Rusney Castillo

[moonslav59]

I have a question. Not sure it was asked yet....

Like Allen Craig, Castillo has cleared waivers and can be taken off the 40 man roster. If he is in AAA a certain amount of days does his paycheck count on the MLB payroll?

I was of the understanding that Craigs $$ is obviously paid to him but doesnt count on the MLB payroll...

Does anyone know 100% for sure either way or even if there is a rule for this certain situation?

 

If your not on the 40 man roster, your salary does not count against the luxury tax.

 

If the Sox pay your salary to be on another team's 40 man roster, I believe that counts against the luxury limit, like when we paid the Dodgers $3-4M a year after the Gonzo/CC/Beckett dump.

[moonslav59]

I couldn't stand Lackey for exactly the reason stated. He'd be getting shelled on his own account, then one of the fielders would make an error and he'd start yelling at them. He always yelled at his fellow players.

 

I did read how the other players liked him, I have no idea why. In fact he was the player I have disliked the most on the Sox since I've been following.

 

I lost it watching the 2013 WS when Farrell came to take him out of the game and Lackey wouldn't stop yelling at Farrell.

 

Strange story....... A buddy of mine ran a bar where Lackey came into for a few nights. He said he was fairly shy around women and had no confidence. One night Lackey kept asking my buddy if he thought a gal at the bar might be interested in him and should he take a chance. My buddy was like "dude, you are a major league pitcher, of course so".

 

I read somewhere that Lackey was not actually yelling at his players behind him for not making plays. He was yelling at himself, and his teammates understood this and has no issues with his antics.

 

From the TV screen it looked like he was a douche, but in reality maybe he wasn't.

[Kimmi]

Pablo isn't a bad person, the hatred for him is mainly due to his performance and work ethic, or at least his eating habits.

 

Lackey is actually a douche, I've heard from numerous people who've met him he is a douche, and just the way he acts he's always come off as one to me as well, similar to Papelbon. Lackey used to yell at his teammates after errors and not in a "good" way, but in a "you f***ing suck" way. Which I didn't like at all, you don't do stuff like that. I don't think Pablo/Lackey are really comparable as people. But what it comes down to for both guys is performance. If a guy isn't performing, especially while being paid a lot, they aren't going to be very well liked by that fanbase.

 

Edit: This is a good article describing why he is a douche and why people disliked him.

 

http://www.overthemonster.com/2013/11/4/5065214/john-lackey-red-sox-hero-a-revisionist-history

 

I have always heard his teammates sticking up for him and not being bothered by his antics on the field. They have said that he's a good teammate and clubhouse guy. I've heard many sportswriters give their opinions otherwise, but to me it seems like speculation based on his on field antics. As far as what he's like personally, I have no clue, but I won't assume the worst about him.

 

It's absolutely fair enough that people "hate" him based off of his performance during his first years here.

[Kimmi]

I read somewhere that Lackey was not actually yelling at his players behind him for not making plays. He was yelling at himself, and his teammates understood this and has no issues with his antics.

 

From the TV screen it looked like he was a douche, but in reality maybe he wasn't.

 

^^This.

[illinoisredsox]

I have always heard his teammates sticking up for him and not being bothered by his antics on the field. They have said that he's a good teammate and clubhouse guy. I've heard many sportswriters give their opinions otherwise, but to me it seems like speculation based on his on field antics. As far as what he's like personally, I have no clue, but I won't assume the worst about him.

 

It's absolutely fair enough that people "hate" him based off of his performance during his first years here.

 

Giving back to the Boston media what they (the media) dish out is a point in his favor, IMO.

[moonslav59]

Although this evidence may not be conclusive or objective, the Cardinals, known for clubhouse unity and harmony traded for Lackey.

 

Theo Epstien and Joe Maddon both knew Lackey very well and agreed to pay the aging pitcher $32M to play for the Cubs.

[Bellhorn04]

Although this evidence may not be conclusive or objective, the Cardinals, known for clubhouse unity and harmony traded for Lackey.

