Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Bellhorn04]

Why not? Do you disparage praising anyone who isn’t a Hall of Famer?

 

To paraphrase Judge Smaels “the world needs jabronis, too”…

 

Good Caddyshack reference.

[moonslav59]

I’m ok with Wong starting. It wouldn’t be horrible to upgrade the starting catcher, but fix SP and 2b first…

 

I'm okay with our catching tandem, as is, too. I think both can still improve.

 

I'd be fine with an upgrade, but I'm not sure we'll have enough resources to upgrade areas of greater need, 2 of which you mentioned.

 

SP

 

SP

 

RH Power bat, which could play...

2B

CF/RF (trade Dugo or Duran?)

C

 

Maybe even LH RP ahead of C.

[Randy Red Sox]

can someone please explain the exact procedure on posting for Yamamoto. It is my understanding that the post bids are secret and that only the HIGHEST bidder in the posting gets to negotiate a contract with him? Also the posting fee does NOT count against your payroll.

[Randy Red Sox]

Just wondering, now that two relievers are in charge of fixing the pitching: if the Sox get outbid on the top handful of free agent starters, if they would pivot to stockpiling a power bullpen as an option.

 

Instead of breaking the bank for Hader, Brez could probably sign two other guys who throw over 100 mph -- Hicks and Fujinami -- plus, add a recent Bailey pupil in Manaea as swingman.

 

First off there is no excuse for the Sox being out-bid on ANY pitching after slashing the payroll for a few years now. Having said that I would stay away from Montgomery and focus on Snell. I like Gray but he is 34 now and he had a tough time in nY and not sure if he could handle Boston or not either. This would be in addition to being ALL IN on Yamamoto. If we get 2 SP at the top of the rotation our BP will be just fine given that Whitlock and either Pivetta or Houck will slide into the pen as well.

[Bellhorn04]

First off there is no excuse for the Sox being out-bid on ANY pitching after slashing the payroll for a few years now. Having said that I would stay away from Montgomery and focus on Snell. I like Gray but he is 34 now and he had a tough time in nY and not sure if he could handle Boston or not either. This would be in addition to being ALL IN on Yamamoto. If we get 2 SP at the top of the rotation our BP will be just fine given that Whitlock and either Pivetta or Houck will slide into the pen as well.

 

Gray's problems in NY appear to have been caused by them messing with his pitch mix.

[jacksonianmarch]

Sox really have no excuse. The offense is good enough. The pen, if the right guys are moved back to pen roles, should be solid. Their rotation is short 2 top arms. If they don't get them, there really isn't much excuse

[jacksonianmarch]

The AL is wide open. Houston showed cracks this year. Texas just got hot at the right time, but they weren't great. Baltimore and TB had great seasons, but Baltimore has no rotation and TB lost its best player to kiddy diddling. The Yanks looked old. Toronto just hasnt reached its potential. Normally, a last place team should take the measured approach and team build, but the sox aren't far from being a playoff team and without a true top team, they can win it if they just add to the top of the rotation

[moonslav59]

Back to the talk about how to categorize (or name) differing levels of SP'ers in MLB.

 

First, so many good pitchers are hurt, so often, it's hard to claim they are better than another pitcher, who pitches much more often, but maybe not as well. The days of 30-60 pitchers with 190 IP a season seem to be over and done with. Only 15 pitchers had 190+, this season. Only 36 had more than 169 IP! How much value do we place on them vs better SP'ers with less than 150 or 120 IP? I'm sure the answer is subjective, and we all have our own opinions on how much IP affects how we value a SP'er. (It's also hard to project future IP, but going by recent past and age seems to be a logical way to reach what to expect.)

 

Secondly, how do we determine who are the best SP'ers in MLB or even on each team? IP? fWAR/bWAR? ERA? xFIP? W-Ls? All of the above and more?

 

Thirdly, do we use 2023 numbers? 2022-2023? 2021-2023? Career?

 

With so many differing factors and opinions on all of these three areas and how much each is used to determine value, it's hard to find agreement.

