Is the actual rotation the worst in the last 10 Y?

[Bellhorn04]

People get suspended here? I never noticed that there was a mod, but then again I'm not very observant. As for being crazy, I just hate what money does to the game. Guys making 15M/year profess love for their team and city, then jump at the first chance they get to make more. The egos these guys have is amazing.

 

I don't think it's all about ego, though it's certainly a factor.

 

There's also the fact that the player has other voices in his ear - his family, his agent, the Players Association etc.

 

And if a guy does take a significantly below-market deal, there will be a few stories that he was an idiot for doing so.

[Bellhorn04]

Re: park factors. Here are some interesting career numbers for road games:

 

Shields

ERA 4.00

OPS .739

 

Miley

ERA 3.31

OPS .704

[cp176]

I don't think it's all about ego, though it's certainly a factor.

 

There's also the fact that the player has other voices in his ear - his family, his agent, the Players Association etc.

 

And if a guy does take a significantly below-market deal, there will be a few stories that he was an idiot for doing so.

 

My feeling extends to the entire entertainment industry but I don't think that anyone is going to take a step back in time. If someone is willing to pay, I don't blame any player for getting as much as they can. Part of the allure for me as a kid was having a pretty good idea who was going to be playing for the home team from year to year. It was not that uncommon for players to begin and end their careers with the same team.

[Bellhorn04]

My feeling extends to the entire entertainment industry but I don't think that anyone is going to take a step back in time. If someone is willing to pay, I don't blame any player for getting as much as they can. Part of the allure for me as a kid was having a pretty good idea who was going to be playing for the home team from year to year. It was not that uncommon for players to begin and end their careers with the same team.

 

Free agency changed everything, no doubt. And it was what the players wanted all along. Human nature doesn't change over time, IMO, just environment changes.

[mvp 78]

Shields prefers to pitch on the West Coast and lives in San Diego. They are in talks with him and could probably offer a discounted deal that he'd take.

 

That's probably a better spot for him, imo.

[User Name]

Re: park factors. Here are some interesting career numbers for road games:

 

Shields

ERA 4.00

OPS .739

 

Miley

ERA 3.31

OPS .704

 

Yet more credence to the idea that Miley's main problem stems from Chase Field's homer-inflating environment. Whether Jacko in particular wants to believe it or not, the facts are there.

[seabeachfred]

Re: park factors. Here are some interesting career numbers for road games:

 

Shields

ERA 4.00

OPS .739

 

Miley

ERA 3.31

OPS .704

 

Those stats might be a bit skewed Bellhorn. Remember Shields pitched in the American League. Miley in the National League. Big difference in hitting ability between the two, big difference.

[User Name]

2014 average AL OPS: .706

 

2014 average NL OPS: .694

 

The "big difference" equates to .012 percentage points in OPS. The numbers aren't skewed at all.

[mvp 78]

2014 average AL OPS: .706

 

2014 average NL OPS: .694

 

The "big difference" equates to .012 percentage points in OPS. The numbers aren't skewed at all.

 

Dat 1% difference.

[Spudboy]

One thing that is commonly ignored when I pitcher comes to another league is the batter's lack of familiarity with that pitcher.

 

Of course a book will available to hitters and eventually they will recognize the arm slot, speed, etc.

[Kimmi]

Kimmi, they have built a rotation of guys who are either not that good or underachieving AND injury prone. The only guy in that rotation who is a playoff caliber starter is Porcello, and he's more a game 3 starter than anything else. I think Miley is gonna get s*** tanked in Boston. Buchholz and Masterson are coming off the two worst seasons in the AL last yr AND both were injured. Then there's Kelly, who is a reliever in starter's clothing and he is also hurt a lot. You rebuilt the rotation into a big pile of s***. The sox need two more starters IMO, and they need a 1 and a 2

 

 

There is no doubt that there are question marks with our rotation. Same could be said for the Yankees rotation. Obviously, I am a little more optimistic about the Sox rotation than others. The potential is there. It's not that I think they're going to be a top 3 rotation or anything along those lines. But I do think that they will be solid enough to keep the team in most games allowing the offense to come through. I would prefer a #1 type be added, but I'm good going into the season with what we have, and reassessing midseason. I trust the judgment of our FO.

[sk7326]

He might pitch below hois career norms at Yankee Stadium, but I am pretty sure that he would be an improvement over ther #4 and #5 guys thus improving their rotation. If the Yankees overpay for him, that is no comfort to me if he makes the Yankees better.

 

It's both pitching in big parks with superb defensive teams - the Yankees are neither. He would improve them - but by more of an "innings eater" standard than a star one.

[sk7326]

2014 average AL OPS: .706

 

2014 average NL OPS: .694

 

The "big difference" equates to .012 percentage points in OPS. The numbers aren't skewed at all.

 

that difference goes away when you remove that pesky #9 hitter

[Kimmi]

A lot of Red Sox fans think the same about the current rotation. Thing is that we take away our Red Sox glasses while others don't.

 

 

But if the Sox are so bad, why is it that most of the projection systems and analysts have them not only winning the division, but also being one of the best 6 or so teams in baseball this year?

[Kimmi]

Kimmi:

 

http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt231/philco77/remain_calm.jpg

 

 

LOL

 

You are cracking me up NS.