 

Theo Epstien and Joe Maddon both knew Lackey very well and agreed to pay the aging pitcher $32M to play for the Cubs.

 

All of which highlights the boneheaded blunders of the Sox FO letting him go.

[Kimmi]

Although this evidence may not be conclusive or objective, the Cardinals, known for clubhouse unity and harmony traded for Lackey.

 

Theo Epstien and Joe Maddon both knew Lackey very well and agreed to pay the aging pitcher $32M to play for the Cubs.

 

I always thought he got a bum rap. Personally, I like that type of fire and competitiveness in my starting pitchers.

[southpaw777]

If your not on the 40 man roster, your salary does not count against the luxury tax.

 

If the Sox pay your salary to be on another team's 40 man roster, I believe that counts against the luxury limit, like when we paid the Dodgers $3-4M a year after the Gonzo/CC/Beckett dump.

 

Ok, thank you.

I thought that was the case but wasnt sure.

[Slasher9]

I read somewhere that Lackey was not actually yelling at his players behind him for not making plays. He was yelling at himself, and his teammates understood this and has no issues with his antics.

 

From the TV screen it looked like he was a douche, but in reality maybe he wasn't.

 

disagree. he showed up his players constantly. why yell at yourself when (for ex) and outfielder drops a flyball? he's a douchebag.

[Dojji]

Some of the best ballplayers in the world were douchebags. Just saying, read a bio of Mickey Mantle sometime. Heck, Josh Beckett could be a complete ******* but nobody cared when he won us big games. Lackey got it bad here because he was an unproductive douchebag. People homed in on the douchebaggery but the real issue was the lack of production. He gets outs in any year other than 2013, the hate never happens.

[moonslav59]

disagree. he showed up his players constantly. why yell at yourself when (for ex) and outfielder drops a flyball? he's a douchebag.

 

Just saying what I read about Sox players not having any issues with his antics, because they knew he was really pissed at himself not them.

[moonslav59]

Back to Castillo. Here's a good read....

 

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/rob-bradford/2016/06/20/exploring-how-red-sox-got-point-rusney-castil

 

[southpaw777]

disagree. he showed up his players constantly. why yell at yourself when (for ex) and outfielder drops a flyball? he's a douchebag.

 

Maybe he was pissed he missed his location, or shook off his catcher when he shouldnt have....maybe he was just pissed at the situation, not a teammate? Guys know errors happen. Im sure he wasnt happy about it, but if he was indeed showing up his teammates then why do so many teammates and former ones talk so highly of him?

You can tell when someone doesnt like someone and is faking it...players genuinly like him...

I think hes standoffish with fans and the media which gives that impression of him....i doubt he treats his teammates like that.

[georom4]

Mooooooon!

[tom-uk]

Agreed! He must of bought the chicken and beer to get the praise of teammates, because on the field he showed up others often. Plus he was a sore loser, for example ripping Pedey's "barely enough" homer off him in the PO.

[royplayer]

So he is officially a bust, I guess.

 

I was vocally against signing him in the first place. I told this board that it made little sense to sign a guy you had never seen play in game action and who had not played in about one and a half seasons.

 

Let alone, he was too old to be a player under development at any price other than the minimum.

 

This is one of the dumbest moves of the Cherrinton era and there are some doozies to choose from.

 

I doubt that anyone claims him. Maybe the Sox eventually find a sucker to take him at half price and cut a deal.

 

Buy hey, it's not all bad. At least I know what quick twitch means.

 

Speaking of Cherington, in your opinion what was the worst move of the following that he made:

 

Signing Castillo

 

Signing Panda

 

Signing Hanley

 

Extending Porcello

[Spudboy]

Speaking of Cherington, in your opinion what was the worst move of the following that he made:

 

Signing Castillo

 

Signing Panda

 

Signing Hanley

 

Extending Porcello

 

In my opinion, blowing up a good rotation eclipsed all those deals. I have not heard one single person endorse trading Lester and Lackey away. Neither have I heard any decent explanation for why those moves were made. Yeah, the rumor that Lackey told the Sox he would not honor his contract by playing for the minimum exists as weak sauce.

