Red Sox sign Ranger Suarez. 5 years $130 Million

[moonslav59]

6 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

Maybe too calculated at times. I think the new Sox FO rely too heavily on models vs scouting. We'll have to see how that holds up after a few years.

It's also a little silly to start trying to parse out where to lay blame between Breslow vs JH or whatever (not directed at you). Easier to just say, the FO (Bres/Sam/Theo/JH/Werner) weren't able to sign Bregman because they valued him at one level, didn't really budge off of it and didn't want to waive the no trade clause. We know that to be a fact. If the Sox moved on afterwards, I guess we need to judge the value on the next move vs what they missed out on with Bregman. 

1. How do they replace Bregman at 3b and what does it mean for 2b?

2. How does Suarez's contract hold up? 

I think that's all that matters. Trying to figure out WHO to blame over the Sox not landing Bregman is near impossible until Speier is able to write his next tell all book. 

Very well said.

It should never be viewed in such simple terms as "Bregman was our number one target; we missed out on getting him; he must have botched it."

Even if we did "misjudged the room," or were willing to pay more but did not get think we had to, the fact is we did not grossly overpay for Bregman, and we got a very good SP'er instead. Maybe he was an overpay or gross overpay, too, and time will show we chose wrongly. So be it. My opinion is, I'd rather have Suarez at $130M than Bregman at $170M, and for all we know, that may not have sealed the deal, if the no trade clause was a dealbreaker, anyway.

[moonslav59]

5 hours ago, JoeBrady said:

Or, you won't be able to tell until his contract is over.  According to back-of-the-envelop calculus, Bregman was worth $125M/5.  If that model holds up, then it was right to not sign him.  Whether Breslow was sputtering, aloof, perfectly coherent or anything else, won't matter.

Yup, Brez could have totally botched things, but still ended up at the right point... or not.

[moonslav59]

4 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

2019 BOS 243M 2026 268M

Seems like BOS isn't keeping up the pace? 

Indeed, but keeping pace with these insane jumps by 3-4 teams is not something I think should be fairly demanded by a fan base.

Also, the numbers provided in the previous post included jumps bt the Phillies from 2021 vs the Dodgers from 2019.

The 2019 to 2026 Sox jump looks paltry and is very far from "keeping pace," but the 2021 ro 2026 jump looks better, although still way short of those other teams listed:

2021: $185M> 2026: $268M (+$83M)

PHI $209>$363 (+$154M) in the same timeframe. The Mets jumped $213M from 2021!

Crazy money!

[Kimmi]

On 1/25/2026 at 3:19 PM, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Hard to call anyone with Breslow's credentials and education a buffoon. I lean more towards cold and calculated (I won't say stiff, so I won't be fired). 

Breslow is not a buffoon.  Calculated, yes.  He may also be cold, but I think you have to have a degree of coldness in order to be a good GM. 

I would not make a good GM.  I would have still had the entire 2004 teams playing for the Red Sox 10 years later.

[Kimmi]

Just now, Kimmi said:

Breslow is not a buffoon.  Calculated, yes.  He may also be cold, but I think you have to have a degree of coldness in order to be a good GM. 

I would not make a good GM.  I would have still had the entire 2004 teams playing for the Red Sox 10 years later.

Also, I'm not sure why it is assumed that when the Red Sox fail to sign a player that the GM must have botched it.  I'm sure that has happened, but I would assume that, more often than not, the deal did not happen because of reasons other than being botched.

[mvp 78]

16 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Indeed, but keeping pace with these insane jumps by 3-4 teams is not something I think should be fairly demanded by a fan base.

Wrong, when the Sox are #3 in baseball revenue IMO.

[mvp 78]

15 hours ago, Kimmi said:

Breslow is not a buffoon.  Calculated, yes.  He may also be cold, but I think you have to have a degree of coldness in order to be a good GM. 

I would not make a good GM.  I would have still had the entire 2004 teams playing for the Red Sox 10 years later.

I would have re-signed Pedro and traded Schilling that offseason. 

[JoeBrady]

3 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

Wrong, when the Sox are #3 in baseball revenue IMO.

#4 according to Forbes, but it is not quite that simple.  Also according to Forbes, the NYMs lost $268M last year, the NYY lost $57M, the LAD made $11M, and Philly made $9M.  There are from Forbes, so I won't debate the accuracy.  But teams are allowed to make money on their investments.

[mvp 78]

13 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

#4 according to Forbes, but it is not quite that simple.  Also according to Forbes, the NYMs lost $268M last year, the NYY lost $57M, the LAD made $11M, and Philly made $9M.  There are from Forbes, so I won't debate the accuracy.  But teams are allowed to make money on their investments.

How operating income did the Red Sox have just on baseball per Forbes (since the amounts don't include the real estate ventures)? Where did that rank? Big losers?  