[Kimmi]

No Kimmi, the FO did not do a very good job of rebuilding the rotation at all. Read what Jacko wrote. He was pretty precise. Masterson and Buchholz are not pitchers you can count on, and Miley may wind up becoming a piñata in the American League. I still insist we really need one more very good pitcher......I would even like two if possible and time is running out.

 

 

Sure they did. They didn't get us a #1, but they rebuilt the rest of the rotation with some good pitchers who have good upside. I think we would all like another TOTR pitcher. But we don't need one. Not at this point. We can wait until midseason to see how things shake out.

[Kimmi]

Time will tell. On paper, it is not a very good rotation. Credit or blame should be reserved until we see how they perform.

 

 

On paper, the rotation is good enough to have us vying for the division.

[Kimmi]

People get suspended here? I never noticed that there was a mod, but then again I'm not very observant. As for being crazy, I just hate what money does to the game. Guys making 15M/year profess love for their team and city, then jump at the first chance they get to make more. The egos these guys have is amazing.

 

 

It's kind of disheartening. Loyalty and love for their team and city don't seem to mean anything to most players. The loyalty thing goes both ways, I know. I know it's a business, blah, blah, blah, but I would love to see more players and FOs be a little more sensitive to the human aspect when making their decisions.

[jacksonianmarch]

It's kind of disheartening. Loyalty and love for their team and city don't seem to mean anything to most players. The loyalty thing goes both ways, I know. I know it's a business, blah, blah, blah, but I would love to see more players and FOs be a little more sensitive to the human aspect when making their decisions.

 

Huh? If that were the case, then you'd have one championship on the books (2007) since the other two were augmented significantly through the FA process. Listen, a guy from the DR or Cuba doesn't give a rats ass about the Yankee-Sox rivalry. Neither does a kid from Florida or Cali. Most of these guys are from over 1,000 miles from Boston. There is no engrained loyalty there. And I know you say these things now, but if you were a player, you'd do the same thing

[Northern Star]

But if the Sox are so bad, why is it that most of the projection systems and analysts have them not only winning the division, but also being one of the best 6 or so teams in baseball this year?

 

Did I mention The Sporting News is picking the Cubs this year?

[Spudboy]

It's both pitching in big parks with superb defensive teams - the Yankees are neither. He would improve them - but by more of an "innings eater" standard than a star one.

 

Shields would definitely give the Yankee their best chance of getting 200+ IP from a starter.

 

I hope that he does not sign there.

 

Can everyone hear the bitching about the Sox FO if that happens while the Sox rotation flounders?

 

Oye.

[a700hitter]

On paper, the rotation is good enough to have us vying for the division.

They are good enough to compete for the division:

 

If Buch stays healthy

 

If Masterson stays healthy and gets back 4 mph on his fastball.

 

If Miley doesn't give up a couple of dozen HRs and can get his ERA below 4, and

 

If Kelly can be more than a 5 inning pitcher.

 

When you have this many "ifs," a few of them will not turn out well. When 2 or more don't happen, things tend to go south. So, I disagree that this rotation is good enough on paper to compete. They can compete "if" 4 of them can turn around last year's performances.

 

When I start hearing, if, if, if, if, I think that means trouble.

[a700hitter]

Shields would definitely give the Yankee their best chance of getting 200+ IP from a starter.

 

I hope that he does not sign there.

 

Can everyone hear the bitching about the Sox FO if that happens while the Sox rotation flounders?

 

Oye.

 

The bitching shouldn't bother you. You can tune that out. You will not be able to ignore that we will be rolling out a mediocre pitcher to start 4 out of every 5 games. That should bother you.

[User Name]

But if the Sox are so bad, why is it that most of the projection systems and analysts have them not only winning the division, but also being one of the best 6 or so teams in baseball this year?

 

Because they have "Red Sox glasses". Whatever the hell those are.

[jacksonianmarch]

I am not entirely sure how the sox can be considered one of the top teams with their rotation the way it is. Maybe it speaks more to the parody in the league rather than their actual ability

[User Name]

Check out the league average OPS and then check out the Sox' projected OPS. They have bashed their way to the POs before (as have the Yanks) and they can do it again.

[a700hitter]

I am not entirely sure how the sox can be considered one of the top teams with their rotation the way it is. Maybe it speaks more to the parody in the league rather than their actual ability

If an East Division team lands Shields, that might throw off the parity.

[iortiz]

I am not entirely sure how the sox can be considered one of the top teams with their rotation the way it is. Maybe it speaks more to the parody in the league rather than their actual ability

 

As I said, some weeks ago the Sox were not only fav to win the division but the WS LOL! the line was 9/1, the best odd to any team.

 

If NY land Shields I will put my money on them to win the division, unfortunately.

[a700hitter]

As I said, some weeks ago the Sox were not only fav to win the division but the WS LOL! the line was 9/1, the best odd to any team.

 

If NY land Shields I will put my money on them to win the division, unfortunately.

 

Was that prior to the Nat's signing Scherzer?

[iortiz]

Was that prior to the Nat's signing Scherzer?

 

It was prior to the NAts signing Scherzer. Let me update the lines.