How will the Red Sox do?

[Hugh2]

Based on what?

 

Hernandez was 4th in MLB for Defensive Runs Saved among MLB CFs for 2021-22, behind only Taylor, Straw and Buxton…

 

eeeee arrrrrrrrr. He don't pass me eye test!!!!

[Old Red]

Based on what?

 

Hernandez was 4th in MLB for Defensive Runs Saved among MLB CFs for 2021-22, behind only Taylor, Straw and Buxton…

His opinion!

[moonslav59]

Turner played 66 games at third base last year. Chavis played 95 games for the '19 Sox; Casas played in 27 at the end of last year. Yoshida played in a league some view as 4A... To me, the point is that better Red Sox teams -- on websites -- than this one have gone south.

 

It's ok to be excited about the '23 season -- I am, too -- and let's hope all things go right that need to go right. I'm not one of those fans that wants the Sox to crash and burn asap, thinking it will lead to Bloom's firing, and expedite a new direction. Unless Henry hires another Dombro and totally changes his mind again to spend-spend-spend, the next rebuild will be just as long as this one.

 

And as Bloom himself says, "a half-decade of rebuilding -- that can't happen in Boston!"

 

Be consistent with the criteria. Turner played 66 at 3B, but he is the DH for us.

 

Chavis played 49 at 1B in 2019, but he counts more than Turner at DH?

 

Dalbec played 0 at 1B in MLB in 2019.

 

I think some over-hyping about the 2020 opening day everyday players is occuring.

[moonslav59]

That’s his opinion.

 

And opinions can't be wrong?

[bkzwhitestrican]

Boston feels like an 80 win team to me, but I've learned from history to never discount them until they're eliminated. Hopefully by the ASB!

[Old Red]

And opinions can't be wrong?

 

Facts, and opinions are two different things, so if that’s how he sees things then it’s right to him. Of course that’s just my opinion.

[Hugh2]

And opinions can't be wrong?

 

In my opinion, Verdugo and Duval are going to be gold glovers this year. It's my opinion. That was a joke, everyone.

 

To be fair, Kike's defense wasn't as spectacular in 2022 as it was in 2021, but it was in a much smaller sample size and he was battling injuries so to say it was average is still pretty good. That's fair.

 

It's also fair to say that if given a clean bill of health we should expect him to play plus defense out there this year. I think he will.

[notin]

His opinion!

 

Oh well. Why have data supporting a conclusion when someone can disagree based on absolutely nothing?

[Bellhorn04]

Facts, and opinions are two different things, so if that’s how he sees things then it’s right to him. Of course that’s just my opinion.

 

Right, but when it comes to whether a guy is a good fielder or not, there are some facts that can be referred to.

[notin]

In my opinion, Verdugo and Duval are going to be gold glovers this year. It's my opinion. That was a joke, everyone.

 

To be fair, Kike's defense wasn't as spectacular in 2022 as it was in 2021, but it was in a much smaller sample size and he was battling injuries so to say it was average is still pretty good. That's fair.

 

It's also fair to say that if given a clean bill of health we should expect him to play plus defense out there this year. I think he will.

 

And to say his defense was “mediocre?”

 

Mediocre by definition means “ordinary or below average.” It’s a comparative description. So am I too assume anyone who finds Kike’s D as mediocre has found roughly 15 centerfielders who are better?

[Hugh2]

Facts, and opinions are two different things, so if that’s how he sees things then it’s right to him. Of course that’s just my opinion.

 

I think it depends on what we are talking about. Some things are more subjective than others and others not so much. An opinion, depending on the subject can be very wrong and if it's right to someone they're either crazy or they're just misinformed. Other things can NOT be taken away from us. Like, I could say Ohtani is the worse player in the league, does that make it right to me because it's my opinion? how can it be because any reasonable person would say that's wrong. My opinion is wrong. However, I can say Chicken Parm is the most delicious dish ever. That's my opinion and one no one can take away from me because it's purely up to my taste buds and no one else.

[notin]

Facts, and opinions are two different things, so if that’s how he sees things then it’s right to him. Of course that’s just my opinion.

