigfoot on BDC? He was actively ripping Theo (or “Guitar Boy,” as he called him) for destroying the Red Sox during the World Series!!!

 

Maybe someday they will say , " Remember that guy Notin on TalkSox , and how he got Dombrowski fired ? "

[notin]

Maybe someday they will say , " Remember that guy Notin on TalkSox , and how he got Dombrowski fired ? "

 

That already started. See Post #7 of the thread below.

 

 

https://www.talksox.com/forum/threads/19511-Red-Sox-have-fired-GM-Dave-Dombrowski

[sk7326]

Tito is the best, though he and Williams are close and completely different.

 

Williams' style was of its time and much less prone to last. In that way he was like Billy Martin - great baseball mind who could get immediate improvement out of a team ... but could wear out his welcome very quickly.

 

Tito had 8 years in Boston and now 7 seasons in Cleveland - and I think Boston's moves since his ouster show that the lack of organizational stability certainly wasn't Tito's fault.

 

Cora was the best managerial prospect in the league when the Red Sox hired him. He has proven them mostly correct - be he is still a 2nd year big league manager. So the jury is out at least a little bit. But he did help steer the greatest Red Sox team of all time, and he can't be held particularly responsible for the injuries and underperformance of the starters - a deficiency which directly impacted the bullpen. Everybody has to do better, and he is certainly not exempt from that.

[Elktonnick]

Tito is the best, though he and Williams are close and completely different.

 

Williams' style was of its time and much less prone to last. In that way he was like Billy Martin - great baseball mind who could get immediate improvement out of a team ... but could wear out his welcome very quickly.

 

Tito had 8 years in Boston and now 7 seasons in Cleveland - and I think Boston's moves since his ouster show that the lack of organizational stability certainly wasn't Tito's fault.

 

Cora was the best managerial prospect in the league when the Red Sox hired him. He has proven them mostly correct - be he is still a 2nd year big league manager. So the jury is out at least a little bit. But he did help steer the greatest Red Sox team of all time, and he can't be held particularly responsible for the injuries and underperformance of the starters - a deficiency which directly impacted the bullpen. Everybody has to do better, and he is certainly not exempt from that.

 

Tito is probably in the top twenty of all time best managers in baseball. I saw a recent survey of the top ten best all time managers in baseball history, while Tito didn't make the cut he was cited as an honorable mention. It did note that if he continued to manage he could very shortly be included in among the best all time. He certainly will be a hall of famer one day.

 

The only thing keeping Tito from managing for another five years may be his age and health. The trend is to see younger managers. This trend may ironically keep a great many of todays younger managers from accumulating the same number years managing as the great one of years past.

 

I thing it is premature to anoint Cora among the likes of Terry Francona or Dick Williams. He may one day make it among the top two or three Red Sox managers but the real test of a manager isn't how he manages an extremely talented team but rather how he manages a team with less talent or one beset by injuries. In that regard that's why I must tip my hat to Aaron Boone who has done an exceptional job managing this year's Yankees. And I despise the Yankees.

[cp176]

Tito is the best, though he and Williams are close and completely different.

 

Williams' style was of its time and much less prone to last. In that way he was like Billy Martin - great baseball mind who could get immediate improvement out of a team ... but could wear out his welcome very quickly.

 

Tito had 8 years in Boston and now 7 seasons in Cleveland - and I think Boston's moves since his ouster show that the lack of organizational stability certainly wasn't Tito's fault.

 

Cora was the best managerial prospect in the league when the Red Sox hired him. He has proven them mostly correct - be he is still a 2nd year big league manager. So the jury is out at least a little bit. But he did help steer the greatest Red Sox team of all time, and he can't be held particularly responsible for the injuries and underperformance of the starters - a deficiency which directly impacted the bullpen. Everybody has to do better, and he is certainly not exempt from that.

 

This is a sensible and imo an accurate post.