 

I lump those two trades together for their cumulative idiocy. But either stands alone as indefensible.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Spudboy

[georom4]

Spot on - Don't forget wasting their highest draft pick in 20 years on Trey Ball. But blowing up their championship rotation and keeping only fragile Clay has to be the worst move by Cherington. DD also gets horns as well for exercising Clay's option for the year. I was keeping a tally of Clay's starts this season and I gave up at 2-6 and then he was benched.

[Spudboy]

Spot on - Don't forget wasting their highest draft pick in 20 years on Trey Ball. But blowing up their championship rotation and keeping only fragile Clay has to be the worst move by Cherington. DD also gets horns as well for exercising Clay's option for the year. I was keeping a tally of Clay's starts this season and I gave up at 2-6 and then he was benched.

 

Truthfully I was not thinking about Ball. But drafting is hit or miss so I give him some slack on that I guess.

 

On Talksox everyone seems to be in agreement that signing Buch to an extension was a "no brainer". It was a no brainer all right.

 

Fools Gold does not morph into Gold.

[Bellhorn04]

On Talksox everyone seems to be in agreement that signing Buch to an extension was a "no brainer". It was a no brainer all right.

 

I don't think that's really the case. I think a handful of people said it was a no brainer. Which gave rise to another handful making fun of the term no brainer.

 

The rest are mostly fence sitters like me. I think exercising his option was a coin toss, and they guessed the wrong side.

[User Name]

Pick and trade , keep Miley is what I said, but that would have turned out wrong too.

[Slasher9]

Clays fangraphs value will be north of 13mm by the time the season is done. Book it.

[a700hitter]

Clays fangraphs value will be north of 13mm by the time the season is done. Book it.

So much for the value of FG.

[moonslav59]

In my opinion, blowing up a good rotation eclipsed all those deals. I have not heard one single person endorse trading Lester and Lackey away. Neither have I heard any decent explanation for why those moves were made. Yeah, the rumor that Lackey told the Sox he would not honor his contract by playing for the minimum exists as weak sauce.

 

I lump those two trades together for their cumulative idiocy. But either stands alone as indefensible.

 

I wanted us to extend Lester and even suggested we extend Lackey with a signing bonus that would pay him good money during his "minimum wage season". However, once it became clear Lester was heading to free agency I was fully on board with trading him. I did not like the idea of trading him for Cespedes and a comp pick, but that's a separate issue. I thought we could have gotten better for Lackey too, but I could see how Lackey's 1.3 remaining years was worth more to a contender than to a non-contender (the Sox).

 

All-in-all, once we messed up the Lester extension, I liked the idea of blowing it all up. I loved the Miller for ERod trade (and I said it at the time). I did not like the idea of trading Lester and Lackey for ML players. I had hoped we went for prospects like ERod instead. I thought Kelly had promise, but the Cespedes deal made little sense to me, especially with the no draft pick clause.

 

I had hoped we loaded up with prospects that summer, and then spent the next winter signing free agents and trading some prospects for young controllable players.

 

[mvp 78]

So much for the value of FG.

 

It had value at one time?

[moonslav59]

It had value at one time?

 

As a comparative use, I think it has value, but clearly they seem to overvalue everybody.

 

The value they give seems to be somewhat close to "open market" free agent value, which almost always appears to be overpay as well, right?

[Spudboy]

I wanted us to extend Lester and even suggested we extend Lackey with a signing bonus that would pay him good money during his "minimum wage season". However, once it became clear Lester was heading to free agency I was fully on board with trading him. I did not like the idea of trading him for Cespedes and a comp pick, but that's a separate issue. I thought we could have gotten better for Lackey too, but I could see how Lackey's 1.3 remaining years was worth more to a contender than to a non-contender (the Sox).

 

All-in-all, once we messed up the Lester extension, I liked the idea of blowing it all up. I loved the Miller for ERod trade (and I said it at the time). I did not like the idea of trading Lester and Lackey for ML players. I had hoped we went for prospects like ERod instead. I thought Kelly had promise, but the Cespedes deal made little sense to me, especially with the no draft pick clause.