 

Not so sure that’s the definition of “opinion” as much as it is the definition of “delusion.”

 

But that’s just my opinion. Also Noah Webster’s…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Be consistent with the criteria. Turner played 66 at 3B, but he is the DH for us.

 

Chavis played 49 at 1B in 2019, but he counts more than Turner at DH?

 

Dalbec played 0 at 1B in MLB in 2019.

 

I think some over-hyping about the 2020 opening day everyday players is occuring.

 

Go back and re-read my posts from today. I'm not overhyping anyone from the 2018 team that won 119 games. I also said "positions" when referring to the '20 OD line-up -- you said Turner played the entire season last year. I never mentioned Dalbec once; the OD first baseman in '20 was Chavis, who -- although he played 95 games in '19 compared to Casas 27 in '22 -- was a young #1 draft pick starting at first base.

 

Let's go '23, start the Game Thread!

[notin]

I think it depends on what we are talking about. Some things are more subjective than others and others not so much. An opinion, depending on the subject can be very wrong and if it's right to someone they're either crazy or they're just misinformed. Other things can NOT be taken away from us. Like, I could say Ohtani is the worse player in the league, does that make it right to me because it's my opinion? how can it be because any reasonable person would say that's wrong. My opinion is wrong. However, I can say Chicken Parm is the most delicious dish ever. That's my opinion and one no one can take away from me because it's purely up to my taste buds and no one else.

 

Well, I’m wiling to listen on Kike’s D as mediocre based on what’s supporting it. But to just say “that’s my opinion” (which, to be fair, was NOT said by the original poster who postulated it) is obviously going to garner questions and counterpoints…

[Bellhorn04]

Not so sure that’s the definition of “opinion” as much as it is the definition of “delusion.”

 

Only if the opinion is obviously wrong, right?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Oh well. Why have data supporting a conclusion when someone can disagree based on absolutely nothing?

 

What is this, a presidential election -- stop with the politics!

[notin]

What is this, a presidential election -- stop with the politics!

 

Right. It’s like when people say the greatest hitter in MLB history was clearly Craig Grebeck.

 

It’s not wrong; it’s an opinion…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Right. It’s like when people say the greatest hitter in MLB history was clearly Craig Grebeck.

 

It’s not wrong; it’s an opinion…

 

He may have been the greatest MLB hitter ... born in Johnstown, PA. I don't know what kind of hitter Pete Vukovich was, but don't we all know those ace pitchers are also stud hitters growing up.

[Old Red]

Right, but when it comes to whether a guy is a good fielder or not, there are some facts that can be referred to.

 

Oh I agree with you to an extent, but I knew Moon’s eyes would bug out when he saw someone say they didn’t think Kike wasn’t as great on D in CF as he does.

[Old Red]

And opinions can't be wrong?

 

Seriously of course they can. Someone asked recently how many OF the Sox would keep to start the season, and you said 4. That was obviously WRONG.

Edited March 30, 2023 by Old Red

[notin]

He may have been the greatest MLB hitter ... born in Johnstown, PA. I don't know what kind of hitter Pete Vukovich was, but don't we all know those ace pitchers are also stud hitters growing up.

 

Vukovich was an ace hitter for the Yankees in the first Major League movie…

[moonslav59]

Like, I could say Ohtani is the worse player in the league, does that make it right to me because it's my opinion? how can it be because any reasonable person would say that's wrong. My opinion is wrong.

 

Opinions can be categorically wrong.

 

Absurd opinions may be discussed or debated as much as people want, but to me, some obviously wrong opinions being discussed is a waste of time. When I say "end of discussion," I am just giving my opinion that the topic is not worthy of discussion. Others may continue arguing the merits of absurd positions all they want.

 

They may also parrot absurd positions and then say, Let's move on" all they want, too. To each his own.

 

To me, it's absurd to think the opening day 2020 roster looked better than the this 2023 roster. People can disagree all they want.

