Will JD Martinez pick up his player option for $19.35M?

[Bellhorn04]

Jose Urquidy would be “equal value” per BTV. Good or bad trade?

 

Good question. When it's equal value, picking which is better is like trying to beat the Vegas NFL point spreads...

[Bellhorn04]

I don’t think Duggy is equal value to Betts, but Betts wasn’t worth that big, or that long a contract either.

 

The reason I said that is it was one year of Betts for six years of Duggy.

[Old Red]

IMO, if one of our players reaches free agency, we did not think they were worth what market value says they were worth.

 

I don't think we ever wanted to pay Lester what he ended up getting, let alone $1 more.

 

We were not going to pay Betts, so we traded him.

 

Personally, because of Bogey's meh defense, I would not pay him $28M x 6 or 7 years, and he may get more than that!

 

I don't know what Devers is worth, since he is 2 years away from free agency, but I'm more inclined to pay him the market rate than Bogey.

 

I’ve said many times that I believe no one is worth a 30 million a year, or 300 million over a period of time contract. The Yankees have 2 300 million dollar contracts on their team, and the Padres do also. How has Trouts 400 million dollar contract worked out for them? Mookie was hurt this year, and has 11 more years to go into his late 30s. Those kind of contracts are not worth it, and that goes for Bogey, and Raffy.

[Old Red]

The reason I said that is it was one year of Betts for six years of Duggy.

 

Agree with that.

[Bellhorn04]

I’ve said many times that I believe no one is worth a 30 million a year, or 300 million over a period of time contract. The Yankees have 2 300 million dollar contracts on their team, and the Padres do also. How has Trouts 400 million dollar contract worked out for them? Mookie was hurt this year, and has 11 more years to go into his late 30s. Those kind of contracts are not worth it, and that goes for Bogey, and Raffy.

 

And Cole's deal looks a little shaky right now.

 

Which raises the question, what are the biggest money deals that have actually turned out as wins for the team?

 

Max Scherzer 210 million (with deferrals)

Derek Jeter 189 million

Manny Ramirez 160 million

[moonslav59]

Jose Urquidy would be “equal value” per BTV. Good or bad trade?

 

Great trade for us, IMO.

[moonslav59]

One could say that, but Verdugo's price goes up too, so I don't think it's quite that simple. And it tends to diminish the loss of Hall of Fame talent.

 

I put $25M but it is actually more at the start and less later- so maybe an avg of $25M. It's 100% of Bett's contract once Verdugo's time is up.

[Bellhorn04]

Great trade for us, IMO.

 

Urquidy has a projected 2022 fWAR of 1.5. Not very exciting. His peripherals, especially FIP, don't look that good.

 

There are reasons he's only equal value.

[moonslav59]

One could say that, but Verdugo's price goes up too, so I don't think it's quite that simple. And it tends to diminish the loss of Hall of Fame talent.

 

We can probably keep ERod at the price of Bogey's extension + the cost of Urquidy.

 

Would you trade Bogey for 4 years of Urquidy and the ability to sign and keep ERod?

[Bellhorn04]

I put $25M but it is actually more at the start and less later- so maybe an avg of $25M. It's 100% of Bett's contract once Verdugo's time is up.

 

Right, so you gain $25-30M but you lose Mookie Betts. Whether that's a good thing depends on how Mookie holds up.

[moonslav59]

Urquidy has a projected 2022 fWAR of 1.5. Not very exciting. His peripherals, especially FIP, don't look that good.

 

There are reasons he's only equal value.

 

I'll take the 4 years over one of Bogey plus the budget space to keep ERod or sign Stroman or the like.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

One could say that, but Verdugo's price goes up too, so I don't think it's quite that simple. And it tends to diminish the loss of Hall of Fame talent.

 

It wasn't a straight trade, because LA also had to agree to take Price and pay half of what he was owed. Does anyone think the return for Mookie wouldn't have been better -- wherever he landed -- if Price wasn't attached to the deal? This is in part to answer your earlier query of whether any other team would've traded for Betts; my answer is not if Price was part of the agreement (at least one other was reportedly in negotiations -- the Padres -- though we don't know if Price was the deal-breaker).

[moonslav59]

Right, so you gain $25-30M but you lose Mookie Betts. Whether that's a good thing depends on how Mookie holds up.

 

And, it depends on what you get for that $30M of added budget space.

[moonslav59]

It wasn't a straight trade, because LA also had to agree to take Price and pay half of what he was owed. Does anyone think the return for Mookie wouldn't have been better -- wherever he landed -- if Price wasn't attached to the deal? This is in part to answer your earlier query of whether any other team would've traded for Betts; my answer is not if Price was part of the agreement (at least one other was reportedly in negotiations -- the Padres -- though we don't know if Price was the deal-breaker).

