Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Old Red]

Agreed, but it was not a certainty, he'd retire at 33, back when we traded for him.

 

Not for retirement, but his bat going away pretty much was.

[notin]

No doubt shortstop is one position where an elite fielder can be about as valuable as an elite hitter.

 

SS, CF and catcher…

[moonslav59]

Not for retirement, but his bat going away pretty much was.

 

He hit well in 2020 and extremely bad in 2021. I had lost hope in him, but it was not "certain" he'd never hit .650 again, which is about what he needed to do to be a clear plus WAR guy.

[moonslav59]

SS, CF and catcher…

 

Yes, but SS is way ahead of CF and 2B.

 

Catcher is hard to define, but for everything a catcher does, behind the plate, including getting the most fro each pitcher is probably much closer to SS than CF/2B

[notin]

But you also continue to say you were OK with his performance in 2022.

 

I do?

[notin]

Yes, but SS is way ahead of CF and 2B.

 

Catcher is hard to define, but for everything a catcher does, behind the plate, including getting the most fro each pitcher is probably much closer to SS than CF/2B

 

I’d say catcher defense is most important.

 

SS and CF are both far and away more important than other positions. I won’t argue SS is more important or not. But both have big advantages.

 

As of right now, Valdez is the Sox staying 2b. Do you prefer him over someone who can field? We know he can’t…

[mvp 78]

I’d say catcher defense is most important.

 

SS and CF are both far and away more important than other positions. I won’t argue SS is more important or not. But both have big advantages.

 

As of right now, Valdez is the Sox staying 2b. Do you prefer him over someone who can field? We know he can’t…

 

I would bet that Reyes is probably in line for most of the reps even though Valdez has the platoon advantage. Valdez is just such a horrible defender and they need to move beyond that.

[Bellhorn04]

I do?

 

I thought you've said you were fine with him as long as he was the #9 hitter.

[Old Red]

He hit well in 2020 and extremely bad in 2021. I had lost hope in him, but it was not "certain" he'd never hit .650 again, which is about what he needed to do to be a clear plus WAR guy.

 

He hit well in 2020, and that’s one of the reasons he got the contract that he did from Milwaukee, which was something the Red Sox wouldn’t have, and didn’t give him, but Bloom traded for him a year later, and took on that contract, which was more than a head scratcher from most. Nothing was certain that he wouldn’t hit again, but it was more likely than not as he got older.

[notin]

I thought you've said you were fine with him as long as he was the #9 hitter.

 

I certainly did, something I would also say about Wendle.

 

And it turned out to be a pretty good thing we had JBJ in 2022 since Kike missed excessive time and we had no other viable options for CF. Cora even had to put Renfroe out there a couple times…

[notin]

I would bet that Reyes is probably in line for most of the reps even though Valdez has the platoon advantage. Valdez is just such a horrible defender and they need to move beyond that.

 

Reyes was a pleasant surprise last year, but I absolutely do not expect a repeat at the plate. He has historically struggled to even maintain holding an MLB roster spot.

 

Is ReyEd a step up or down over Wendle?

[Old Red]

I certainly did, something I would also say about Wendle.

 

And it turned out to be a pretty good thing we had JBJ in 2022 since Kike missed excessive time and we had no other viable options for CF. Cora even had to put Renfroe out there a couple times…

 

It was so good to have had JBJ in 2022 that the Red Sox released him on Aug 4th.🙈

[notin]

It was so good to have had JBJ in 2022 that the Red Sox released him on Aug 4th.

 

And how did they do after that?

And

Edited November 30, 2023 by notin

[Old Red]

And how did they do after that?

 

The first answer should have been why they released him in the first place if he was so valuable. Are you saying the team didn’t do well after Aug 4th of 2022, because they released JBJ?

[notin]

The first answer should have been why they released him in the first place if he was so valuable. Are you saying the team didn’t do well after Aug 4th of 2022, because they released JBJ?

 

Just asking how they did.

[Bellhorn04]

Just asking how they did.

