A Realistic View of 2023: Part II

[Nick]

Cora has done a good job with platooning.

 

At first glance, you do a double take seeing Refsnyder batting 3rd until you do some research.

 

Here's a guy with no name recognition but he absolutely destroys lefties. He's on his second season doing it.

 

As long as Duran contines to hit, our lineup looks deep.

 

Yes, I love our left handed lineup.

[Nick]

Kike needs to heat up. His friendship with Cora maybe the only reason he sees playing time when everyone gets healthy.

[notin]

Kike needs to heat up. His friendship with Cora maybe the only reason he sees playing time when everyone gets healthy.

 

You don’t think it’s

 

1. That the 3 shortstops ahead of him are injured and

2. That Kike is actually a good defensive player and, forum opinions aside, the best defensive option the Sox have at the position…

[moonslav59]

I've been a big Kike fan and defender, and his defense in CF and to some extent at 2B has always been good enough to just about outweigh any deficiencies on offense.

 

His great finish to the 2021 season and playoffs on O really made him into a huge plus player, but then the bottom fell out on his bat.

 

.633 in his last 565 PAs will not be sustainable, especially since we now have a CF'er who looks like he can field good enough to pass Kike at that kind of OPS.

 

If Story comes back as the SS, I can see Kike playing 2B. I'm not sure I'd be happy with Kike as our FT SS to finish the season. (Mondesi?)

 

At worst, he may end up being a platoon at 2B w Valdez or CF w Duran, assuming one plays himself into a platoon. (Valdez already has.)

[Randy Red Sox]

That is not really saying a lot

[Nick]

You don’t think it’s

 

1. That the 3 shortstops ahead of him are injured and

2. That Kike is actually a good defensive player and, forum opinions aside, the best defensive option the Sox have at the position…

 

I think you missed my last sentence.

 

No I do not think he's a good shortstop.

[moonslav59]

I think you missed my last sentence.

 

No I do not think he's a good shortstop.

 

I think he understood your point and disagreed.

[Larry Cook]

Are we a quality starting pitcher away from being a playoff team?

 

Sale, new starter, paxton, Bello and Whitlock as the starters!

 

Jansen, scheiber, pivetta, houck, blieir, Winkowski, Crawford, and Martin as the bullpen

[Nick]

I think he understood your point and disagreed.

 

Moon as you have said often Kike's best position is CF and I agree.

 

That said Duvall will return and Duran just based on his limited PA is one of best offensive players right now.

 

The point being CF is crowded.

 

We have also discussed the fact that we can live with a defense first SS especially one making less than $10M.

 

You can't convince me that Kike is better defender than Chang at ss.

 

Add the possibility of Mondesi and Story coming back.

 

Cora is high on Mondesi' s athleticism and his ability to play short.

 

When Story returns, he will play 2B or SS.

 

Based on Kike's stats to date, my only point was Kike is nothing special from my perspective.

 

As far as I'm concerned he is just a rental. Not part of the core group.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Nick

[notin]

I think you missed my last sentence.

 

No I do not think he's a good shortstop.

 

But who on the Sox is better?

[Nick]

I think Mondesi will be better. Chang is better.

 

I want defensive shortstop.

 

My guess is Kike will be moved to 2B when aforementioned players return.

 

I did say 'when everyone returns'.

 

I think Story coming back is much later.

 

I did say it's based on Kike's offensive stat to date.

 

Who knowsmaybe he will get hot like he did in 2021.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Nick

[notin]

I think Mondesi will be better. Chang is better.

 

I want defensive shortstop.

 

My guess is Kike will be moved to 2B when aforementioned players return.

 

I did say 'when everyone returns'.

 

I think Story coming back is much later.

 

I did say it's based on Kike's offensive stat to date.

 

Who knowsmaybe he will get hot like he did in 2021.

 

Again, both Mondesi and Chang are injured.

 

Kike isn’t playing because he’s friends with Cora; he’s literally the last man standing and best current option the Sox have…

[moonslav59]

Moon as you have said often Kike's best position is CF and I agree.

 

That said Duvall will return and Duran just based on his limited PA is one of best offensive players right now.