 

I saw dumping Price as a plus for us: others saw it differently.

 

My guess is, it was pretty close to a wash, at the time of the trade.

[mvp 78]

I’ve said many times that I believe no one is worth a 30 million a year, or 300 million over a period of time contract. The Yankees have 2 300 million dollar contracts on their team, and the Padres do also. How has Trouts 400 million dollar contract worked out for them? Mookie was hurt this year, and has 11 more years to go into his late 30s. Those kind of contracts are not worth it, and that goes for Bogey, and Raffy.

 

Did the Dodgers win a WS before they signed Betts?

 

Are the Nats a better team now that they don't have to pay Scherzer?

 

Will the Astros be a better team if Correa signs elsewhere?

 

Of the top 5 payrolls, 4 at least made the WC game this year. Is that correlation?

[mvp 78]

I saw dumping Price as a plus for us: others saw it differently.

 

My guess is, it was pretty close to a wash, at the time of the trade.

 

Would last year's team have been better if they had Price instead of Richards and Perez?

[mvp 78]

Urquidy has a projected 2022 fWAR of 1.5. Not very exciting. His peripherals, especially FIP, don't look that good.

 

There are reasons he's only equal value.

 

I'm NOT an Urquidy guy.

[Bellhorn04]

And, it depends on what you get for that $30M of added budget space.

 

You get $30M of talent that may or may not perform up to it.

[Bellhorn04]

I'll take the 4 years over one of Bogey plus the budget space to keep ERod or sign Stroman or the like.

 

I can see that.

 

But who plays shortstop for us in 2022?

[Bellhorn04]

Would last year's team have been better if they had Price instead of Richards and Perez?

 

Pretty much a wash?

[Bellhorn04]

I'm NOT an Urquidy guy.

 

And you do more homework on this stuff than I do.

[mvp 78]

And you do more homework on this stuff than I do.

 

The things I do like about him:

 

low bb%

throws mostly down in the zone

decent movement on his FB

 

What I really, really, really don't like about him:

 

he just can't stay on the field

limited ceiling of a third starter, but most likely a 4th starter

[mvp 78]

I'd say they should go with Xander as SS for 2022. If they fall out of it and can't extend him, you can probably still move him at the deadline for a pitcher comparable to Urquidy. Bloom would probably move him for prospects though.

[mvp 78]

Matz is projected to have a higher fWAR. Just sign a FA if you need a 3rd or 4th starter.

[harmony]

The reason I said that is it was one year of Betts for six years of Duggy.

To be precise: The Mookie Betts trade brought back five years of Alex Verdugo.

[notin]

I'd say they should go with Xander as SS for 2022. If they fall out of it and can't extend him, you can probably still move him at the deadline for a pitcher comparable to Urquidy. Bloom would probably move him for prospects though.

 

I would expect that to be the plan.

 

They's be more likely to deal him this off-season if they were, say, an 85 win team last year that came in 4th in the AL East...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Would last year's team have been better if they had Price instead of Richards and Perez?

 

All were either left off postseason rosters, or at least in such discussions (not considering possible positive or negative contributions off the field)... but financially, it looks like a wash, as Richards and Perez made almost what the Dodgers paid Price. Of course, if Sox had to pay twice that, again, the answer is nope. That second $16 mil could've meant no Kike, no Renfroe, no Hiros...

[mvp 78]

I would expect that to be the plan.

 

They's be more likely to deal him this off-season if they were, say, an 85 win team last year that came in 4th in the AL East...

 

Yes, but also his trade value may be relatively low since there are a lot of FA SS that are available right now.

[mvp 78]

All were either left off postseason rosters, or at least in such discussions (not considering possible positive or negative contributions off the field)... but financially, it looks like a wash, as Richards and Perez made almost what the Dodgers paid Price. Of course, if Sox had to pay twice that, again, the answer is nope. That second $16 mil could've meant no Kike, no Renfroe, no Hiros...

 

What second 16M?

 

First half paid to Price. Second half paid to Perez and Richards. If Price was here, they still could have brought in Renfroe and Kiké.

[notin]

Yes, but also his trade value may be relatively low since there are a lot of FA SS that are available right now.

 

True, but the flip side is most of them are expected to command top dollar. A team like Houston might not be able to accommodate Story or Baez with that they are offering Correa, but they are also the defending AL champions and need to address what is now a rather large hole in their lineup...