Sox hitting??

[cp176]

and there you have it - got to be Larry all the way. it has been said.

 

Bad = Larry

Good = Ben

 

We all get it don't we?

[Maxbialystock]

Lousy year for Betts: his OPS has plummeted from .897 in 2016 to .780 this year, a near catastrophe. Can't hit the slider away.

 

With 20 games to go he leads the team in rbi's, runs, total bases, doubles, and stolen bases. Some people think he's not too shabby in RF either.

[Bellhorn04]

Lousy year for Betts: his OPS has plummeted from .897 in 2016 to .780 this year, a near catastrophe. Can't hit the slider away.

 

With 20 games to go he leads the team in rbi's, runs, total bases, doubles, and stolen bases. Some people think he's not too shabby in RF either.

 

I think Betts will figure it out with all the sliders away. I think he's a special player.

[Maxbialystock]

I think Betts will figure it out with all the sliders away. I think he's a special player.

 

Me too.

[Emp9]

Lousy year for Betts: his OPS has plummeted from .897 in 2016 to .780 this year, a near catastrophe. Can't hit the slider away.

 

With 20 games to go he leads the team in rbi's, runs, total bases, doubles, and stolen bases. Some people think he's not too shabby in RF either.

 

Can't lay off the slider away either.

[Maxbialystock]

Can't lay off the slider away either.

 

Exactly--in fact, that's the worst part of those sliders.

[Emp9]

Exactly--in fact, that's the worst part of those sliders.

 

If it's close w/ 2 strikes, I'm fine with it. If it's how he got those 2 strikes, I'm not fine with it.

[tom-uk]

Somewhere in a crypt in NC, Softlaw is getting tired of rolling over every time no-pop Lowrie has hit one of his 43 doubles.

 

The biggest surprise of those mentioned has to be Reddick. He has put up 17 WAR in his 6 seasons since leaving.

 

Lackey and Lester have both aged well.

 

CC and Ellsbury did not live up to what Dave Cameron wrote about speed players ageing well.

Edited September 10, 2017 by tom-uk

[moonslav59]

Lousy year for Betts: his OPS has plummeted from .897 in 2016 to .780 this year, a near catastrophe. Can't hit the slider away.

 

With 20 games to go he leads the team in rbi's, runs, total bases, doubles, and stolen bases. Some people think he's not too shabby in RF either.

 

Not just Mookie seeing a major decline in OPS...

(115+ PAs)

 

-211 .845 Leon .634

-208 .705 Holt .497

-135 .850 Young .715

-117 .897 Betts .780

-109 .866 HRam .757

-79 .835 JBJ .756

-75 .802 Bogey .727

-45 .835 Beni .790

-34 .825 Pedey .791

 

+154 .585 Vaz .739

 

Then there's this...

 

1.021 Papi >> .767 Moreland

.726 Shaw >> .896 Devers/ .885 Nunez (Pablo & Co earlier)

 

5 of our top returning players by most PAs have declined by more than 100 points (2 by over 200)

7 out of 10 have declined by 75 or more points!

9 out of 10 have declined by 34 or more points!

 

[Nick]

If I'm starting pitcher, I don't want Holt in my lineup. I'll bat for myself.

[devildavid]

Lousy year for Betts: his OPS has plummeted from .897 in 2016 to .780 this year, a near catastrophe. Can't hit the slider away.

 

With 20 games to go he leads the team in rbi's, runs, total bases, doubles, and stolen bases. Some people think he's not too shabby in RF either.

 

Mookie has so far had a mediocre 2nd half hitting. He also leads the team in plate appearances. He is a good player but he has not done much to help the offense since the end of June.

[moonslav59]

If I'm starting pitcher, I don't want Holt in my lineup. I'll bat for myself.

 

Post of the day

[moonslav59]

If I'm starting pitcher, I don't want Holt in my lineup. I'll bat for myself.

 

Do the rules allow for a pitcher hitting and using the DH for your 2Bman?

[SoxHop]

Oh for f***s sake....... Holt is horrible this year after a major concussion. Last year he was servicable and could hold his own in most positions. He was also electric and can get things started. He had some major messups, but also some amazing plays not many othe subs would make. And he was a hard out at the plate.....

 

As a manager... you have to see what these people have, you have to play them. It's hard with subs cause you they don't get much playing time......... so you have to keep going with them until it's exausted..............