 

For argument's sake, I'm going to choose fWAR, since it uses many stats to determine a value placement of past performance. More IP adds to fWAR value, if the pitcher is good. xFIP is more important to fWAR than bWAR and that factors in a lot of variables that are hard to do in our heads. Now, here is what I found, team by team for 2023 only:

 

33 pitchers had an fWAR or 3.0 or higher, roughy one per 30 teams, but 8 teams had 2 on their staff and SEA had 3. Nine teams, including the Sox, did not have a top 33 SP'er by fWAR in 2023.

 

Top fWAR SP'ers by team:

 

PHI: 5.9 Wheeler, 3.8 Nola

ATL: 5.5 Strider

TOR: 5.3 Gausman, 3.0 Berrios

MIN: 5.3 Gray, 4.5 Lopez

NYY: 5.2 Cole

ARI: 5.2 Gallen, 3.3 M Kelly

CHC: 4.9 Steele

SGF: 4.9 Webb

TBR: 4.8 Eflin, 3.2 Glasnow

SEA: 4.4 Kirby, 3.7 Castillo, 3.2 Gilbert

HOU: 4.3 Valdez

STL: 4.3 Monty (to TEX), 3.1 Mikolas

SDP: 3.9 Snell

BAL: 3.8 Bradish

MIA: 3.7 Luzardo, 3.0 Garrett

CWS: 3.7 Cease

MIL: 3.4 Burnes, 3.0 Peralta

NYM: 3.4 Senga, 3.3 Verlander (to HOU)

DET: 3.3 Skubal, 3.0 DET

PIT: 3.3 Keller

CLE: 3.0 Bibee

 

14 Pitchers (in RED) were at 4.0+ fWAR. One could argue they were true "aces," but others may say no. Some below 4.0 might be viewed as better than some above 4.0. If you take the example of Monty, which was fiercely debated, earlier, this week, by fWAR in 2023, only, he was better than 18 team's best SP and worse than 11.

 

The "other 9" teams' best SP by fWAR in 2023:

36. LAD B Miller 2.8

45. LAA Detmers 2.5

46. TEX Eovaldi 2.5

56. BOS Crawford 2.2 (Sale was at #60 at 2.1, Bello was #86 at 1.6)

58. CIN Abbott 2.2

66. KCR Singer 1.9

80. OAK Blackburn 1.7

84. WSN Josiah Gray 1.6

95. COL Freeland 1.2

 

If you go by rough groupings of 30 SPers per group, a team like COL's best SP was actually as good as the average upper 4th SP'er grade. OAK & WSN had lower #3's as their best SP'er. KCR had an upper 3. BOS and CIN had lower #2's as their best SP'er.

 

If you go by the 30 pitcher categorization, BOS has 2 lower #2's (Crawford & Sale) and a lower #3 in Bello as their best 3 SP'ers. In theory, if we add two pitchers categorized as #1's or 2's, those 3 SP'er ranked in the 2-3 groups would now be our 3-5's.

 

Now, let's look at the 3 year numbers (2021-2023.) Since so many pitchers change teams, it's hard to do this by team, so I'm going to just go by fWAR rankings.

 

First, IP:

3 pitchers averaged over 190 IP per season:

619 Alcantara MIA

591 Cole NYY

579 Nola PHI

Only 19 pitchers averaged over 170 IP in the last 3 seasons, including the 3 above!

The others were Burnes (MIL), Wheeler (PHI), Webb (SFG), Berrios (2 teams), Gausman (2 teams), Bassitt (3), Gibson (3), Kelly (AZ), Castillo (2), Valdez (HOU), Cease (CWS), Giolito (3), Monty (3), Lyles (3), Morton (ATL), Gallen (AZ)

(PHI & AZ have two on this list, so only 17 teams had 1+ SP with 170+ IP per year, average. That's about half.)

 

Here is an arbitrary categorization of the best fWAR SP'ers since 2021: (remember, some very good younger pitchers did not pitch all 3 years and could be better than some, listed here. Some were injured and may not be going forward. Some were not injured and may get hurt going forward.)

