Sox Pitching Staff Discussion

[moonslav59]

with 8 relievers, the people are there - can't worry about tomorrow as much ... i mean in the postseason, third time through the order during an ERod start, the phone will be ringing

 

The "people are there", but half of them are lousy.

[oldtimer]

The "people are there", but half of them are lousy.

 

Abad has a good fastball and a very good curve but for some reason he seemed to want to nibble or worse yet not throw a strike. I believe he can so why didn't he. JF had a desperate position and wound up having to put Tazawa in. With the count 1 and 2 he chose to groove his average fastball and gave up the lead again. Why would an experienced pitcher do that? Fortunately we regained the lead and Kimbrel was there to get the save.

 

We need to get Kelly and Hembree up to give JF more options. It's almost like Tazawa can't get the job done anymore. Maybe he just has a tired arm.

[moonslav59]

Abad has a good fastball and a very good curve but for some reason he seemed to want to nibble or worse yet not throw a strike. I believe he can so why didn't he. JF had a desperate position and wound up having to put Tazawa in. With the count 1 and 2 he chose to groove his average fastball and gave up the lead again. Why would an experienced pitcher do that? Fortunately we regained the lead and Kimbrel was there to get the save.

 

We need to get Kelly and Hembree up to give JF more options. It's almost like Tazawa can't get the job done anymore. Maybe he just has a tired arm.

 

I'm not at the trusting Abad point.

 

I only really trust Kimbrel and Ziegler.

 

Ross is fine.

 

The rest are all sit on the edge of your seat pitchers.

[Bellhorn04]

Where in the heck is iortiz? I hope he's not 'embarrassed' about being wrong about Porcello. Ain't no big deal.

[Kimmi]

Where in the heck is iortiz? I hope he's not 'embarrassed' about being wrong about Porcello. Ain't no big deal.

 

Ha. It would be nice to hear from him.

[a700hitter]

A healthy Uehara will help a lot of this fall into place ... big if obviously

But it would be foolish to rely on a 41 yr old pitcher to bounce back so quickly and to be effective and reliable in late inning high leverage situations.

[User Name]

Where in the heck is iortiz? I hope he's not 'embarrassed' about being wrong about Porcello. Ain't no big deal.

 

I'm expecting an SBF style mea culpa from him and Ted.

[a700hitter]

I'm expecting an SBF style mea culpa from him and Ted.

Why would I apologize? I bet on Porcello last year and lost. I still owe iortiz a case of American IPA's.

[User Name]

Why would I apologize? I bet on Porcello last year and lost. I still owe iortiz a case of American IPA's.

 

This year, you swore to the heavens Porcello was a 4-type who would never replicate his 2014. Mea culpa please.

[a700hitter]

This year, you swore to the heavens Porcello was a 4-type who would never replicate his 2014. Mea culpa please.

I don't think that I stated it that strongly, but i did think that replicating 2014 was unlikely. As for the mea culpa, let's wait until the end of the season. I'd hate to be foolish twice.

 

BTW, over his 8 year career including 2016, his ERA still sits at 4.24, so I don't know if a mea culpa is appropriate. I am thrilled at his success, but he is still a 4 ERA pitcher over 1,400 innings.

[User Name]

The pitcher he was back then is not the pitcher he is right now. That said, the dinger-itis is still worrying.

[a700hitter]

The pitcher he was back then is not the pitcher he is right now. That said, the dinger-itis is still worrying.

Very few pitchers completely transform themselves after 1,400 innings. That is a load of innings. Most guys don't have careers that are that long. Whatever is going on in 2016, I am really enjoying it, and it is very unexpected after the shitshow that he put on in 2015.

[Spudboy]

The pitcher he was back then is not the pitcher he is right now. That said, the dinger-itis is still worrying.

 

Maybe. He seems to be throwing more strikes and staying in or near the strike zone this year. He is pitching up more too.

 

Dingers will happen when you do that.

 

As long as his command is good, he should prevail.

[Kimmi]

Maybe. He seems to be throwing more strikes and staying in or near the strike zone this year. He is pitching up more too.

 

Dingers will happen when you do that.

 

As long as his command is good, he should prevail.

 

He is not walking anyone. His BB/9 is 2nd among qualified pitchers behind only Josh Tomlinson. His K/BB ranks first.

[Hugh2]

Porcellos first full 3 seasons in the majors he was age 21-23, must pitchers are still in AA/AAA ball at that point. I'm not saying to ignore those numbers but you have to take that into context. When you combine that with his improvement of numbers every year then he really looks like a pitcher coming into his own. That was a narrative destroyed last year with a horrible season, but this year is making it look like it was just a bad first year in Boston.