Times have changed for sure. Tito first of course - Williams second - I think I need to see Cora a little longer before he gets close to the bronze. Last year of course was wonderful and magical but the talent level was just incredible as well. i lived through '67 and no one - repeat no one - believed that the Red Sox could put together a season like they did. you could make a pretty good argument suggesting that last year's Red Sox were stronger than the 67 team in every position on the field other left field and maybe first base. When Cora wins while facing some real adversity, i could easily change my opinion. he loses more points with me because of this year as opposed to the ones he gained last year.

[cp176]

Yes, I figured you'd reply and disagree, since you are so anti-progressive (LOL).

 

Dick Williams did a great job in '67, and I have him 3rd on my list. We need more time to judge Cora, but I like his approach, and I find myself disagree with less of his decisions than others. I really liked Tito for a long time, but he lost control of the team. I realize he had side issues going on, and one could argue Cora has of is "losing" this team, but in my opinion, Cora is the best, but it's close.

 

 

I am a very progressive person in fact. it just amazes me how certain words today carry with them different meanings than they ever had before!

[fxkatt]

I am a very progressive person in fact. it just amazes me how certain words today carry with them different meanings than they ever had before!

 

The older one gets, the truer this seems to be. Or maybe it's just this perverse internet era where all the good words seem to get obfuscated or reversed. (advertising seems to push this process, too)

[moonslav59]

I am a very progressive person in fact. it just amazes me how certain words today carry with them different meanings than they ever had before!

 

Progressive= robo umps & launch angles, no?

 

[notin]

Progressive= robo umps & launch angles, no?

 

 

Only if we are launching the robot umps.

 

Seriously, does the world need a cyborg Angel Hernandez with superhuman strength?

[Bellhorn04]

Progressive= robo umps & launch angles, no?

 

 

I think there's a difference between being progressive socially and being progressive technologically.

[sk7326]

This is a sensible and imo an accurate post.

Times have changed for sure. Tito first of course - Williams second - I think I need to see Cora a little longer before he gets close to the bronze. Last year of course was wonderful and magical but the talent level was just incredible as well. i lived through '67 and no one - repeat no one - believed that the Red Sox could put together a season like they did. you could make a pretty good argument suggesting that last year's Red Sox were stronger than the 67 team in every position on the field other left field and maybe first base. When Cora wins while facing some real adversity, i could easily change my opinion. he loses more points with me because of this year as opposed to the ones he gained last year.

 

I have been a fan since 1985-6 or so - ranking the Red Sox managers

 

Terry Francona

Jimy Williams

Joe Morgan

Alex Cora

John Farrell

Grady Little

Kevin Kennedy

John McNamara

Butch Hobson

Bobby Valentine

Joe Kerrigan

[sk7326]

Tito is probably in the top twenty of all time best managers in baseball. I saw a recent survey of the top ten best all time managers in baseball history, while Tito didn't make the cut he was cited as an honorable mention. It did note that if he continued to manage he could very shortly be included in among the best all time. He certainly will be a hall of famer one day.

 

The only thing keeping Tito from managing for another five years may be his age and health. The trend is to see younger managers. This trend may ironically keep a great many of todays younger managers from accumulating the same number years managing as the great one of years past.

 

I thing it is premature to anoint Cora among the likes of Terry Francona or Dick Williams. He may one day make it among the top two or three Red Sox managers but the real test of a manager isn't how he manages an extremely talented team but rather how he manages a team with less talent or one beset by injuries. In that regard that's why I must tip my hat to Aaron Boone who has done an exceptional job managing this year's Yankees. And I despise the Yankees.

 

The Yankees won 100 games last year - they are not untalented. Now one thing the Yankees organizationally have done well - something Cashman deserves credit for (go figure that Cashman has lasted longer as GM than the last four Red Sox GMs combined during the same time frame) is be able to get right tailed production from DJ LeMaheiu types - guys who had "utility/extra guy" sort of reputations. Of course, with the arena baseball being used now, I don't understand anything anymore.