 

fWAR

Top 10

14+: Wheeler, Gausman, Burnes, Nola

11-13.9: Cole, Webb, Alcantara, Cease, Scherzer, Rodon

 

Next 11:

10-10.9: Castillo, Ohtani, Gallen, Fried, Valdez, Mony, Gray

9.7-9.8: Snell, Woodruff, Strider, Lopez

 

Next 10:

9.3-9.6: Kershaw, Urias, Bieber, Darvish, Verlander8.7-9.2: Eovaldi, Peralta, Bassitt, Morton, Musgrove

 

 

deGrom is #32 at 8.6 and is better than just about anyone in the top 31, but does not pitch enough to earn the value needed to be top 31.

 

After deGrom at #32:

#33-46 (7.0-8.5 fWAR)

Gilbert, Stroman, Berrios, Eflin, Cobb, McClanahan, Sandoval, Gibson

ERod, Kirby, Steele, Suarez, TAnderson

 

The rest of the top 60 (5.8 to 6.9 fWAR:)

Giolito, Singer, Skubal, Lynn, Buehler, Wainwright, MKeller, Mikolas

Mahle, TWalker, Luzardo, Montas, Jon Gray, Glasnow

 

61-75 (5.0-5.7:) Quintana, Wacha, LGarcia, Manoah, Javier, Taillon, Cortes, Ray

Rasmussen, TRogers, Freeland, Dunning, Marquez, Matz, JRyan

 

76-90 (4.2-4.9:) MPerez, Senzatella, Pivetta, Garrett, McKenzie, Ober, Miley, Detmers

Quantrill, Manaea, Civale, Bradish, Houser, Kendricks, Greinke

 

Categorizing by 30's has serious flaws, no doubt. For example, nobody views Pivetta as a #3 SP'er, but it does show who gives the IP and quality, combined.

 

Other notables:

92. Kluber

93. RHill

100. Houck

102. Springs

104. Urguidy

108. Maeda

109. Sale

112. Ryu

115. Lugo

116. Bello

122. Lorenzen

126. Clevinger

127. Flaherty

128. Crawford

130. Blackburn

135. M Boyd

(All over 2.0 fWAR since 2021)

 

The 150th SP'er (5 SP x 30 teams) had an fWAR of 1.9, or about a 0.6 fWAR per year x 3.

 

IMO, we need to add 2 solid SP'ers and have 2 of these 3 things happen:

We need to see Bello put a whole season together. (His second half was pretty bad.)

We need Sale to be healthy, unless we add 3 good SP'ers.

We need Pivetta or 1 from Houck/Crawford to be a solid #4/5.

 

Getting Yamo + Lugo would make me happy.

Monty + Gray would, too.

 

More likely, we might add Monty ot Gray plus a Lugo or Flaherty type.

[moonslav59]

First off there is no excuse for the Sox being out-bid on ANY pitching after slashing the payroll for a few years now. Having said that I would stay away from Montgomery and focus on Snell. I like Gray but he is 34 now and he had a tough time in nY and not sure if he could handle Boston or not either. This would be in addition to being ALL IN on Yamamoto. If we get 2 SP at the top of the rotation our BP will be just fine given that Whitlock and either Pivetta or Houck will slide into the pen as well.

 

The good thing about Gray is that the contract length should be much shorter than Snell and Monty.

I like Monty over Snell and Gray, but it is close. (No loss of a draft pick tilts the balance, for me.)

 

I think Whitlock will be in the pen, for sure, despite Brez saying they'd stretch out Houck & Whitlock.

 

Pivetta seems like the best pick for our #5, unless he looks awful in ST'ing.

 

Of course, Sale's health will determine who our #4/5 will be: Sale, Houck or Crawford. The others would be in the pen.

 

Bello should be our #3, not our #2, but that depends on who we add.