[Maxbialystock]

But it would be foolish to rely on a 41 yr old pitcher to bounce back so quickly and to be effective and reliable in late inning high leverage situations.

 

Rely might be the wrong word for Uehara, but maybe try fits. He's 41, but has never relied on strength. He throws two pitches, an 86-89 mpg "fastball" and, when it is on, a devastating splitter because it starts out looking like that fastball. He also has excellent control and a ton of guts to even throw that fastball.

 

The point is, Farrell needs to try him out and see what's working. If the control and the splitter are working, he could maybe be the set up man. As I understand this bullpen, right now Kimbrel is the closer and the 7th and 8th are up for grabs with Ziegler the best choice for the 8th and Ross or Barnes for the 7th. But I've read Farrell doesn't like Ziegler against lefty bats and maybe Ross against righties and Barnes against lefties.

 

Or put it this way. If Uehara is on, this bullpen could sure use some help.

[a700hitter]

Rely might be the wrong word for Uehara, but maybe try fits. He's 41, but has never relied on strength. He throws two pitches, an 86-89 mpg "fastball" and, when it is on, a devastating splitter because it starts out looking like that fastball. He also has excellent control and a ton of guts to even throw that fastball.

 

The point is, Farrell needs to try him out and see what's working. If the control and the splitter are working, he could maybe be the set up man. As I understand this bullpen, right now Kimbrel is the closer and the 7th and 8th are up for grabs with Ziegler the best choice for the 8th and Ross or Barnes for the 7th. But I've read Farrell doesn't like Ziegler against lefty bats and maybe Ross against righties and Barnes against lefties.

 

Or put it this way. If Uehara is on, this bullpen could sure use some help.

Don't get your hopes up. I still remember all the anticipation surrounding John Smoltz.

[Maxbialystock]

Smoltz didn't have a splitter.

 

I think the difference between a so-so Tazawa and a good Tazawa is that forkball of his. When it is on, it makes his fastball a ton more effective. Same as Kimbrel and that knuckle curve. Or Andrew Miller combining that very good fastball with a devastating slider that is almost as fast.

 

But I'm not building my hopes up. I just want Farrell to try Uehara a couple of times and it doesn't even need to be in pressure situations.

[a700hitter]

Smoltz didn't have a splitter.

 

I think the difference between a so-so Tazawa and a good Tazawa is that forkball of his. When it is on, it makes his fastball a ton more effective. Same as Kimbrel and that knuckle curve. Or Andrew Miller combining that very good fastball with a devastating slider that is almost as fast.

 

But I'm not building my hopes up. I just want Farrell to try Uehara a couple of times and it doesn't even need to be in pressure situations.

Smoltz threw the splitter.

[S5Dewey]

Is there anyone other than me who has little to no faith in Craig Kimbrel? I know that at the end of the day he (usually) gets the job done, but sweet God, can that guy ever throw fewer than three balls to a batter?? Did anyone ever tell him that one of the cardinal rules of relieving is that you NEVER WALK THE FIRST BATTER??

 

What happened yesterday was predictable, that sooner or later he'd walk someone and it would come back to bite him - and us - on the ass. The best thing we can hope for now is that he learned something from that experience and throws more strikes.

 

Amazing, too, because one of the things I've always said is that I want my closer to bed able to throw ~100 MPH. I guess what I should have been saying is that I want my closer to throw STRIKES at ~100 MPH.

 

If I were an opposing manager I'd be telling my players that when they're facing Kimbrel unless they get something they're sure they can square up that they should take two pitches and then see where they are in the count.

[a700hitter]

Is there anyone other than me who has little to no faith in Craig Kimbrel? I know that at the end of the day he (usually) gets the job done, but sweet God, can that guy ever throw fewer than three balls to a batter?? Did anyone ever tell him that one of the cardinal rules of relieving is that you NEVER WALK THE FIRST BATTER??

 

What happened yesterday was predictable, that sooner or later he'd walk someone and it would come back to bite him - and us - on the ass. The best thing we can hope for now is that he learned something from that experience and throws more strikes.

 

Amazing, too, because one of the things I've always said is that I want my closer to bed able to throw ~100 MPH. I guess what I should have been saying is that I want my closer to throw STRIKES at ~100 MPH.

 

If I were an opposing manager I'd be telling my players that when they're facing Kimbrel unless they get something they're sure they can square up that they should take two pitches and then see where they are in the count.