[oldtimer]

I have been a fan since 1985-6 or so - ranking the Red Sox managers

 

Terry Francona

Jimy Williams

Joe Morgan

Alex Cora

John Farrell

Grady Little

Kevin Kennedy

John McNamara

Butch Hobson

Bobby Valentine

Joe Kerrigan

 

Cora is so new that I would be reluctant to rate him until a few years pass, assuming he will get to stay that long. I'll be interested in how he and the new GM interface and also whether Cora will be willing to let go of underperforming players and/or coaches. Some guys want to be liked while some want to be respected. Hard to be both when your dealing with peoples professions.

[fxkatt]

ARENA BASEBALL. 2019 has already passed the highest MLB homer total of 2017 of 6105, and there are about 15 games yet to play.

 

In 1927, the year Babe hit 60, there were 922 homers in the MLB

 

And no baseball on Fridays.... that's Bush League... and what about my sports fix.

Edited September 14, 2019 by fxkatt

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Off Topic:

 

I just saw while watching the Dodgers/Mets game that C. Kershaw is 116-1 when the Dodgers score 4 runs for him. I thought this was worth posting.

[moonslav59]

Off Topic:

 

I just saw while watching the Dodgers/Mets game that C. Kershaw is 116-1 when the Dodgers score 4 runs for him. I thought this was worth posting.

 

Sale is undefeated when we score more runs than the other teams.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Sale is undefeated when we score more runs than the other teams.

 

Sale is also undefeated when he doesn't pitch, which has become a habit over the last couple seasons.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

oops

[moonslav59]

Sale is also undefeated when he doesn't pitch, which has become a habit over the last couple seasons.

 

Not only Undefeated, but unscored upon!

 

Also, an interesting factoid:

 

IP since 2016

746 Sale

644 Kershaw

 

Since 2017

520 Sale

495 Kershaw

 

Since 2018

320 Kershaw

305 Sale

[fxkatt]

Off Topic:

 

I just saw while watching the Dodgers/Mets game that C. Kershaw is 116-1 when the Dodgers score 4 runs for him. I thought this was worth posting.

 

Independent of any comparisons, this is a truly unbelievable stat.

 

[notin]

Off Topic:

 

I just saw while watching the Dodgers/Mets game that C. Kershaw is 116-1 when the Dodgers score 4 runs for him. I thought this was worth posting.

 

And somewhere out there on the Internet, SBF is complaining about how Dave Roberts cost him that one...

[Bellhorn04]

Off Topic:

 

I just saw while watching the Dodgers/Mets game that C. Kershaw is 116-1 when the Dodgers score 4 runs for him. I thought this was worth posting.

 

That's impressive. But in the postseason things have been different. He has lost a number of games where the Dodgers scored 4 or more. Including Game 1 of last year's World Series.

[cp176]

Progressive= robo umps & launch angles, no?

 

 

think it might depend on what the individual thinks is progressive. is it possible you think for a person to disagree with some new ideas that don't necessarily seem progressive to them? I think so. some of the things I see being pushed as progressive I think many believe to be silly.

[a700hitter]

Cora is so new that I would be reluctant to rate him until a few years pass, assuming he will get to stay that long. I'll be interested in how he and the new GM interface and also whether Cora will be willing to let go of underperforming players and/or coaches. Some guys want to be liked while some want to be respected. Hard to be both when your dealing with peoples professions.

The team didn’t play with any sense of urgency this season. I think there was a lot of complacency and that sits at Cora’s feet. He played into the complacency with his coddling and resting throughout the season. At some point, he needed to press down on the gas pedal and inspire the players. The players are too comfortable with Cora. It’s time to move on.

[TylerD]

I have been a fan since 1985-6 or so - ranking the Red Sox managers

 

Terry Francona

Jimy Williams

Joe Morgan

Alex Cora

John Farrell

Grady Little

Kevin Kennedy

John McNamara

Butch Hobson

Bobby Valentine

Joe Kerrigan

 

 

Too hard for me to judge Cora yet. See what he does next year. Brilliant season last year and not so great this year. Granted the pitching was fantastic last year and horrible this year. Not really Coras fault Sale, Price and Porcello sucked and Eovaldi was hurt. Just a weird season. I am very curious to see how he rebounds next season and see what he does.