[Randy Red Sox]

Sox really have no excuse. The offense is good enough. The pen, if the right guys are moved back to pen roles, should be solid. Their rotation is short 2 top arms. If they don't get them, there really isn't much excuse

 

could not agree more although I would like to add a decent everyday 2B

[moonslav59]

can someone please explain the exact procedure on posting for Yamamoto. It is my understanding that the post bids are secret and that only the HIGHEST bidder in the posting gets to negotiate a contract with him? Also the posting fee does NOT count against your payroll.

 

They don't do it by highest posting fee offered, anymore. The posting fee is fixed.

 

Yamo chooses who to sign with- most likely the highest or near highest bidder.

 

Many Asian pitchers prefer to pitch on the left coast, due to travel times going home, but who knows with Yamo.

[Randy Red Sox]

The good thing about Gray is that the contract length should be much shorter than Snell and Monty.

I like Monty over Snell and Gray, but it is close. (No loss of a draft pick tilts the balance, for me.)

 

I think Whitlock will be in the pen, for sure, despite Brez saying they'd stretch out Houck & Whitlock.

 

Pivetta seems like the best pick for our #5, unless he looks awful in ST'ing.

 

Of course, Sale's health will determine who our #4/5 will be: Sale, Houck or Crawford. The others would be in the pen.

 

Bello should be our #3, not our #2, but that depends on who we add.

 

i forgot about the draft pick factor. Do all 3 of Montgomery, Snell, and Gray cost a draft pick?

[Randy Red Sox]

Back to the talk about how to categorize (or name) differing levels of SP'ers in MLB.

 

First, so many good pitchers are hurt, so often, it's hard to claim they are better than another pitcher, who pitches much more often, but maybe not as well. The days of 30-60 pitchers with 190 IP a season seem to be over and done with. Only 15 pitchers had 190+, this season. Only 36 had more than 169 IP! How much value do we place on them vs better SP'ers with less than 150 or 120 IP? I'm sure the answer is subjective, and we all have our own opinions on how much IP affects how we value a SP'er. (It's also hard to project future IP, but going by recent past and age seems to be a logical way to reach what to expect.)

 

Secondly, how do we determine who are the best SP'ers in MLB or even on each team? IP? fWAR/bWAR? ERA? xFIP? W-Ls? All of the above and more?

 

Thirdly, do we use 2023 numbers? 2022-2023? 2021-2023? Career?

 

With so many differing factors and opinions on all of these three areas and how much each is used to determine value, it's hard to find agreement.

 

For argument's sake, I'm going to choose fWAR, since it uses many stats to determine a value placement of past performance. More IP adds to fWAR value, if the pitcher is good. xFIP is more important to fWAR than bWAR and that factors in a lot of variables that are hard to do in our heads. Now, here is what I found, team by team for 2023 only:

 

33 pitchers had an fWAR or 3.0 or higher, roughy one per 30 teams, but 8 teams had 2 on their staff and SEA had 3. Nine teams, including the Sox, did not have a top 33 SP'er by fWAR in 2023.

 

Top fWAR SP'ers by team:

 

PHI: 5.9 Wheeler, 3.8 Nola

ATL: 5.5 Strider

TOR: 5.3 Gausman, 3.0 Berrios

MIN: 5.3 Gray, 4.5 Lopez

NYY: 5.2 Cole

ARI: 5.2 Gallen, 3.3 M Kelly

CHC: 4.9 Steele

SGF: 4.9 Webb

TBR: 4.8 Eflin, 3.2 Glasnow

SEA: 4.4 Kirby, 3.7 Castillo, 3.2 Gilbert

HOU: 4.3 Valdez

STL: 4.3 Monty (to TEX), 3.1 Mikolas

SDP: 3.9 Snell

BAL: 3.8 Bradish

MIA: 3.7 Luzardo, 3.0 Garrett

CWS: 3.7 Cease

MIL: 3.4 Burnes, 3.0 Peralta

NYM: 3.4 Senga, 3.3 Verlander (to HOU)

DET: 3.3 Skubal, 3.0 DET

PIT: 3.3 Keller

CLE: 3.0 Bibee

 

14 Pitchers (in RED) were at 4.0+ fWAR. One could argue they were true "aces," but others may say no. Some below 4.0 might be viewed as better than some above 4.0. If you take the example of Monty, which was fiercely debated, earlier, this week, by fWAR in 2023, only, he was better than 18 team's best SP and worse than 11.