 

They stunk, just like they stunk after moving Kike this year.

[Old Red]

They stunk, just like they stunk after moving Kike this year.

 

I think trading Vaz two days before they released JBJ had a lot more to do with it in 2022.

[notin]

I think trading Vaz two days before they released JBJ had a lot more to do with it in 2022.

 

Vaz was another defensive loss. McGuire certainly hit a lot better than Vazquez…

[mvp 78]

Reyes was a pleasant surprise last year, but I absolutely do not expect a repeat at the plate. He has historically struggled to even maintain holding an MLB roster spot.

 

Is ReyEd a step up or down over Wendle?

 

Depends on if Wendle is going to hit as bad as he did in '23.

[mvp 78]

They stunk, just like they stunk after moving Kike this year.

 

Maybe they should have had some sort of deadline fire sale in '22 then?

[Bellhorn04]

Maybe they should have had some sort of deadline fire sale in '22 then?

 

Deadlines and dead horses...

[moonslav59]

Depends on if Wendle is going to hit as bad as he did in '23.

 

'22 wasn't all that great, but with his D, it would be fine.

[moonslav59]

Vaz was another defensive loss. McGuire certainly hit a lot better than Vazquez…

 

I'm not sure Vaz was as good on D as many felt he was. He wasn't bad, and he did well in some areas, but I never felt he did very well on maximizing staff production.

[mvp 78]

'22 wasn't all that great, but with his D, it would be fine.

 

I'd take '22 Wendle for 2M to be the starting 2B and clear up some of the clutter at 2B the Sox currently have. Hindsight of course.

[mvp 78]

I'm not sure Vaz was as good on D as many felt he was. He wasn't bad, and he did well in some areas, but I never felt he did very well on maximizing staff production.

 

Wong has a nice arm, but sucks at framing and blocking. Reese has a bad arm, but is ok at framing and blocking.

 

Vaz did all of the above at a relatively proficient level. He's just a good all around catcher.

 

There's nobody on the current MLB squad blocking the prospects from taking over a fulltime role at that position.

[dgalehouse]

JBJ seemed to lose confidence after leaving Boston and went downhill quickly. But I think he was the best defensive centerfielder the Sox have had. So many great catches and a great arm. And he was not all that horrible of a hitter during his run in Boston. Most importantly, he was a winner. An important part of Red Sox division winners and championships. And that really is what it is all about.

[Larry Cook]

Tanner burns might be someone in the rule 5 draft that we could take and if his control is good, we could have another whitlock on our hands

[moonslav59]

JBJ seemed to lose confidence after leaving Boston and went downhill quickly. But I think he was the best defensive centerfielder the Sox have had. So many great catches and a great arm. And he was not all that horrible of a hitter during his run in Boston. Most importantly, he was a winner. An important part of Red Sox division winners and championships. And that really is what it is all about.

 

He was always a streaky hitter, even when he had good years.

 

Man that 2021-2022 streak was a horrible and long one!

 

798 PAs at .530 has to be one of the all time worst for that long of a stretch and that amount of PAs.

 

I think the hope was he'd snap out of the streak. It never happened.

[mvp 78]

Tanner burns might be someone in the rule 5 draft that we could take and if his control is good, we could have another whitlock on our hands

 

Prior to last season, he was ranked in the 40's (FanGraphs) for the Guardians, whereas Whitlock was in the top 20 for the Yanks. He walks a lot of guys and doesn't have a third pitch apparently. Not sure the Sox need another bullpen guy to stash.

 

If there's a Rule 5 guy that could make sense it would be Carlos De La Cruz (PHI) a RHB who plays OF/1B. I mentioned a some others a few days ago like Kristian Robinson, another RHB OFer.

[mvp 78]

@tylermilliken_

Diamond Baseball Holdings has reached an agreement to buy the Worcester Red Sox, per @MikeSilvermanBB.

 

Nothing will change with the WooSox’ 35-year lease to play at Polar Park. 32 years remain on that deal.

 

DBH already owns @salemredsox and @PortlandSeaDogs.