I don't think that he has a clue where the ball is going to go once it leaves his hand. For this reason, he cannot be trusted to come in with men on base. The good aspect of him is that his stuff is really hard to barrel up for hitters. He is a definite heart attack inducing closer.

[Nick]

Is there anyone other than me who has little to no faith in Craig Kimbrel? I know that at the end of the day he (usually) gets the job done, but sweet God, can that guy ever throw fewer than three balls to a batter?? Did anyone ever tell him that one of the cardinal rules of relieving is that you NEVER WALK THE FIRST BATTER??

 

What happened yesterday was predictable, that sooner or later he'd walk someone and it would come back to bite him - and us - on the ass. The best thing we can hope for now is that he learned something from that experience and throws more strikes.

 

Amazing, too, because one of the things I've always said is that I want my closer to bed able to throw ~100 MPH. I guess what I should have been saying is that I want my closer to throw STRIKES at ~100 MPH.

 

If I were an opposing manager I'd be telling my players that when they're facing Kimbrel unless they get something they're sure they can square up that they should take two pitches and then see where they are in the count.

 

I would categorize his outings as 'wreckless' and that's not a compliment. As a coach, I want to trust my players. He's untrustworthy. It's a crap shoot when he pitches.

[Maxbialystock]

Is there anyone other than me who has little to no faith in Craig Kimbrel? I know that at the end of the day he (usually) gets the job done, but sweet God, can that guy ever throw fewer than three balls to a batter?? Did anyone ever tell him that one of the cardinal rules of relieving is that you NEVER WALK THE FIRST BATTER??

 

What happened yesterday was predictable, that sooner or later he'd walk someone and it would come back to bite him - and us - on the ass. The best thing we can hope for now is that he learned something from that experience and throws more strikes.

 

Amazing, too, because one of the things I've always said is that I want my closer to bed able to throw ~100 MPH. I guess what I should have been saying is that I want my closer to throw STRIKES at ~100 MPH.

 

If I were an opposing manager I'd be telling my players that when they're facing Kimbrel unless they get something they're sure they can square up that they should take two pitches and then see where they are in the count.

 

He's perfect for this bullpen--inconsistent. Strangely enough, I am willing to overlook yesterday, not because he was compelled to pitch when a save was not at stake, but because I thought the Sox were never going to score. Kimbrel limited the torture to 9 innings and thereby saved the rest of the bullpen from a fruitless attempt to win.

[southpaw777]

Am I the only one who has faith that Clay would and has pitched better after his bullpen stint, and wanted him back in the rotation? Glad to see him back in there and yes, I Still believe we will see the "Ace" Clay moving forward. Ok, maybe not Ace, but I say he will still have solid numbers going forward.

[moonslav59]

We have the best starter ERA in the second half this year despite playing many games in Fenway and being in the toughest division in MLB.

 

Now, let's hope our pen can solidify.

[sk7326]

Somehow, whether by design or luck - our rotation is not a problem.

[S5Dewey]

Somehow, whether by design or luck - our rotation is not a problem.

 

And who would have thought a month ago that anyone would have been saying THAT early in September?!

[moonslav59]

And who would have thought a month ago that anyone would have been saying THAT early in September?!

 

Not me, for sure. It's amazing how well our rotation has done in the second half with our best first half guy, Wright, on the shelf or being unproductive!

 

Our future rotation also looks encouraging.

 

Although Owens has fallen in my eyes, I still hold out hope for Johnson.

 

Kopech and Groome are farther away, but with all of our starters under team control for at least 2 more years, we look to be set at our starting 5 until then.

 

Price 2 or 6 more years.

ERod 4-5 years

Wright 4 years

Porcello 3 years

Pomeranz 2 years

 

Johnson 4-5 years

Owens 4-5 years

Elias 4 years

Kelly 2 years

 

[southpaw777]

A David Price who is looking like the David Price we got for 30M per, Rick Porcello pitching like a legit CY candidate all year, and now maybe we can add a Clay Buchholz that found his groove since being sent to the pen? Add in a solid #4 with Pomeranz and hopefully a consistent and healthy Erod....Either way, thats a solid looking 1-4 making a playoff run.

Now, the bullpen? I think everyone should have their Xanax, high blood pressure meds, or whatever it is you do to "chill out" ready because its going to be a shitshow when the bullpen is called upon. Even with Kimbrel you dont know...I dont even think he knows where that 99MPH FB is going once it leaves his hand.

Im praying the starters can go long and maybe the BP can put it together good enough to close it out. I dont trust our bullpen though.

[mvp 78]

Pomeranz is the #3 right now and it's not even close.