 

The "other 9" teams' best SP by fWAR in 2023:

36. LAD B Miller 2.8

45. LAA Detmers 2.5

46. TEX Eovaldi 2.5

56. BOS Crawford 2.2 (Sale was at #60 at 2.1, Bello was #86 at 1.6)

58. CIN Abbott 2.2

66. KCR Singer 1.9

80. OAK Blackburn 1.7

84. WSN Josiah Gray 1.6

95. COL Freeland 1.2

 

If you go by rough groupings of 30 SPers per group, a team like COL's best SP was actually as good as the average upper 4th SP'er grade. OAK & WSN had lower #3's as their best SP'er. KCR had an upper 3. BOS and CIN had lower #2's as their best SP'er.

 

If you go by the 30 pitcher categorization, BOS has 2 lower #2's (Crawford & Sale) and a lower #3 in Bello as their best 3 SP'ers. In theory, if we add two pitchers categorized as #1's or 2's, those 3 SP'er ranked in the 2-3 groups would now be our 3-5's.

 

Now, let's look at the 3 year numbers (2021-2023.) Since so many pitchers change teams, it's hard to do this by team, so I'm going to just go by fWAR rankings.

 

First, IP:

3 pitchers averaged over 190 IP per season:

619 Alcantara MIA

591 Cole NYY

579 Nola PHI

Only 19 pitchers averaged over 170 IP in the last 3 seasons, including the 3 above!

The others were Burnes (MIL), Wheeler (PHI), Webb (SFG), Berrios (2 teams), Gausman (2 teams), Bassitt (3), Gibson (3), Kelly (AZ), Castillo (2), Valdez (HOU), Cease (CWS), Giolito (3), Monty (3), Lyles (3), Morton (ATL), Gallen (AZ)

(PHI & AZ have two on this list, so only 17 teams had 1+ SP with 170+ IP per year, average. That's about half.)

 

Here is an arbitrary categorization of the best fWAR SP'ers since 2021: (remember, some very good younger pitchers did not pitch all 3 years and could be better than some, listed here. Some were injured and may not be going forward. Some were not injured and may get hurt going forward.)

 

fWAR

Top 10

14+: Wheeler, Gausman, Burnes, Nola

11-13.9: Cole, Webb, Alcantara, Cease, Scherzer, Rodon

 

Next 11:

10-10.9: Castillo, Ohtani, Gallen, Fried, Valdez, Mony, Gray

9.7-9.8: Snell, Woodruff, Strider, Lopez

 

Next 10:

9.3-9.6: Kershaw, Urias, Bieber, Darvish, Verlander8.7-9.2: Eovaldi, Peralta, Bassitt, Morton, Musgrove

 

 

deGrom is #32 at 8.6 and is better than just about anyone in the top 31, but does not pitch enough to earn the value needed to be top 31.

 

After deGrom at #32:

#33-46 (7.0-8.5 fWAR)

Gilbert, Stroman, Berrios, Eflin, Cobb, McClanahan, Sandoval, Gibson

ERod, Kirby, Steele, Suarez, TAnderson

 

The rest of the top 60 (5.8 to 6.9 fWAR:)

Giolito, Singer, Skubal, Lynn, Buehler, Wainwright, MKeller, Mikolas

Mahle, TWalker, Luzardo, Montas, Jon Gray, Glasnow

 

61-75 (5.0-5.7:) Quintana, Wacha, LGarcia, Manoah, Javier, Taillon, Cortes, Ray

Rasmussen, TRogers, Freeland, Dunning, Marquez, Matz, JRyan

 

76-90 (4.2-4.9:) MPerez, Senzatella, Pivetta, Garrett, McKenzie, Ober, Miley, Detmers

Quantrill, Manaea, Civale, Bradish, Houser, Kendricks, Greinke

 

Categorizing by 30's has serious flaws, no doubt. For example, nobody views Pivetta as a #3 SP'er, but it does show who gives the IP and quality, combined.

