Pirates (Oviedo) vs Red Sox (May): 8/30/25, 4:10pm

[moonslav59]

Of course, I wish Brez & Co. would have realized the window was wide open, already and did more for 2025, but we have a damn good team, a good chance to win it all, and an even better chance at winning in future years. WAY BETTER CHANCE in 2025, 2026, 2027...!

[moonslav59]

10 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

every time, Moon. every time. Henry should just make it policy to never trade with the Dodgers because their front office is far too smart for his.

Manny for Jason Bay (3 teamer)???

[FredLynn]

6 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Last time I checked, we are a winning team.

The team is way better. It's not even close. It's a "widely accepted fact."

If I made my company way better, I'd get a bonus not a firing.

Of course we are better. Just not as good as we could have been had Breslow done his job. We could have competed for at least a pennant. It’s a missed opportunity and it’s cost Breslow his job.

[moonslav59]

6 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Of course we are better. Just not as good as we could have been had Breslow done his job. We could have competed for at least a pennant. It’s a missed opportunity and it’s cost Breslow his job.

We are still in the Pennant chase.

Brez has not lost his job, nor will he, this winter.

I agree, he should have done more, but deadline deals are gross overpays, and I respect the plan to make the major deals in the winter.

A GM should not be fired because of a disagreement over one aspect of his portfolio, which hasn't even had a chance to show if it was a failure. There was a point where we all felt the Gio signing was a horrible mistake. Many of us hated the plan of adding just Chapman and Wilson to a weak 2024 pen that then lost Jansen & Martin. Many hated us missing out on big name FAs like Soto and Yamo, and then we added Bregman. Many were pissed off at the Devers trade, and we did "get better" after it. I could go on and on.

Yes, I wish we had Ryan, but we don't know if that trade would have worked, just like we didn't know some of his past moves would have worked out as well as they did.

We are playing the best ball since 2021, and to me, this team looks better than that one: better 26 man roster, better 40 man roster & better farm. It wasn't like that when Brez took over.

In my company, when someone improves nearly every aspect of his company, he is rewarded not fired.

[FredLynn]

8 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

We are still in the Pennant chase.

Brez has not lost his job, nor will he, this winter.

I agree, he should have done more, but deadline deals are gross overpays, and I respect the plan to make the major deals in the winter.

A GM should not be fired because of a disagreement over one aspect of his portfolio, which hasn't even had a chance to show if it was a failure. There was a point where we all felt the Gio signing was a horrible mistake. Many of us hated the plan of adding just Chapman and Wilson to a weak 2024 pen that then lost Jansen & Martin. Many hated us missing out on big name FAs like Soto and Yamo, and then we added Bregman. Many were pissed off at the Devers trade, and we did "get better" after it. I could go on and on.

Yes, I wish we had Ryan, but we don't know if that trade would have worked, just like we didn't know some of his past moves would have worked out as well as they did.

We are playing the best ball since 2021, and to me, this team looks better than that one: better 26 man roster, better 40 man roster & better farm. It wasn't like that when Brez took over.

In my company, when someone improves nearly every aspect of his company, he is rewarded not fired.

I’m a bottom line kinda guy. I’m willing to wait until we see how the season ends for the team. If we can at least make it into the second round I’d change my mind (not that it matters) about Breslow keeping his job. If it’s a one and done I’d fire him. 
Being better isn’t good enough if you haven’t reached your potential.

 

[Bellhorn04]

9 hours ago, FredLynn said:

I’m a bottom line kinda guy. I’m willing to wait until we see how the season ends for the team. If we can at least make it into the second round I’d change my mind (not that it matters) about Breslow keeping his job. If it’s a one and done I’d fire him. 
Being better isn’t good enough if you haven’t reached your potential.

 

Fortunately your input on Breslow 's job is not a factor.

[moonslav59]

11 hours ago, FredLynn said:

I’m a bottom line kinda guy. I’m willing to wait until we see how the season ends for the team. If we can at least make it into the second round I’d change my mind (not that it matters) about Breslow keeping his job. If it’s a one and done I’d fire him. 
Being better isn’t good enough if you haven’t reached your potential.

 

You are not "willing to wait." You say Brez needs to be fired.

The bottom line is that we are winning and greatly improved over just 2 years of Brez.

Could be implode and miss the playoffs in 2025? Yes.

Would I love to see a ring, this year? Of course, and I do think we could have/should have done more at the deadline, but I don't know what the offers were, I hate overpaying for rentals, and I think the strategy to make major moves in the winter is generally a good one.

Brez has done way more good than bad, and to me, most of his bad moves (in hindsight) has serious merit, at the time.

Saying, "He needs to be fired" does not seem like someone "willing to wait."

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Fortunately your input on Breslow 's job is not a factor.

Apparently, not winning a ring in August is grounds for termination.

[moonslav59]

With TOR starting to buckle, we've missed a great chance to gain on winning the ALE.