[JoeBrady]

14 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

How operating income did the Red Sox have just on baseball per Forbes (since the amounts don't include the real estate ventures)? Where did that rank? Big losers?  

#1.  Like I've said before, we need to do more spending, but we need to eliminate NYM and LAD from the comps.  Something like TO should be our target.

[drewski6]

42 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

#1.  Like I've said before, we need to do more spending, but we need to eliminate NYM and LAD from the comps.  Something like TO should be our target.

And here you are trying to trade for Cam SMith.

[mvp 78]

21 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

And here you are trying to trade for Cam SMith.

Probably would give him an extension at the press conference. 

[JoeBrady]

23 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

And here you are trying to trade for Cam SMith.

Sure.  Everyone that I think can fit will be on my list.  That includes Suarez, Paredes, Baty, Smith, and others.  And if Chandler or Burns were available, they'd be on my list as well.

[moonslav59]

21 hours ago, Kimmi said:

Also, I'm not sure why it is assumed that when the Red Sox fail to sign a player that the GM must have botched it.  I'm sure that has happened, but I would assume that, more often than not, the deal did not happen because of reasons other than being botched.

One major reason is likely the restrictions put in place on spending & negotiation by JH. (Money, years, no trade clauses & deferments to name a few.)

That's not to say mistakes can't ber or weren't made, but who here knows Brez botched it?

[moonslav59]

5 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

Wrong, when the Sox are #3 in baseball revenue IMO.

I have spoken about that and fully agree that JH can and should spend more, but I'm not going to lie and say he hasn't been spending more when we are $50M ahead of 2023.

Yes, from 2019 to 2023 it was absurd. He deserves everything said about him, but there is no need to make the point by telling mistruths or being deceitful. (not you.)

[mvp 78]

3 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I have spoken about that and fully agree that JH can and should spend more, but I'm not going to lie and say he hasn't been spending more when we are $50M ahead of 2023.

Yes, from 2019 to 2023 it was absurd. He deserves everything said about him, but there is no need to make the point by telling mistruths or being deceitful. (not you.)

Things seem to be heading in the right direction, but they have sidetracked themselves a few times IMO (Devers). Let's see where they wind up at the end of the year.

[JoeBrady]

55 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

That's not to say mistakes can't ber or weren't made, but who here knows Brez botched it?

No one.  It's a silly argument.  We might have been nowhere close to signing him.  Or maybe we were $1 away and Breslow insulted Bregman's wife.  This is simply an excuse, for the folks that don't like Breslow, to insult him.

[drewski6]

17 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

No one.  It's a silly argument.  We might have been nowhere close to signing him.  Or maybe we were $1 away and Breslow insulted Bregman's wife.  This is simply an excuse, for the folks that don't like Breslow, to insult him.

How do you know that AJ Pierzynski doesnt like Breslow and is making it all up to smear him?

Thats pretty wild accusation, IMO

Keep reaching for the stars

 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

Things seem to be heading in the right direction, but they have sidetracked themselves a few times IMO (Devers). Let's see where they wind up at the end of the year.

When you think about it, that one major "sidetrack" is the difference maker. We may not have gotten Contreras, had we still had Devers and he was okay w 1B.

1. L Anthony LF

2. L Devers 3B

3 R Contreras 1B

4. L Dura DH

5. R Story SS

6. L Abreu RF

7. R Narvaez C

8. L Mayer/ R Romy 2B

9. R Rafaela CF 

[Kimmi]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

One major reason is likely the restrictions put in place on spending & negotiation by JH. (Money, years, no trade clauses & deferments to name a few.)

That's not to say mistakes can't ber or weren't made, but who here knows Brez botched it?

There is so much more that goes on behind the scenes that we are not privy to.  We need an inside source.  We need a mole.   LOL

[drewski6]

29 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

There is so much more that goes on behind the scenes that we are not privy to.  We need an inside source.  We need a mole.   LOL

We have one. Its AJ Pierzynski. And he told you exactly what happened.  Breslow angered Bregman because Breslow isnt good with people, and Bregman wanted to come back, but he looked at Boras and hes like "this dude isnt listening to me, and its aggravating. Plus I have more money in hand from the cubs."  ANd Boras stayed silent cuz hes not the bad guy here.

Then Bregman told Breslow he was going to sign with the cubs, and thats when bregman upped his offer to 165m,...but he also increased the deferrals and wouldnt include the ntc, and bregman was like you gotta be kidding me

ANd now people wanna pretend that we dont know what happened or that it was breslow being shrewd. Hard line in the sand, i respect that.