 

Other notables:

92. Kluber

93. RHill

100. Houck

102. Springs

104. Urguidy

108. Maeda

109. Sale

112. Ryu

115. Lugo

116. Bello

122. Lorenzen

126. Clevinger

127. Flaherty

128. Crawford

130. Blackburn

135. M Boyd

(All over 2.0 fWAR since 2021)

 

The 150th SP'er (5 SP x 30 teams) had an fWAR of 1.9, or about a 0.6 fWAR per year x 3.

 

IMO, we need to add 2 solid SP'ers and have 2 of these 3 things happen:

We need to see Bello put a whole season together. (His second half was pretty bad.)

We need Sale to be healthy, unless we add 3 good SP'ers.

We need Pivetta or 1 from Houck/Crawford to be a solid #4/5.

 

Getting Yamo + Lugo would make me happy.

Monty + Gray would, too.

 

More likely, we might add Monty ot Gray plus a Lugo or Flaherty type.

 

if anyone reads this whole post please let me know

[moonslav59]

i forgot about the draft pick factor. Do all 3 of Montgomery, Snell, and Gray cost a draft pick?

 

Gray and Snell YES

Monty No. He was traded midseason.

Yamo NO

Imanaga NO

ERod I think NO (second time through free agency)

[moonslav59]

if anyone reads this whole post please let me know

 

lol

[notin]

if anyone reads this whole post please let me know

 

I read the entirety of this post. Don’t see the big deal. It’s only like 10 words long…

[Randy Red Sox]

Gray and Snell YES

Monty No. He was traded midseason.

Yamo NO

Imanaga NO

ERod I think NO (second time through free agency)

 

in that case I pass on Gray and Snell and still not real high on Montgomery. Hard pass on Erod

[Randy Red Sox]

I read the entirety of this post. Don’t see the big deal. It’s only like 10 words long…

 

 

funny guy

[moonslav59]

in that case I pass on Gray and Snell and still not real high on Montgomery. Hard pass on Erod

 

When we are talking 5-7 year deals, I'm not sure how much losing a draft pick does to projected value.

 

I believe it is NOT the first round pick lost.

[Randy Red Sox]

When we are talking 5-7 year deals, I'm not sure how much losing a draft pick does to projected value.

 

I believe it is NOT the first round pick lost.

 

 

Sorry as much as I like sonny Grey there is nO WAY I sign him for 5 years.

[moonslav59]

Sorry as much as I like sonny Grey there is nO WAY I sign him for 5 years.

 

Some are saying the same about Snell or Monty for 7 years.

 

Maybe Gray takes a 4 year deal, but I doubt it.

 

The BB/9 numbers for Snell scare the bejesus out of me. I kinda like this priority order:

 

1. Yamo 7-11 yrs

2. Monty 6-7 yrs

3. Gray 4-5 yrs

4. Snell 6-7 yrs

 

Then a big drop: (#3-4 SP'ers)

5. Imanaga 3-5 yrs?

6. ERod 5-6 yrs

7. Lugo 3-4 yrs

8. Wacha 2-3 yrs

 

(#4 starters- I'm not that interested, but if it improves the pen by moving Crawford or Houck there, maybe it's worth it)

9. Y Rod (27 yr old from Cuba) 3-4 yrs (RP or SP?)

10. Stroman 2-3 yrs

11. Giolito 2-3 yrs

12. Flaherty 2-3 yrs

13. Clevinger 2 yrs

14. Mahle 2 yrs

15. Paxton 1 yr

 

(#5s- not the way I like to "improve" the rotation)

16. Lorenzen 2 yrs

17. Montas 1 yr

18. Severino 1 yr

19. Maeda 2 yrs

 

The Wild Cards:

1A. Ohtani 6+ ys (Not interested in paying large for a DH & injured pitcher)

2A. Clayton Kershaw 1 ys (Will likely sign with LAD)

2B. Trevor Bauer 1-2 yrs (I might give him a try.)

