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7/30 vs Seattle

BornToRun
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crc2120 Draft Eligible

crc2120

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So the team with the third best record in MLB is not a "true" contender right now?

 

I don't know yet honestly. I'm not too confident in going with Dempster, Doubront, and Workman down the stretch. Too inconsistent and Workman too young. Now you give me a top 3 of Lester-Lee-Lackey, I feel alot better.

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BornToRun Boston Red Sox

BornToRun

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I'm tired of hearing the "Well we're not supposed to be here anyway blah blah blah." Well guess what, we are here. And when you get here, you should do everything in your power to live for the moment and go for it! Championships are rare. Any time you get a chance to win one you go for it! You do anything to try and avoid possible collapses. What happens if Buchholz's balls hurt again or Dempster's back acts up? Then people will bitch that the Sox shouldve made a move...

 

Well those people can go screw a camel for all I care. Making moves like this gets you into trouble. We were incredibly fortunate to have the Dodgers take on the full brunt of our 3 terrible contracts and with an amazing farm system, that trade has set us up for a potentially glorious future. I'm not willing to part with the potential of JBJ, Cecchini, Barnes, or any other of the top guys for 3 years of Cliff Lee when the current status of the Sox as an organization is transition rather than win now.

mvp 78 GOAT

mvp 78

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Shouldn't Workman's performance be giving people more confidence in this team? And 2013 Doubront is a solid 3. Clearly he has a ceiling of a good 2.
jung Worcester Red Sox

jung

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So here is one issue (and only one) with the trade prospects for Lee scenario.

 

Lets assume we get into the post season. In a short series we will not out-pitch the Rays IMO, Lee or no Lee. Not the year to do this again IMO. I would rather have JBJ as part of a more serious effort downstream than lose the flexibility JBJ represents to the Sox for an aging starting pitcher that will not get us past the Rays in a short series anyway...again IMO.

 

Similar but not the same problem with Detroit. We could out-pitch Detroit with Lee and Buch but likely could not control their hitting through a series once we pitched Lee and Buch.

 

Not to say we just give up...far from it. However giving up and betting long odds that have an impact on your ability to succeed downstream are not the same thing.

BornToRun Boston Red Sox

BornToRun

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Shouldn't Workman's performance be giving people more confidence in this team? And 2013 Doubront is a solid 3. Clearly he has a ceiling of a good 2.

 

I think people are selling Doubront a bit too short. Sure, he doesn't go as deep into games as we'd like but the guy's been nothing but solid for a while now.

User Name Boston Red Sox

User Name

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I don't know yet honestly. I'm not too confident in going with Dempster, Doubront, and Workman down the stretch. Too inconsistent and Workman too young. Now you give me a top 3 of Lester-Lee-Lackey, I feel alot better.

 

Shouldn't Workman's performance and their record without Buchholz actually be a reason to be more confident in the team?

User Name Boston Red Sox

User Name

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So here is one issue (and only one) with the trade prospects for Lee scenario.

 

Lets assume we get into the post season. In a short series we will not out-pitch the Rays IMO, Lee or no Lee. Not the year to do this again IMO. I would rather have JBJ as part of a more serious effort downstream than lose the flexibility JBJ represents to the Sox for an aging starting pitcher that will not get us past the Rays in a short series anyway...again IMO.

 

Similar but not the same problem with Detroit. We could out-pitch Detroit with Lee and Buch but likely could not control their hitting through a series once we pitched Lee and Buch.

 

Not to say we just give up...far from it. However giving up and betting long odds that have an impact on your ability to succeed downstream are not the same thing.

 

Are you saying that a top 4 of Lee-Buchholz-Lackey-Lester couldn't pitch at the same level of the Rays or Tigers' top 4? Because statistically, that is ridiculous.

Disciples_of_Mueller Prep Ball

Disciples_of_Mueller

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Hmm... Not sure on Peavy. Depends on what we give up

 

I'll take Peavy if he comes SUPER cheap at the last minute. Otherwise, forget it (and this comes from someone who has always been a big fan of his going back to his SD days).

crc2120 Draft Eligible

crc2120

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So NOW what do you think BTR? What if the Sox are about to deal your boy JBJ as part of a package for Peavy. Would you have preferred Lee or Peavy?
BornToRun Boston Red Sox

BornToRun

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I'll take Peavy if he comes SUPER cheap at the last minute. Otherwise, forget it (and this comes from someone who has always been a big fan of his going back to his SD days).

 

Agreed. 2 middle tier guys is about as high as I'd go for him.

Palodios Greenville Drive

Palodios

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I'm one of the biggest Peavy fans, and I think trading Bradley for him would be just plain dumb. Unless Lindstrom is part of the deal?
BornToRun Boston Red Sox

BornToRun

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So NOW what do you think BTR? What if the Sox are about to deal your boy JBJ as part of a package for Peavy. Would you have preferred Lee or Peavy?

 

I'm not allowed to be pissed off by either scenario? Because I think I'm leaning in that direction.

 

Hold on and let me verify.....yep, pretty pissed off in either scenario.

MNSoxChief102 Draft Eligible

MNSoxChief102

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I know it's probably not worth much but didn't a report come out earlier that whatever was up with Peavy, JBJ wasn't involved?

 

Yes. I highly doubt JBJ would be involved in anything less than a deal for Lee. He's too valuable.

 

Iggy on the other hand is expendable, especially if we bring up Bogaerts. Love his defense at short (not really so much at third) and his bat is just meh... the early season pop has predictably disappeared. Okay if he goes to get something good back in return.

jung Worcester Red Sox

jung

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Iggy may not fit in the Sox plans and Peavy would allow the Sox to eventually juggle the current rotation and probably push a guy to the pen leaving us maybe only looking for one more pen arm. So that might work. Love Iggy but have thought for the longest time that the Sox will eventually talk themselves out of Iggy anyway.

 

Glad the Sox are apparently out on Lee. No matter how you cut it assuming the Phillies would have gotten a hell of a load for Lee, it would be mortgaging a better future against long odds this year....entirely contrary to the direction they have said they wanted to go and contrary to the direction that likely makes the most sense for the Sox.

Edited by jung
BornToRun Boston Red Sox

BornToRun

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Yes. I highly doubt JBJ would be involved in anything less than a deal for Lee. He's too valuable.

 

Iggy on the other hand is expendable, especially if we bring up Bogaerts. Love his defense at short (not really so much at third) and his bat is just meh... the early season pop has predictably disappeared. Okay if he goes to get something good back in return.

 

Giving up Iggy is something I'm totally okay with. Between Garin, WMB, Xander, and Marrero on the left side of the infield, I'd say we have more than enough depth to cover the loss. His defense is nice but he's got a weak bat. And even if he turns out to be a decent hitter somehow, whatever he ends up being worth probably won't touch Xander's level of productivity.

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