 

The point being CF is crowded.

 

We have also discussed the fact that we can live with a defense first SS especially one making less than $10M.

 

You can't convince me that Kike is better defender than Chang at ss.

 

Add the possibility of Mondesi and Story coming back.

 

Cora is high on Mondesi' s athleticism and his ability to play short.

 

When Story returns, he will play 2B or SS.

 

Based on Kike's stats to date, my only point was Kike is nothing special from my perspective.

 

As far as I'm concerned he is just a rental. Not part of the core group.

 

I'm not going to try to convince you Kike is a better defender than Chang at SS. He hasn't been cloe, this year.

 

I will say this...

 

I don't think Kike is as bad at SS D as he has shown, so far, this year.

 

As bad as Kike has been on O, I'm not sure that will continue, but even as is, his OPS+ is more than double Chang's (74 to 35.)

 

We also have to think about Story or Mondesi returning to SS, and Kike at 2B. Chang will be out of the picture.

 

[moonslav59]

But who on the Sox is better?

 

Overall, and healthy- nobody.

 

Reyes and Hamilton are closest.

 

If Chang were healthy, I'm not sure I'd start him. He may be a little better than Kike on D but he's not even half as good as a slumping Kike.

 

Arroyo or Dalbec at SS, Nope. E Valdez? LOL!

 

Only Story and Mondesi are better, when healthy.

 

[Nick]

Valdez looks good at 2nd. Another young kid that can definitely make contact.

 

It's a good problem to have.

[moonslav59]

Valdez looks good at 2nd. Another young kid that can definitely make contact.

 

It's a good problem to have.

 

He looks good at the plate.

 

I still need some convincing in the field.

[moonslav59]

Some selected 2023 OPS

 

.950 Duran (1.544 Duvall)

.912 Gallo

.892 DeJong

.883 Kiermaier

.872 Moncada

.868 Betts

.867 Verdugo

.866 EValdez

.863 Yoshida

.859 Susuki

.853 P Reyes

.847 Devers

.810 Renfroe

.805 JD

.796 Pillar

.794 Turner

 

.770 Bogey

.767 Refsnyder

.723 Schwarber

.722 Dubon

.721 Mateo

.717 Drury

.716 Conforto

 

.695 Benintendi

.694 Wong

.692 Trea Turner

.690 Chris Taylor

.688 T Pham

.684 Correa

.677 Casas

.677 Laureano

.668 Berti

.667 McGuire

.662 Margot

.660 Arroyo

.657 Tapia

.654 Kike

.654 Machado

.647 Springer

 

.618 J Baez

.610 Hosmer

.572 Vazquez

.558 Chavis

.556 Myers

.552 B Crawford

 

.534 Andrus

.532 Abreu

.515 Chang

.490 Dalbec

.489 Donaldson

.469 M Rojas

.467 K Wong

.431 JBJ

.426 Wendle

.424 Biggio

 

 

 

[Maxbialystock]

I think you missed my last sentence.

 

No I do not think he's a good shortstop.

 

So allow me to offer a contrarian view. The Sox have never cared about defense at SS. When they get a good one, they get rid of him ASAP. By that standard Kike is quite adequate. I assume you made up this crap about a friendship with Cora because I think Cora is great at handling his players but won't hesitate to juggle his lineups based on necessity and opportunity and not "friendship."

 

Kike's who we have because Mondesi, Story, and Chang have been, are, and will continue to be on the IL.

[moonslav59]

So allow me to offer a contrarian view. The Sox have never cared about defense at SS. When they get a good one, they get rid of him ASAP. By that standard Kike is quite adequate. I assume you made up this crap about a friendship with Cora because I think Cora is great at handling his players but won't hesitate to juggle his lineups based on necessity and opportunity and not "friendship."

 

Kike's who we have because Mondesi, Story, and Chang have been, are, and will continue to be on the IL.

 

Cora did start Kike over Chang, at the start, and my guess is because nobody thought he'd play that badly, the first 10 days.

 

KIke is not as bad as his start indicated.

 

Arroyo's injury also played a role in who played.