None of it happened.  I told you guys that Breslow doesnt human good and it would bite us and there you go

Point Drewski

[drewski6]

just like at the trade deadline

[Old Red]

6 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

We have one. Its AJ Pierzynski. And he told you exactly what happened.  Breslow angered Bregman because Breslow isnt good with people, and Bregman wanted to come back, but he looked at Boras and hes like "this dude isnt listening to me, and its aggravating. Plus I have more money in hand from the cubs."  ANd Boras stayed silent cuz hes not the bad guy here.

Then Bregman told Breslow he was going to sign with the cubs, and thats when bregman upped his offer to 165m,...but he also increased the deferrals and wouldnt include the ntc, and bregman was like you gotta be kidding me

ANd now people wanna pretend that we dont know what happened or that it was breslow being shrewd. Hard line in the sand, i respect that.

None of it happened.  I told you guys that Breslow doesnt human good and it would bite us and there you go

Point Drewski

I think this sums things up pretty well, and as one put it Brez was playing GO FISH, and others were playing HOLD EM. There was also no evidence that JH didn’t let Brez do a no trade, or any other restrictions. I’m not saying there wasn’t, but NO report of it.

[notin]

29 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

We have one. Its AJ Pierzynski. And he told you exactly what happened.  Breslow angered Bregman because Breslow isnt good with people, and Bregman wanted to come back, but he looked at Boras and hes like "this dude isnt listening to me, and its aggravating. Plus I have more money in hand from the cubs."  ANd Boras stayed silent cuz hes not the bad guy here.

Then Bregman told Breslow he was going to sign with the cubs, and thats when bregman upped his offer to 165m,...but he also increased the deferrals and wouldnt include the ntc, and bregman was like you gotta be kidding me

ANd now people wanna pretend that we dont know what happened or that it was breslow being shrewd. Hard line in the sand, i respect that.

None of it happened.  I told you guys that Breslow doesnt human good and it would bite us and there you go

Point Drewski

Pierzynski has experience with MLB contract negotiations, but he isn’t necessarily an insider into the specifics an any individual negotiation.  It’s not like anyone invites him.

Breslow:  I think you’ll find my latest offer very…

Boras: Wait! Stop!  Where’s AJ?

Breslow: Who?

Boras: AJ Pierzynski, of course.  

Breslow:  Do we really need him here?

Boras:  I’m not negotiating without AJ.  That’s like asking  Pixar to make a movie without John Ratzenberger…

[drewski6]

1 minute ago, notin said:

Pierzynski has experience with MLB contract negotiations, but he isn’t necessarily an insider into the specifics an any individual negotiation.  It’s not like anyone invites him.

Breslow:  I think you’ll find my latest offer very…

Boras: Wait! Stop!  Where’s AJ?

Breslow: Who?

Boras: AJ Pierzynski, of course.  

Breslow:  Do we really need him here?

Boras:  I’m not negotiating without AJ.  That’s like asking  Pixar to make a movie without John Ratzenberger…

But AJP isnt talking about his gut , his opinion, or his speculation.

Hes telling you what happened, and Im not hearing any pushback.

[drewski6]

6 minutes ago, notin said:

Pierzynski has experience with MLB contract negotiations, but he isn’t necessarily an insider into the specifics an any individual negotiation.  It’s not like anyone invites him.

Breslow:  I think you’ll find my latest offer very…

Boras: Wait! Stop!  Where’s AJ?

Breslow: Who?

Boras: AJ Pierzynski, of course.  

Breslow:  Do we really need him here?

Boras:  I’m not negotiating without AJ.  That’s like asking  Pixar to make a movie without John Ratzenberger…

 

[JoeBrady]

2 hours ago, drewski6 said:

How do you know that AJ Pierzynski doesnt like Breslow and is making it all up to smear him?

Thats pretty wild accusation, IMO

Keep reaching for the stars

 

Keep thinking that you know what happens in Breslow's office.

[JoeBrady]

44 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

Plus I have more money in hand from the cubs." 

What's your point?  The Cubs bid more than us.

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

There is so much more that goes on behind the scenes that we are not privy to.  We need an inside source.  We need a mole.   LOL

I'm pretty comfortable thinking JH & the rest of the top brass determined the no trade thing and set some sort of short and long term budget guideline that takes approval, if a GM intends to stray too far from the blueprint.

Maybe Brez had some budget space to offer Bregman more, and it wasn't JH giving a firm "No." Maybe JH said, "okay, but X amount needs to be deferred." Maybe it was all Brez's call. I'm not it matters much.

We didn't grossly overpay for a 32 year old player, and we somewhat overpaid for a 30 year pitcher, instead. I have no issues with the results: I'm glad we got Suarez.

[drewski6]

Just now, JoeBrady said:

Keep thinking that you know what happens in Breslow's office.

AJ Pierz / Carrabis and Milliken with no pushback from the team or Breslow

VS 

Joe

And btw - we'll never truly know is right out of the playbook