 

Now, if Sale and ERod had been healthy in 2020, the comps would be much closer, but that 2020 team was not like 2018, despite having some of the same players.

 

[moonslav59]

Seriously of course they can. Someone asked recently how many OF the Sox would keep to start the season, and you said 4. That was obviously WRONG.

 

It was still a valid opinion, at the time, and it's fine to still believe we should have 4 OF'ers not 5. BTW, I don't think I ever said "they would." I said "they should."

 

It's just plain untrue and "wrong" to say Kike is not a good defensive CF'er or that Othani is the worst player in MLB.

Edited March 30, 2023 by moonslav59

[moonslav59]

Oh I agree with you to an extent, but I knew Moon’s eyes would bug out when he saw someone say they didn’t think Kike wasn’t as great on D in CF as he does.

 

It's not that he didn't say great, and you know that.

[moonslav59]

Go back and re-read my posts from today. I'm not overhyping anyone from the 2018 team that won 119 games. I also said "positions" when referring to the '20 OD line-up -- you said Turner played the entire season last year. I never mentioned Dalbec once; the OD first baseman in '20 was Chavis, who -- although he played 95 games in '19 compared to Casas 27 in '22 -- was a young #1 draft pick starting at first base.

 

Let's go '23, start the Game Thread!

 

I get that I read too much into the point being not about games played but about games played at specific positions.

 

I just see Turner as always being a FT players, and playing DH provides more experience and 2022 action than almost anyone.

 

Yes, Dugo barely played RF.

 

The 2020 team was awful from day one- on paper and in reality. The 2023 team is not, on paper. I'll leave it at that.

[Elktonnick]

Based on what?

 

Hernandez was 4th in MLB for Defensive Runs Saved among MLB CFs for 2021-22, behind only Taylor, Straw and Buxton…

 

I love how you cherry pick your stats. Kike was 18th among centerfielders in 2022 which is mediocre in my book. https://fieldingbible.com/DRSLeaderboard.

 

His total runs saved was 4.

 

I guess it was because of his outstanding play in centerfield in 22 that Bloom moved him to SS.

[notin]

I love how you cherry pick your stats. Kike was 18th among centerfielders in 2022 which is mediocre in my book. https://fieldingbible.com/DRSLeaderboard.

 

His total runs saved was 4.

 

I guess it was because of his outstanding play in centerfield in 22 that Bloom moved him to SS.

 

 

So… you’re observation that he was mediocre was based on using cumulative stats from a season in which he played 93 games?

[moonslav59]

I love how you cherry pick your stats. Kike was 18th among centerfielders in 2022 which is mediocre in my book. https://fieldingbible.com/DRSLeaderboard.

 

His total runs saved was 4.

 

I guess it was because of his outstanding play in centerfield in 22 that Bloom moved him to SS.

 

DRS are largely a function of innings played, so having 4 DRS in just 669 innings is way better than 18th. I'm not sure where he is ranked 18th in.

 

He's 3rd on fangraph's standard D page and 13th in fangraph's advanced page, again where total innings help or hurt.

12th in DRA with 4

14th UZR/150

 

2021-2022

4th in DRS (18)

6th standard

5th Advanced

7th UZR/150

 

If you figure DRS/innings, he'd have ranked 2nd in MLB out of all 31 CF'ers with 900+ innings in CF from 2021 to 2022.

 

[moonslav59]

So… you’re observation that he was mediocre was based on using cumulative stats from a season in which he played 93 games?

 

But, we are the cherry-pickers.

[Elktonnick]

DRS are largely a function of innings played, so having 4 DRS in just 669 innings is way better than 18th. I'm not sure where he is ranked 18th in.

 

He's 3rd on fangraph's standard D page and 13th in fangraph's advanced page, again where total innings help or hurt.

12th in DRA with 4

14th UZR/150

 

2021-2022

4th in DRS (18)

6th standard

5th Advanced

7th UZR/150

 

If you figure DRS/innings, he'd have ranked 2nd in MLB out of all 31 CF'ers with 900+ innings in CF from 2021 to 2022.

 

Actually it is more of functioning of positioning