[FredLynn]

26 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

You are not "willing to wait." You say Brez needs to be fired.

The bottom line is that we are winning and greatly improved over just 2 years of Brez.

Could be implode and miss the playoffs in 2025? Yes.

Would I love to see a ring, this year? Of course, and I do think we could have/should have done more at the deadline, but I don't know what the offers were, I hate overpaying for rentals, and I think the strategy to make major moves in the winter is generally a good one.

Brez has done way more good than bad, and to me, most of his bad moves (in hindsight) has serious merit, at the time.

Saying, "He needs to be fired" does not seem like someone "willing to wait."

As of right now I’d fire him at the end of the season. That could change if we make it out of the first round in the playoffs. So if I am Henry my thinking would be this: Breslow is skating on paper thin ice. He’s on his way out the door barring an acceptable postseason performance.

Clear?

[moonslav59]

Just now, FredLynn said:

As of right now I’d fire him at the end of the season. That could change if we make it out of the first round in the playoffs. So if I am Henry my thinking would be this: Breslow is skating on paper thin ice. He’s on his way out the door barring an acceptable postseason performance.

Clear?

Thanks for clarifying. 

I still disagree. I also think that even if we miss the playoffs, JH & Co would not fire Brez.

[Bellhorn04]

22 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

With TOR starting to buckle, we've missed a great chance to gain on winning the ALE.

When you're in a playoff race, you can call every loss a missed opportunity, really.

The fickle finger of Randomness is never far away in this crazy game.  We take 7 of 8 from the Yanks and Orioles on the road and then lose 2 to Pittsburgh at home.  

[Bellhorn04]

5 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

As of right now I’d fire him at the end of the season. That could change if we make it out of the first round in the playoffs. So if I am Henry my thinking would be this: Breslow is skating on paper thin ice. He’s on his way out the door barring an acceptable postseason performance.

Clear?

You're not Henry and it's extremely doubtful that's the way he's thinking.  He's got a quick trigger finger but he has given every CBO 4 years, at least.  

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Plus there's not exactly a long line waiting to be the next CBO of the Sox. I'm guessing the next CBO of the Sox will be JH's good friend Cora.

[illinoisredsox]

6 minutes ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

Plus there's not exactly a long line waiting to be the next CBO of the Sox. I'm guessing the next CBO of the Sox will be JH's good friend Cora.

Yeah, Fred seems to have forgotten or more likely never knew Breslow was around 11th person they contacted about the job; most if not all of the earlier candidates declined to even interview.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

2 minutes ago, illinoisredsox said:

Yeah, Fred seems to have forgotten or more likely never knew Breslow was around 11th person they contacted about the job; most if not all of the earlier candidates wouldn’t even interview.

Big question about job security. 

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

1 minute ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

Big question about job security. 

 

1 minute ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

Big question about job security. 

DD initially thought he was the GM of a big market team. He found  out soon after that wasn't the case.

[notin]

15 hours ago, FredLynn said:

For the season Ryan was at 3.22. It’s very likely that he would have moved towards his largest season sample size rather than remain at 5+. 

Sure, but thats over a long sample.  The last 2 months of this season are a short one, and players can perform below their norms for short samples for a multitude of reasons. 
 

Since the deadline, Ryan hasn’t not pitched all that much better than May.  This is a fact.  Whichever one had made the last 5 starts in Boston would have been underperforming.  And if Ryan is hurt or fatigued, he would  dry likely not improve this year.

But what Ryan would do is cost at least one of Anthony, Mayer or Tolle.  Maybe more. (BTV at the time had Ryan’s surplus value roughly equal to Mayer plus Tolle.)

 

[moonslav59]

23 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

When you're in a playoff race, you can call every loss a missed opportunity, really.

The fickle finger of Randomness is never far away in this crazy game.  We take 7 of 8 from the Yanks and Orioles on the road and then lose 2 to Pittsburgh at home.  

Our season has been like this, all along. As soon as you think we are looking really good, we hit a tailspin. As soon as you start doubting how good we really are, we go 7-1 on a road trip.

I've said it before, the whole American League looks the same way. Many teams are barely above mediocrity, and nobody stands alone as the clear favorite.

DET is just a handful of games or less ahead of 4 teams, including the Sox. They are 5-5 in their last 10 and 26-26 in their last 52. Their division shows their 2nd, 3rd, 4th & 5th place teams all have worse records than the ALE & ALW. They are very beatable.

TOR was playing very well for a long time, but they too are 5-5 in their last 10. They are 15-16 in their last 31 games. They have 12 games remaining vs BOS, NYY, HOU & KCR & 3 vs .500 CIN. They can be beat, although they have had our number, this year.

NYY was having a real hard time, but they match our 7-3 record over the last 10 games. They are 37-37 since early June. They have as many holes as we do and can be beat. So far, we have had their number.

SEA looked like the improved their team at the deadline, but here are their last 4 months records: 13-14, 13-14, 14-12, 14-12. That screams of mediocrity. They are 5-11 in their last 16. Beatable.