4A. Julio Urias (Good enough to be a top 5 SP signing, but he may end up in jail: PASS!)

[Randy Red Sox]

Some are saying the same about Snell or Monty for 7 years.

 

Maybe Gray takes a 4 year deal, but I doubt it.

 

The BB/9 numbers for Snell scare the bejesus out of me. I kinda like this priority order:

 

1. Yamo 7-11 yrs

2. Monty 6-7 yrs

3. Gray 4-5 yrs

4. Snell 6-7 yrs

 

Then a big drop: (#3-4 SP'ers)

5. Imanaga 3-5 yrs?

6. ERod 5-6 yrs

7. Lugo 3-4 yrs

8. Wacha 2-3 yrs

 

(#4 starters- I'm not that interested, but if it improves the pen by moving Crawford or Houck there, maybe it's worth it)

9. Y Rod (27 yr old from Cuba) 3-4 yrs (RP or SP?)

10. Stroman 2-3 yrs

11. Giolito 2-3 yrs

12. Flaherty 2-3 yrs

13. Clevinger 2 yrs

14. Mahle 2 yrs

15. Paxton 1 yr

 

(#5s- not the way I like to "improve" the rotation)

16. Lorenzen 2 yrs

17. Montas 1 yr

18. Severino 1 yr

19. Maeda 2 yrs

 

The Wild Cards:

1A. Ohtani 6+ ys (Not interested in paying large for a DH & injured pitcher)

2A. Clayton Kershaw 1 ys (Will likely sign with LAD)

2B. Trevor Bauer 1-2 yrs (I might give him a try.)

4A. Julio Urias (Good enough to be a top 5 SP signing, but he may end up in jail: PASS!)

 

 

if the Sox follow their past few years philosophy i expect them to shop in your 3rd category. If they sign Stroman i am turning in my Red Sox cap.

[moonslav59]

if the Sox follow their past few years philosophy i expect them to shop in your 3rd category. If they sign Stroman i am turning in my Red Sox cap.

 

Agreed.

 

I'm not going to believe a change has been made until I see it. I cannot bring myself to believe the statements made, anymore.

 

I could see us signing Lugo and Flaherty/Wacha/Stroman, and I'd be pissed, if that's the best we do at upgrading the rotation.

 

Another scenario might be that we sign Lugo and trade for Cease or Burnes. Depending on what we give up, and if we extend the pitcher traded for, that might be good enough for me, but just barely.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I'm not going to say Breslow's familiarity with Stroman makes him more likely to be offered a Boston contract (because notin would argue that nothin has anything to do with nothin).

 

But Breslow and Stroman are former colleagues who recently worked in the same department together in another big market city... just a few months ago.

[moonslav59]

Tigers sign Maeda for $24M/2.

 

Yuck!

[notin]

I'm not going to say Breslow's familiarity with Stroman makes him more likely to be offered a Boston contract (because notin would argue that nothin has anything to do with nothin).

 

But Breslow and Stroman are former colleagues who recently worked in the same department together in another big market city... just a few months ago.

 

Marcus HDMH Stroman doesn’t get nearly enough mention, which is odd from a group of fans fascinated by Michael Wacha…

Edited November 27, 2023 by notin

[Randy Red Sox]

Marcus HDMH Stroman doesn’t get nearly enough mention, which is odd from a group of fans fascinated by Michael Wacha…

 

Stroman is a head case just like Alex Manoh

[moonslav59]

Stroman is a head case just like Alex Manoh

 

So is Scherzer.

 

Can the guy pitch?

[notin]

Stroman is a head case just like Alex Manoh

 

Based on what?

[Old Red]

According to Heyman Sonny Gray is signing with the Cardinals.