 

you guys might as well start crapping on the bat boy.......... it would make more sense...

[oldtimer]

If you went up and down the Sox lineup to identify our best hitters to the so so ones and then those who are hardly ML level, how would you score them. Not by batting average or OPS, but what you can see they are capable of with some consistency in the second half.

 

To me it is as follow:

 

1. Nunez

2. Pedey

 

Significant drop off

 

3. Beni

4. Devers

 

Small drop off

 

5.Betts

6. Vaz

7. Moreland

 

Another small drop off

 

8 Rameriz

9 Bradley

10 Travis

11. Lin

12. Bogaerts

 

Still lower

 

13. Leon

14. Marrero

15. Holt

16. Young

 

Of these, the ones with redeeming defensive qualities include Bradley, Travis (rookie), Lin (rookie), Bogaerts (possibly could be able to make adjustments, but needs an overhaul at the plate), Leon (always can use a good defensive catcher) I would keep outright or in some cases attempt to trade for better.

[Nick]

Oh for f***s sake....... Holt is horrible this year after a major concussion. Last year he was servicable and could hold his own in most positions. He was also electric and can get things started. He had some major messups, but also some amazing plays not many othe subs would make. And he was a hard out at the plate.....

 

As a manager... you have to see what these people have, you have to play them. It's hard with subs cause you they don't get much playing time......... so you have to keep going with them until it's exausted..............

 

you guys might as well start crapping on the bat boy.......... it would make more sense...

 

Each to his own. Holt sucks. His production has steadily declined over last 2 1/2 years. His OPS is below .500. I'd find someone else to defend. This is JF's weakness. You don't think Porcello would want Nunez at 2B over Holt?

 

You complain about our offense and defend someone hitting below .500? This is baseball forum. Not what a nice guy he is forum.

Edited September 11, 2017 by Nick

[Bellhorn04]

Oh for f***s sake....... Holt is horrible this year after a major concussion. Last year he was servicable and could hold his own in most positions. He was also electric and can get things started. He had some major messups, but also some amazing plays not many othe subs would make. And he was a hard out at the plate.....

 

As a manager... you have to see what these people have, you have to play them. It's hard with subs cause you they don't get much playing time......... so you have to keep going with them until it's exausted..............

 

you guys might as well start crapping on the bat boy.......... it would make more sense...

 

Post of the night.

[moonslav59]

The bat boy has cost us at least 5-10 games!

[Slasher9]

somewhere in a crypt in nc, softlaw is getting tired of rolling over every time no-pop lowrie has hit one of his 43 doubles.

 

.

 

lol.

[Spudboy]

Oh for f***s sake....... Holt is horrible this year after a major concussion. Last year he was servicable and could hold his own in most positions. He was also electric and can get things started. He had some major messups, but also some amazing plays not many othe subs would make. And he was a hard out at the plate.....

 

As a manager... you have to see what these people have, you have to play them. It's hard with subs cause you they don't get much playing time......... so you have to keep going with them until it's exausted..............

 

you guys might as well start crapping on the bat boy.......... it would make more sense...

 

Excellent f***ing post.

 

Talksox members have a selective memory.

[Spudboy]

The bat boy has cost us at least 5-10 games!

 

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!1!!!

 

All without committing any bonehead moves, either!

[moonslav59]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!1!!!

 

All without committing any bonehead moves, either!

 

The reason we have so few homers is because the bat boy thought JF told him to put a fork in the bats not cork!

[SoxnCycles]

and there you have it - got to be Larry all the way. it has been said.

 

Bad = Larry

Good = Ben

 

We all get it don't we?

 

So, everyone's opinion here is valid, except for a select few?

Yeah, we've got it alright...

[oldtimer]

Xander the Enigma

 

Xander is listed at 6'1" 210# and is a young but experienced player just turning 25 Oct 1st. He is athletic and has good speed. He is not a flashy fielder but okay at short. He will always be mid pack or below in that regard. To me though he is an enigma at the plate.