 

People grab onto certain beliefs and won't let go. I think it is true Cora likes Kike as a player, and for a while, there wasn't much to dislike. Cora has shown he sticks with several players who struggle. Many felt Renfroe should have been benched after April 2021, and Dalbec by May and June of 2021. Many wondered why Duran was given another chance. Nobody is claiming they are best buds with Cora.

[notin]

Valdez looks good at 2nd. Another young kid that can definitely make contact.

 

It's a good problem to have.

 

I’d say he looks good at the plate. But in the field I’ve seen him sometimes look like Scott Bakula does in the opening sequence of every episode of Quantum Leap…

[notin]

So allow me to offer a contrarian view. The Sox have never cared about defense at SS. When they get a good one, they get rid of him ASAP. By that standard Kike is quite adequate. I assume you made up this crap about a friendship with Cora because I think Cora is great at handling his players but won't hesitate to juggle his lineups based on necessity and opportunity and not "friendship."

 

Kike's who we have because Mondesi, Story, and Chang have been, are, and will continue to be on the IL.

 

They did sign Alex Gonzalez twice…

[Bellhorn04]

They did sign Alex Gonzalez twice…

 

And got rid of him quickly twice.

[dgalehouse]

As we approach the Memorial Day milestone, I would say that this team is shaping up nicely. They look like they can compete with the better teams. They are getting some productivity throughput the lineup , not just depending on two or three guys . Chris Sale looks healthy and sharp. As always, a good bullpen is vital. This should be an interesting season.

[Old Red]

As we approach the Memorial Day milestone, I would say that this team is shaping up nicely. They look like they can compete with the better teams. They are getting some productivity throughput the lineup , not just depending on two or three guys . Chris Sale looks healthy and sharp. As always, a good bullpen is vital. This should be an interesting season.

Agree with this, and as long as the starting rotation stays relatively healthy they should be able to keep it up, and get into the postseason.

[MADSTORK]

I’ll give credit where credit is due 46 games in but it’s a long season

ACora deserves much credit

 

Starting Pitching is a disaster as is the Closer at the moment

Time for the Front Office to put the dumpster diving on hold and deal off a few of these beer leaguers for pitching see Dalbec

 

Jansen signing is a year too late but what do I know, pick up the phone Orlando

[moonslav59]

And got rid of him quickly twice.

 

As they did with Cora, Reese and others.

[moonslav59]

It looks like the Wong-McGuire catching tandem has come down to earth on offense, as both are under .700, but Vaz is under .600, right now. The tandem's D seems to be good and improving. The CERA aspect is still up for debate, but the rotation seems to be turning the corner. (Learning curve? Regressing to their norms?)

 

Gotta give kudos to the 40 man roster depth:

.951 Duran

.866 EValdez

.853 Reyes

.767 Ref

 

0.00 Sheriff/Garza (4 IP combined)

2.12 Schreiber (I counted him as depth as many felt 2022 was a fluke.)

2.15 Wink (5th in IP)

2.45 Paxton (seen and SP'er depth)

3.51 Crawford (7th in IP)

3.65 Bernardino

3.68 Kelly

These are 8 or our top 9 ERA leaders! (Only Martin is in the top 9 and was not seen as "depth" on opening day.

 

Some viewed Bello as SP'er depth, too. (Not me.)

[Nick]

When we miss out on the playoffs by couple of games, we can look back on indecisiveness of Cora and the rest of baseball operations personnel dragging their feet on Kluber.

 

We have enough starters.

 

Let the motherf*er work out his mechanics in rehab stints.

 

Unbelievable. It's clear that Kluber is completely lost based on his post game interview.

[Nick]

By the way, we're not just gambling with Kluber's $10M or so.

 

Sox is gambling with $200M+ on the bet that Kluber will become a #5 starter.

 

It's a stupid bet. Give me Bloom's phone #.

[Old Red]

By the way, we're not just gambling with Kluber's $10M or so.

 

Sox is gambling with $200M+ on the bet that Kluber will become a #5 starter.

 

It's a stupid bet. Give me Bloom's phone #.

 

I said at the time of the Kluber signing, and have been saying ever since that the Red Sox took the cheaper way out over Evol, and Wacha.