Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Randy Red Sox]

What about deal like Castillo or Luzardo- pitchers with 3 or more years on control?

 

only if they come cheap

[Randy Red Sox]

Angels and Giants pursuing Snell now

[notin]

What about deal like Castillo or Luzardo- pitchers with 3 or more years on control?

 

 

I don’t see why the Mariners would be so willing to move the Castillo. Now if you want Robbie Ray, he can be had for a song. And not even a good song. “Pictures of Matchstick Men” might be enough…

[moonslav59]

only if they come cheap

 

I'm not for trading for either, unless it is part of a larger plan to get better in 2024.

 

I'd be fine trading a lot for Luzardo, if we signed Monty and added Polanco.

 

BTV is a flawed site, and trying for a 3 players for one type deal is very likely a pipe dream, but what would you offer in the ballpark of these valued pitchers:

 

63 Luzardo (3 yrs for a total of an estimated $28M)

58 Garrett (5 yrs at $46M)

17 Castillo (5 yrs at $122M or $24.5M/yr)

 

Sox values:

51 Casas

48 Bello

45 Mayer

42 Anthony

34 Duran

24 Crawford

22 Houck

22 Bleis

18 Teel

13 Yorke

12 Rafaela

10 Schreiber

9 Wink & Pivetta

8 EValdez & Abreu

7 Cespedes

6 Wikelman

 

Duran, Crawford and Wikelman for Luzardo (That's the 3 for 1 I warned against working)

 

Mayer and Bleis for Luzardo?

Mayer & Houck or Crawford?

 

How about Mayer & Yorke for Garrett?

Mayer & Rafaela?

 

How about Crawford or Houck for Castillo and $5M?

Yorke and Schreiber for the same?

 

I'm not sure any of these offers would be accepted, but you get the general idea.

 

[moonslav59]

I don’t see why the Mariners would be so willing to move the Castillo. Now if you want Robbie Ray, he can be had for a song. And not even a good song. “Pictures of Matchstick Men” might be enough…

 

They are reportedly looking to cut salary and have a glut of SP'ers, but I agree. I doubt they want to trade him.

 

They'd have to really like one or two of our prospects to think about it.

[Bellhorn04]

Red Sox front office is catatonic, frozen in place, as if in a Twilight Zone episode.

[Bellhorn04]

Last Sox offseason was busy compared to this one. Who'da thunk it?

[moonslav59]

Last Sox offseason was busy compared to this one. Who'da thunk it?

 

I expected a lot of spending both winters.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Red Sox front office is catatonic, frozen in place, as if in a Twilight Zone episode.

 

My favorite was "The Hunt" where some old-timer and his loyal dog hike through the afterlife (the raccoon won) looking for a place where they're welcome. The guy wisely stayed away from the gate where fake St. Pete refused his dog entry.

 

They finally reach the real heaven, where a World Series isn't guaranteed every year, but the front office is actually sincere about building a roster for sustained contention...

[moonslav59]

My favorite was "The Hunt" where some old-timer and his loyal dog hike through the afterlife (the raccoon won) looking for a place where they're welcome. The guy wisely stayed away from the gate where fake St. Pete refused his dog entry.

 

They finally reach the real heaven, where a World Series isn't guaranteed every year, but the front office is actually sincere about building a roster for sustained contention...

 

A heavenly dream it was.

[notin]

My favorite was "The Hunt" where some old-timer and his loyal dog hike through the afterlife (the raccoon won) looking for a place where they're welcome. The guy wisely stayed away from the gate where fake St. Pete refused his dog entry.

 

They finally reach the real heaven, where a World Series isn't guaranteed every year, but the front office is actually sincere about building a roster for sustained contention...

 

 

That old timer was the incredibly awesome Arthur Hunnicutt, who also appeared in such classics as “El Dorado” and “Cat Ballou.” In the latter, he played an aging Butch Cassidy.