 

I had hoped we loaded up with prospects that summer, and then spent the next winter signing free agents and trading some prospects for young controllable players.

 

 

I believe that the Sox should have signed Lester soon after the 2013 season ended. Something over Homer Bailey money, say, 5/110 -5/120. I bet he would have signed in that range. Why they made the 70 mil offer is beyond me. Once that happened I lost confidence that the Sox wanted him back. Over 30 and all that. Just stupid decision making or feltching of the process.

 

I agree that trading him for Cespedes was plain dumb. Unless Cespedes indicated that he would sign an extension for reasonable money. This, to me, was the beginning of a cavalcade of f*** me moves.

 

I believe that after purging Lester it made even more sense to keep Lackey as he was a legit #1 for The Angels and after surgery he was back to being a tough guy to face ( pun intended for my friends here on Talksox ). Sign Lackey to a three year deal at 13-16 mil/yr and wipe out the min. year and it could have been done.

 

I agree that Miller to Baltimore for E-Rod was a good move. It looked like Miller, despite his contentment in playing here in Boston, was likely to get a 2-3 year deal at or about what the Yankees eventually paid him. I don't think that the Sox valued him that high. Although they extended Koji at relatively obscene money so it's hard to say.

 

The problem with blowing up the rotation is that it is very hard to build another one starting from scratch. Look at what we have now.

[moonslav59]

I believe that the Sox should have signed Lester soon after the 2013 season ended. Something over Homer Bailey money, say, 5/110 -5/120. I bet he would have signed in that range. Why they made the 70 mil offer is beyond me. Once that happened I lost confidence that the Sox wanted him back. Over 30 and all that. Just stupid decision making or feltching of the process.

 

I agree, but Lester did say he'd take a hometown discount, and maybe the Sox viewed that as a Pedey-like deal. Anyways, they botched it by at least not immediately following up on their low-ball offer with something like $130M/6. I really think the chicken & beer thing got into management's head.

 

I agree that trading him for Cespedes was plain dumb. Unless Cespedes indicated that he would sign an extension for reasonable money. This, to me, was the beginning of a cavalcade of f*** me moves.

 

I think it was pretty clear Cespedes wanted free agency. That's why he had the no qualifying offer clause put in in the first place. Even if we did get to extend him, it would have been at FA cost. I hate trading good talent for players making FA money. It's easier to just sign a similar FA.

 

I believe that after purging Lester it made even more sense to keep Lackey as he was a legit #1 for The Angels and after surgery he was back to being a tough guy to face ( pun intended for my friends here on Talksox ). Sign Lackey to a three year deal at 13-16 mil/yr and wipe out the min. year and it could have been done.

 

I think they felt without Lester, they wouldn't win it all the following year, so why not get what we can for Lackey. They must have figured 4 years of Kelly > 1 year of Lackey. Also, Lackey was part of the beer & chicken gate.

 

We also traded Peavy for Hembree & Escobar. I had hoped for better returns for him too, but Hembree may end up helping yet.

 

I agree that Miller to Baltimore for E-Rod was a good move. It looked like Miller, despite his contentment in playing here in Boston, was likely to get a 2-3 year deal at or about what the Yankees eventually paid him. I don't think that the Sox valued him that high. Although they extended Koji at relatively obscene money so it's hard to say.

 

But Koji didn't get the years Miller got.

 

The problem with blowing up the rotation is that it is very hard to build another one starting from scratch. Look at what we have now.

 

I totally agree, and having just Lackey right now, would make a huge difference, assuming he'd have extended with us.

 

My point was that once Lester was going to free agency, I thought the trades made sense. Plus, we could have outbid the Cubs for Lester anyways.

[devildavid]

The Sox jumped on the Cuban player bandwagon too late. Castillo was table scraps compared to Puig and Abreau. But even those two have had their recent struggles. Castillo has raw talent but is sorely lacking in discipline and fundamentals. And when they got him he hadn't played for about a year. Too much risk for that kind of contract.