A Realistic View of 2023: Part II

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Maybe add 2003 or even 2021.

 

'03 they were one manager away; '21 could've just been a first-half Barnes away...

[mvp 78]

'03 they were one manager away; '21 could've just been a first-half Barnes away...

 

I think 03 needed a bullpen.

[Old Red]

You said "being one player away." I would assume the teams that made the WS in 67, 75, 86 could have won if given one specific player if we played fantasy GM.

 

I wouldn’t have added any player in 67, but I would have taken one away with a guy named Gibson.

[moonslav59]

'03 they were one manager away; '21 could've just been a first-half Barnes away...

 

2003: We were a Schilling short in change.

 

2021: We were Scherzer as hell an ace away from a ring.

[moonslav59]

I wouldn’t have added any player in 67, but I would have taken one away with a guy named Gibson.

 

Had we added Gibson, we'd have swept.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I think 03 needed a bullpen.

 

A lot of us remember Kim in the regular season, but forget these three in the postseason:

 

Timlin 8 G, 0.00

Embree 8 G, 0.00

Williamson 8 G, 1.13... 8 IP, 1R, 3H, 3BB, 14K -- saved all three wins in the ALCS, finished and won two elimination games in the ALDS, zero blown saves.

 

It was Williamson's only postseason. Twenty years later, and he might still have nights where he thinks of Game 7 and asks himself, Grady... WTF?

[mvp 78]

A lot of us remember Kim in the regular season, but forget these three in the postseason:

 

Timlin 8 G, 0.00

Embree 8 G, 0.00

Williamson 8 G, 1.13... 8 IP, 1R, 3H, 3BB, 14K -- saved all three wins in the ALCS, finished and won two elimination games in the ALDS, zero blown saves.

 

It was Williamson's only postseason. Twenty years later, and he might still have nights where he thinks of Game 7 and asks himself, Grady... WTF?

 

Williamson was good that postseason, but he was clearly due to become a pumpkin at some point.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Williamson was good that postseason, but he was clearly due to become a pumpkin at some point.

 

But the World Series ended five days before Halloween that year.

[mvp 78]

But the World Series ended five days before Halloween that year.

 

What did Cinderella have to do with Halloween?

[Bellhorn04]

What did Cinderella have to do with Halloween?

 

Pumpkins connect the two.

[Oscars]

MLB Trade rumours article:

Right hander Garrett Whitlock is still on the mend from September hip surgery, though Red Sox skipper Alex Cora indicated this morning there’s a possibility he won’t be ready for Opening Day (Twitter link via Ian Browne of MLB.com). Whitlock has been throwing off a mound but is not yet performing pitchers’ fielding practice, and Cora stated that if the right-hander isn’t ready for the start of the season, “he’s not going to lose too much time.”

 

One of the best Rule 5 selections in recent memory, the 26-year-old Whitlock has pitched 151 2/3 innings for Boston over the past two seasons, logging a sharp 2.73 ERA with a strong 26.8% strikeout rate against a brilliant 5.3% walk rate. The Red Sox have used him far more out of the bullpen than the rotation, but he’s slated to get a look as a starter in 2023, joining the likes of Chris Sale, Corey Kluber, James Paxton and Nick Pivetta in the mix for rotation work. Fellow righty Tanner Houck and top prospect Brayan Bello are both options to step into the rotation, should Whitlock need to miss any time early in the season.

[moonslav59]

MLB Trade rumours article:

Right hander Garrett Whitlock is still on the mend from September hip surgery, though Red Sox skipper Alex Cora indicated this morning there’s a possibility he won’t be ready for Opening Day (Twitter link via Ian Browne of MLB.com). Whitlock has been throwing off a mound but is not yet performing pitchers’ fielding practice, and Cora stated that if the right-hander isn’t ready for the start of the season, “he’s not going to lose too much time.”

 

One of the best Rule 5 selections in recent memory, the 26-year-old Whitlock has pitched 151 2/3 innings for Boston over the past two seasons, logging a sharp 2.73 ERA with a strong 26.8% strikeout rate against a brilliant 5.3% walk rate. The Red Sox have used him far more out of the bullpen than the rotation, but he’s slated to get a look as a starter in 2023, joining the likes of Chris Sale, Corey Kluber, James Paxton and Nick Pivetta in the mix for rotation work. Fellow righty Tanner Houck and top prospect Brayan Bello are both options to step into the rotation, should Whitlock need to miss any time early in the season.

 

Out of the 156 MLB pitchers with 150+ IP since 2021, Whitlock places:

 

T6th in ERA- at 64 (5th place is Manoah at 63)

8th in SIERA at 3.07

12th K/BB at 5.09

14th ERA at 2.73

16th in FIP at 3.07 (15th in xFIP-)

21st in K-BB% at 21.5%

23rd in BB% at 5.3%

25th in K% at 26.8%

26th WHIP at 1.06

36th in HR/9 at 0.95

 

[mvp 78]

MLB Trade rumours article:

Right hander Garrett Whitlock is still on the mend from September hip surgery, though Red Sox skipper Alex Cora indicated this morning there’s a possibility he won’t be ready for Opening Day (Twitter link via Ian Browne of MLB.com). Whitlock has been throwing off a mound but is not yet performing pitchers’ fielding practice, and Cora stated that if the right-hander isn’t ready for the start of the season, “he’s not going to lose too much time.”