 

Hunnicutt’s best talent, besides his non-stop rambling of nonsensical metaphors, was looking 80 while in his 40s. He was only in his mid-fifties for that Twilight Zone episode. (I believe he appeared in another episode of that show as well.)

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

That old timer was the incredibly awesome Arthur Hunnicutt, who also appeared in such classics as “El Dorado” and “Cat Ballou.” In the latter, he played an aging Butch Cassidy.

 

Hunnicutt’s best talent, besides his non-stop rambling of nonsensical metaphors, was looking 80 while in his 40s. He was only in his mid-fifties for that Twilight Zone episode. (I believe he appeared in another episode of that show as well.)

 

Damn, I knew it.

 

Back in the day, mid-50s was the old 70s. I was looking in my 40s in the 80s.

[sk7326]

If you redo that offseason and spend the Hanley/Pablo money differently:

SP Ervin Santana

SP AJ Burnett (don't sign Masterson either)

3B Chase Headley

OF Nelson Cruz

 

Yeah. Ramirez and Sandoval were near the top of most of the FA Rankings ... Sandoval's utter collapse in particular was hard to predict. I was worried it would not be a good value, but I thought he would be a functional big leaguer.

[harmony]

I don’t see why the Mariners would be so willing to move the Castillo. Now if you want Robbie Ray, he can be had for a song. And not even a good song. “Pictures of Matchstick Men” might be enough…

Free agents pitchers find Seattle more attractive than free agent hitters so.

 

The Mariners would likely trade Luis Castiilo only for a prearb impact bat to free up payroll to sign a free agent pitcher. Think an interesting trade centered on Cincinnati third baseman Noelvi Marte.

 

BTW Castillo's contract, which has a no-trade clause, guarantees just $91 million over four years with a $25 million vesting option for as fifth year.

[Bellhorn04]

Red Sox with Reported Interest in Teoscar Hernandez.

[Bellhorn04]

Some post mortem on Yamamoto:

 

-It seems that "the fix was in" to a certain extent in that he wanted to play for the Dodgers from the start. He took the Mets offer of 12/325 to LA, they matched it, and the Mets weren't given a chance to increase their offer.

-Article in the Boston Herald about the Sox and Yamamoto suggests they were willing to exceed what they paid Price and that was about it. Which would leave them roughly $100 million short.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Red Sox with Reported Interest in Teoscar Hernandez.

 

A guy worth discussing.

 

My first reaction was comparing him to righty power hitters the Sox once recruited like Jack Clark or Andre Dawson, when they were cooked. But Teoscar is only 31 (Clark and Dawson were still stars at 31, back when 31 was older than it is now, with modern training/arthoscopy/nutrition).

 

Teoscar is a two-time Silver Slugger whose Similar Batters on bb-ref include ex-Red Sox Tony Conigliaro, Hunter Renfroe and Yoenis Cespedes. And THern hasn't had the pleasure of hitting in Fenway Park for 81 games a season.

 

See how optimistic a poster can be in the dread of winter?

[notin]

A guy worth discussing.

 

My first reaction was comparing him to righty power hitters the Sox once recruited like Jack Clark or Andre Dawson, when they were cooked. But Teoscar is only 31 (Clark and Dawson were still stars at 31, back when 31 was older than it is now, with modern training/arthoscopy/nutrition).

 

Teoscar is a two-time Silver Slugger whose Similar Batters on bb-ref include ex-Red Sox Tony Conigliaro, Hunter Renfroe and Yoenis Cespedes. And THern hasn't had the pleasure of hitting in Fenway Park for 81 games a season.

 

See how optimistic a poster can be in the dread of winter?

 

Can he pitch?

[notin]

Red Sox with Reported Interest in Teoscar Hernandez.

 

Perfect!!

 

Another corner OF who can’t field and is coming off a season where he has a lower OPS+ than Masataka Yoshida!

[Bellhorn04]

Perfect!!

 

Another corner OF who can’t field and is coming off a season where he has a lower OPS+ than Masataka Yoshida!