HOU is 20-26 in their last 46. Like us, they are getting injured players back, but they are beatable, too.

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, notin said:

Sure, but thats over a long sample.  The last 2 months of this season are a short one, and players can perform below their norms for short samples for a multitude of reasons. 
 

Since the deadline, Ryan hasn’t not pitched all that much better than May.  This is a fact.  Whichever one had made the last 5 starts in Boston would have been underperforming.  And if Ryan is hurt or fatigued, he would  dry likely not improve this year.

But what Ryan would do is cost at least one of Anthony, Mayer or Tolle.  Maybe more. (BTV at the time had Ryan’s surplus value roughly equal to Mayer plus Tolle.)

 

I think MIN would have taken...

Duran or Abreu

2 from Clarke, Sandlin or Mullins or Early, Sandlin or Mullins (maybe Clarke & Early- maybe Valera & Mullins/Sandlin)

I would not give Tolle. I'm not sure about Mayer, but not Abreu & Mayer.

[moonslav59]

21 minutes ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

 

DD initially thought he was the GM of a big market team. He found  out soon after that wasn't the case.

It wasn't "soon." It was later.

Our opening day budgets were...

$184M in 2015 (Ben signed Pablito & HRam)

$197M in 2016 (signed Price) & 2017

$233M in 2018 (signed JD)

$236M in '19 but no Kimbrel and Kelly, but extended/re-signed Sale & Nate

It was 2019, when the spending shifted and the choice was made that Betts was about to be traded. (They almost traded him in the summer of '19 under DD.)

[notin]

28 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I think MIN would have taken...

Duran or Abreu

2 from Clarke, Sandlin or Mullins or Early, Sandlin or Mullins (maybe Clarke & Early- maybe Valera & Mullins/Sandlin)

I would not give Tolle. I'm not sure about Mayer, but not Abreu & Mayer.

Well, if the players preferred to keep the roster largely intact, that means Duran, Abreu and Mayer were off limits (along with Anthony).  
 

At that point, Tolle is definitely included in the trade…

[notin]

30 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I think MIN would have taken...

Duran or Abreu

2 from Clarke, Sandlin or Mullins or Early, Sandlin or Mullins (maybe Clarke & Early- maybe Valera & Mullins/Sandlin)

I would not give Tolle. I'm not sure about Mayer, but not Abreu & Mayer.

If you were GM of the Twins and your job and professional reputation ride on making good on a Joe Ryan trade, are you honestly telling me you would have accepted Duran (whose control doesn’t align with a rebuild), Sandlin and Mullins? And passed on Tolle?

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, Bellhorn04 said:

You're not Henry and it's extremely doubtful that's the way he's thinking.  He's got a quick trigger finger but he has given every CBO 4 years, at least.  

Really?

But when I look in the mirror I see Henry’s mug. 

[moonslav59]

51 minutes ago, notin said:

Well, if the players preferred to keep the roster largely intact, that means Duran, Abreu and Mayer were off limits (along with Anthony).  
 

At that point, Tolle is definitely included in the trade…

Not necessarily. I think Mayer & Valera gets it done. Mayer and Campbell even more so.

Campbell, Garcia and Clarke, too.

[moonslav59]

50 minutes ago, notin said:

If you were GM of the Twins and your job and professional reputation ride on making good on a Joe Ryan trade, are you honestly telling me you would have accepted Duran (whose control doesn’t align with a rebuild), Sandlin and Mullins? And passed on Tolle?

I suggested Duran or Abreu- both have more control than Ryan and Abreu +1 more than Duran.

I also suggested I'd modify the Sandlin and Mullins part to sub our Clarke or Early or maybe both.

[Bellhorn04]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

Really?

But when I look in the mirror I see Henry’s mug. 

No need to share all your issues. 😄

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

2 hours ago, Bellhorn04 said:

When you're in a playoff race, you can call every loss a missed opportunity, really.

The fickle finger of Randomness is never far away in this crazy game. 

Sometimes it's pointing at me and wagging in my face so I won't show any shred of confidence in my team, no matter how many they win in a row.

Other times, it's pointing straight up... and I think it's a different finger.

Oh, wait -- it's foamy and says "We're #1"

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

It wasn't "soon." It was later.

Our opening day budgets were...

$184M in 2015 (Ben signed Pablito & HRam)

$197M in 2016 (signed Price) & 2017

$233M in 2018 (signed JD)

$236M in '19 but no Kimbrel and Kelly, but extended/re-signed Sale & Nate

It was 2019, when the spending shifted and the choice was made that Betts was about to be traded. (They almost traded him in the summer of '19 under DD.)

You're correct. It was later.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

You're correct. It was later.

Even 2019 saw the Sale & Nate extensions plus the Bogey one that kicked in starting 2020.

We just remember letting K & K walk and then trading Betts rather than pay him a couple million more per year.