 

One of the best Rule 5 selections in recent memory, the 26-year-old Whitlock has pitched 151 2/3 innings for Boston over the past two seasons, logging a sharp 2.73 ERA with a strong 26.8% strikeout rate against a brilliant 5.3% walk rate. The Red Sox have used him far more out of the bullpen than the rotation, but he’s slated to get a look as a starter in 2023, joining the likes of Chris Sale, Corey Kluber, James Paxton and Nick Pivetta in the mix for rotation work. Fellow righty Tanner Houck and top prospect Brayan Bello are both options to step into the rotation, should Whitlock need to miss any time early in the season.

 

If he's not on the Opening Day roster they may have to send him back to NYY!

[notin]

'03 they were one manager away; '21 could've just been a first-half Barnes away...

 

Grady Little gets a bad rap for leaving in HOF Shoe In Pedro Martinez instead of going to a bullpen that created more unwelcome runs than ExLax…

[notin]

What did Cinderella have to do with Halloween?

 

It was his costume that year…

[moonslav59]

Grady Little gets a bad rap for leaving in HOF Shoe In Pedro Martinez instead of going to a bullpen that created more unwelcome runs than ExLax…

 

Perhaps my most unpopular position was that it was the right choice to leave the best pitcher to wear a Sox uniform since Cy Young in the most important game in a very long time.

[Bellhorn04]

Perhaps my most unpopular position was that it was the right choice to leave the best pitcher to wear a Sox uniform since Cy Young in the most important game in a very long time.

 

Pedro wasn't going to throw a complete game there though. Grady had to go to the pen at some point.

[mvp 78]

Perhaps my most unpopular position was that it was the right choice to leave the best pitcher to wear a Sox uniform since Cy Young in the most important game in a very long time.

 

It’s just a bad opinion. He only had 3 CG the whole year. That wasn’t going to be the 4th.

[moonslav59]

It’s just a bad opinion. He only had 3 CG the whole year. That wasn’t going to be the 4th.

 

It was the 8th inning. I only meant to finish the 8th.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Grady Little gets a bad rap for leaving in HOF Shoe In Pedro Martinez instead of going to a bullpen that created more unwelcome runs than ExLax…

 

In the 2003 Red Sox Postseason, Timlin, Embree, Williamson combined: 24.1 IP, 1 R (homer by Ruben Sierra off Williamson).

 

Boston led by three runs with six outs to go.

[moonslav59]

In the 2003 Red Sox Postseason, Timlin, Embree, Williamson combined: 24.1 IP, 1 R (homer by Ruben Sierra off Williamson).

 

Boston led by three runs with six outs to go.

 

Yup. They were due for a crooked number.

 

(LOL)

[notin]

In the 2003 Red Sox Postseason, Timlin, Embree, Williamson combined: 24.1 IP, 1 R (homer by Ruben Sierra off Williamson).

 

Boston led by three runs with six outs to go.

 

But those post season numbers that represent a good week or two don’t necessarily supersede what was a very weak season-long performance…

[dgalehouse]

Pedro wasn't going to throw a complete game there though. Grady had to go to the pen at some point.

 

You can love your Lamborghini, but if the gas tank is running on empty, it is probably wiser to take the Jeep.

[Bellhorn04]

You can love your Lamborghini, but if the gas tank is running on empty, it is probably wiser to take the Jeep.

 

Nailed it.

[Bellhorn04]

But those post season numbers that represent a good week or two don’t necessarily supersede what was a very weak season-long performance…

 

True, but the question for you is, were you expecting Pedro to go 1975 Luis Tiant and throw a 160 pitch CG?

[notin]

True, but the question for you is, were you expecting Pedro to go 1975 Luis Tiant and throw a 160 pitch CG?

 

I’m not saying Pedro shouldn’t have been taken out. I’m saying I don’t blame Grady for leaving him in…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

True, but the question for you is, were you expecting Pedro to go 1975 Luis Tiant and throw a 160 pitch CG?

 

You mean this Tiant?

 

AL Pitchers WAR

1960-80

65.9 Tiant

62.4 Palmer

51.4 Wood

49.5 Blyleven

46.7 Lolich

46.3 Kaat

43.8 G.Perry

42.9 McDowell

40.7 Stottlemyre

40.0 Ryan

36.3 Hunter

 

Is two decades a large enough sample size? Hall of a career...

[notin]

You mean this Tiant?

 

AL Pitchers WAR

1960-80

65.9 Tiant

62.4 Palmer

51.4 Wood

49.5 Blyleven

46.7 Lolich

46.3 Kaat

43.8 G.Perry

42.9 McDowell

40.7 Stottlemyre

40.0 Ryan

36.3 Hunter

 

Is two decades a large enough sample size? Hall of a career...

 

On the list of Greatest Omissions from Cooperstown - Non-Steroidal Edition, Tiant ranks number two behind Pete Rose. So that makes him the top omission about whom we can ask “why?”

[moonslav59]

I’m not saying Pedro shouldn’t have been taken out. I’m saying I don’t blame Grady for leaving him in…

 

Also, finishing the game is a different point than finishing the 8th.

 

Pedro had gone over 115-120 pitches a few times in 2003 and after. It's not like demanding 9 IP and 140 pitches.

[mvp 78]

It was the 8th inning. I only meant to finish the 8th.

 

Then wouldn't the same argument work for the 9th inning? Why make the demarcation as "just one more inning, but not two"?