 

Checks all the boxes!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Can he pitch?

 

Who cares -- we're not good enough yet to pay for good pitchers.

[Bellhorn04]

We need to let it sink in that the Sox were NOT serious players for Moto.

 

So what exactly are they in on?

[notin]

Who cares -- we're not good enough yet to pay for good pitchers.

 

Just bad outfielders?

[notin]

We need to let it sink in that the Sox were NOT serious players for Moto.

 

So what exactly are they in on?

 

I told you that all along.

 

Granted, I said the Mets were. But most important was the Sox weren’t.

 

That leaves Snell, Montgomery, Giolito, Stroman, Montas, Clevinger. And the longshot of long shots - Brad Keller (included because of Breslow’s reported interest in hard-throwing pitchers, which Keller certainly is.)

 

 

Still some trade market options as well…

[Bellhorn04]

I told you that all along.

 

Granted, I said the Mets were. But most important was the Sox weren’t.

 

That leaves Snell, Montgomery, Giolito, Stroman, Montas, Clevinger. And the longshot of long shots - Brad Keller (included because of Breslow’s reported interest in hard-throwing pitchers, which Keller certainly is.)

 

 

Still some trade market options as well…

 

I think Snell is clearly out, especially with the lost draft pick.

 

I also have a lot of doubt they're willing to pay Montgomery's price.

 

It's so close to making more sense to punt.

 

But I'm sure they will make a move or two to at least give the appearance they're trying to do something.

[notin]

I think Snell is clearly out, especially with the lost draft pick.

 

I also have a lot of doubt they're willing to pay Montgomery's price.

 

It's so close to making more sense to punt.

 

But I'm sure they will make a move or two to at least give the appearance they're trying to do something.

 

So why was Bloom fired at all?

 

And stop being unobservanr and unimaginative. It’s been pointed out HUNDREDS of times free agency is the worst place ti get pitching. Short term deals? Sure. But game-changing players? I’ve asked dozens of times the last time one of those deals worked out for Boston. And really, no good answer.

 

Now the trade market is a different story. Sale, Schilling and Pedro headline that list. And I know a lot of fans would prefer a free agent and keep the prospects, as free agents cost “only money”, but that’s because we’re all not thinking like team owners. We’re thinking like poor people. They’re thinking like billionaires. Prospects and money are two methods of acquiring new players, but in general, owners like to keep the money. Largely because, unlike prospects, everyone accepts it. They can’t go to the Lamborghini dealer and, when he asks how will you be paying, respond in good faith with “will you accept an 18yo Baseball America top 100 shortstop prospect and a 22yo MLB-ready starting pitcher?”

 

It turns out, Italian sports car dealers are not so into prospects.

 

Breslow been talking trade market all along, rarely mentioning free agent pitchers. I expect more along that line…

[Randy Red Sox]

We need to let it sink in that the Sox were NOT serious players for Moto.

 

So what exactly are they in on?[/QUOT

 

Teoscar Hernandez apparently

[Bellhorn04]

So why was Bloom fired at all?

 

And stop being unobservanr and unimaginative. It’s been pointed out HUNDREDS of times free agency is the worst place ti get pitching. Short term deals? Sure. But game-changing players? I’ve asked dozens of times the last time one of those deals worked out for Boston. And really, no good answer.

 

It's not the right question.

 

The question is how do they work out in general. The results are obviously mixed, but there are successful ones.

 

I will submit that Lackey was a good signing. He contributed to a title and when he was healthy he pitched well. We were better off with him than without him.

[Bellhorn04]

It's not the right question.

 

The question is how do they work out in general. The results are obviously mixed, but there are successful ones.

 

I will submit that Lackey was a good signing. He contributed to a title and when he was healthy he pitched well. We were better off with him than without him.

 

Take a look at Lackey's WAR and his dollar values on FanGraphs.

 

It's a myth that it wasn't a good signing.

[moonslav59]

Red Sox with Reported Interest in Teoscar Hernandez.

 

Yuck.