 

Looking at a few statistics, including this incomplete year and not putting in his very limited year of 2013, will give one an idea of inconsistency, not explained by injury or pitchers finding the holy grail against him, but a series of ups and downs. Note that I have put a (1) after the year to designate pre-all star break figures and a (2) for post all star break

 

BA RBI OPS HR

2014 (1) 235 22 658 6

2014(2) 248 24 661 6

2015 (1) 304 43 750 3

2015 (2) 337 38 803 4

2016 (1) 329 56 863 10

2016 (2) 253 33 729 11

2017 (1) 303 41 806 6

2017 (2) 200 12 573 2

 

In both 2016 and 2017 he has shown a steep drop off in his hitting and in this year precipitous. Hard to figure since one would expect a player gaining his experience would actually be able to avoid late season slumps. Also a person of his size would provide more power. He certainly hasn't earned a big raise going forward and it is hard to know what to do with a soon to be 25 year old who is otherwise a good yooung man who may still have some upside.

 

As a minimum, I would say he should get a new hitting coach and go over the fundamentals of his plate mechanics going forward, and work on those things this off season. If he can't find a way out of these funks he gets into then I suggest that is time to trade him and look for someone who can be more productive. I wouldn't do that until the trade deadline next year and see if he can improve himself and realize the gifts that he seems to have.

[moonslav59]

Xander the Enigma

 

Xander is listed at 6'1" 210# and is a young but experienced player just turning 25 Oct 1st. He is athletic and has good speed. He is not a flashy fielder but okay at short. He will always be mid pack or below in that regard. To me though he is an enigma at the plate.

 

Looking at a few statistics, including this incomplete year and not putting in his very limited year of 2013, will give one an idea of inconsistency, not explained by injury or pitchers finding the holy grail against him, but a series of ups and downs. Note that I have put a (1) after the year to designate pre-all star break figures and a (2) for post all star break

 

BA RBI OPS HR

2014 (1) 235 22 658 6

2014(2) 248 24 661 6

2015 (1) 304 43 750 3

2015 (2) 337 38 803 4

2016 (1) 329 56 863 10

2016 (2) 253 33 729 11

2017 (1) 303 41 806 6

2017 (2) 200 12 573 2

 

In both 2016 and 2017 he has shown a steep drop off in his hitting and in this year precipitous. Hard to figure since one would expect a player gaining his experience would actually be able to avoid late season slumps. Also a person of his size would provide more power. He certainly hasn't earned a big raise going forward and it is hard to know what to do with a soon to be 25 year old who is otherwise a good yooung man who may still have some upside.

 

As a minimum, I would say he should get a new hitting coach and go over the fundamentals of his plate mechanics going forward, and work on those things this off season. If he can't find a way out of these funks he gets into then I suggest that is time to trade him and look for someone who can be more productive. I wouldn't do that until the trade deadline next year and see if he can improve himself and realize the gifts that he seems to have.

 

Add to that enigma these numbers:

 

2014: -3.7 UZR/150 & -9 DRS

2015: +0.9 UZR.150 & -1 DRS (Showed marked improvement on defense)

 

2016: -2.9 UZR/150 & -10 DRS

2017: -1.3 UZR.150 & -12 DRS and counting

 

Not only has Bogey failed to continue the progress he showed from 2014 to 2015, he's gotten much worse on defense.

 

[Larry Cook]

Add to that enigma these numbers:

 

2014: -3.7 UZR/150 & -9 DRS

2015: +0.9 UZR.150 & -1 DRS (Showed marked improvement on defense)

 

2016: -2.9 UZR/150 & -10 DRS

2017: -1.3 UZR.150 & -12 DRS and counting

 

Not only has Bogey failed to continue the progress he showed from 2014 to 2015, he's gotten much worse on defense.

 

 

Would we better off moving bogey to third and devers to first and signing cozart to play shortstop?

[mvp 78]

Would we better off moving bogey to third and devers to first and signing cozart to play shortstop?

 

No, primarily becaue Cozart is a 32 year old guy with a substantial injury history having a career year. Signing him would be a dumb move imo.

[moonslav59]

Would we better off moving bogey to third and devers to first and signing cozart to play shortstop?

 

No.

[Nick]

Would we better off moving bogey to third and devers to first and signing cozart to play shortstop?

 

We need power. Why put a singles hitter at 3B. Attractiveness of Xander at SS was that he would be one of better power guys (eventually) playing ss. I sure hell as don't want him at 3B with his production.

[mvp 78]

They will only sign Cozart if they trade Xander beforehand.