Sources say Napoli signs with Sox.

[User Name]

Or they could take their time and blow the whole gambit---just as they did with Damon in late 2005, with Teixiera in late 2008, with Bay and Holiday in late 2009, or with Cody Ross this winter.

 

The moral of this story is that you stubbornly have an almost pathalogical attachment and confidence in a front office that has proved its incompetency time and again the past few years. As far as draft choices are concerned, they are crapshoots anyway. For every Pedroia there is a Craig Hansen, for every Jacoby Ellsbury there is an Andy Marte, for every Jonathan Papelbon there is a Manny Delcarmen. Meanwhile first basemen who hit 30 plus homers and drive in 110 plus runs are nowhere to be now found in Boston, neither at Fenway Park or in our farm system.

 

Pleased? I will be pleased when the RED SOX start winning AL East Division Titles to begin the winning ways again instead of one paltry one in the past 17 years. When we win more than two AL Pennants that the two we've won in the past 26 seasons. From there I'd more than take my chances in the World Series. Fine for you if you think that this record is satisfactory for you; it isn't for me. I want a helluva lot more than that.

 

As for Napoli, it has been four weeks now. Get it done or move on before we're forced to put those two stumblebums on first with most likely disastrous results to follow.

 

No i don't. There are several things they do that i don't particularly like (Victorino and Gomes come to mind) the difference is that i don't spend my time writing about how much the FO sucks, how much more i know than everyone else about baseball and insulting other posters.

 

You can express your displeasure (as misguided as it may be) without being an asshat, but it seems like you're incapable of managing such a monumental task.

 

And for the record, yes, some Red Sox fans around here are extremely entitled and they DO talk TOO MUCH.

 

The point here is that there's nothing they can do that satisfies you, you will always find something to bitch about, and that gets old. IF they blow it, then you can bitch about it, but for the love of God, why whine whine whine about it now.

 

Also, Cody Ross? Are you serious?

[User Name]

It took 70 days to sign JD Drew. This deal won't get done anytime soon.

 

And in the meantime we'll have the pleasure of reading the diatribes of the people who should be running the Red Sox because of their great knowledge about baseball operations, but are stuck with the unenviable role of Monday-night quarterbacking.

[a700hitter]

I don't get the point of this Napoli negotiation. If the guy has a physical condition that is concerning, move on. That's why they have the physicals. You either take him "as is" or move on. This ridiculous negotiation is like some new form of Dumpster Diving. it's like shopping at the Dollar Store where odd lots goods and irregulars sell for way below the normal retail price. If Napoli drops his price or agrees to only 2 years, big whoop. He's still damaged goods.

[iortiz]

I don't get the point of this Napoli negotiation. If the guy has a physical condition that is concerning, move on. That's why they have the physicals. You either take him "as is" or move on. This ridiculous negotiation is like some new form of Dumpster Diving. it's like shopping at the Dollar Store where odd lots goods and irregulars sell for way below the normal retail price. If Napoli drops his price or agrees to only 2 years, big whoop. He's still damaged goods.

 

This.

[seabeachfred]

Oh come on Fred, us entitled spoiled Red Sox fans expect too much. This great ownership group and FO has finished first once in its 11 year tenure. Thank goodness for the wild card. That's the same number of times that they finished first in the 11 years prior to 2002. From 1980-90 they finished first 3 times. As Red Sox fans, we should be more thankful for the wild card than JH and his band of carpetbaggers.

 

You know Ted, if you take 2 WS Titles in the 11 years Henry and Co. have been in charge it would not be that bad a record considering there are 30 teams in the Major Leagues, but 2 AL Pennants in 26 years? One AL East Title in 17? That 's pathetic---and yet we have apologists like Nixon waxing poetic about what a bang-up job the front office has done. He claims there are things that they do that he disapproves of but he never elaborates on them, and most of the time he defends them to the last breath.

 

Are we entitled to more? Perhaps long suffering fans are happy with what they gotten after so many dreary seasons, but I'm only a 12 plus year veteran and feel entitled to more than one division and two pennants. Why? It has a lot to do with the fandom of our team. I have become totally convinced since my Red Sox epiphony that we are the most rabid and loyal fans in the game. We support the team in attendance, buying Red Sox gear, taking team destination trips, flooding the baseball sites with our enthusiasm for our team. And what did we get this year? The 100 year of Fenway Park and they give us that pig of a team as an anniversary present? That is a total disgrace and was a slap in the face to every loyal Red Sox fan in the country---including Nixon.

 

Keep in mind when the Yankees opened their new stadium in 2009 they christened it with a WS Title that year. Contrast that to our anniversary year this past season. Quite a contrast, wouldn't you say?

[a700hitter]

You know Ted, if you take 2 WS Titles in the 11 years Henry and Co. have been in charge it would not be that bad a record considering there are 30 teams in the Major Leagues, but 2 AL Pennants in 26 years? One AL East Title in 17? That 's pathetic---and yet we have apologists like Nixon waxing poetic about what a bang-up job the front office has done. He claims there are things that they do that he disapproves of but he never elaborates on them, and most of the time he defends them to the last breath.

 

Are we entitled to more? Perhaps long suffering fans are happy with what they gotten after so many dreary seasons, but I'm only a 12 plus year veteran and feel entitled to more than one division and two pennants. Why? It has a lot to do with the fandom of our team. I have become totally convinced since my Red Sox epiphony that we are the most rabid and loyal fans in the game. We support the team in attendance, buying Red Sox gear, taking team destination trips, flooding the baseball sites with our enthusiasm for our team. And what did we get this year? The 100 year of Fenway Park and they give us that pig of a team as an anniversary present? That is a total disgrace and was a slap in the face to every loyal Red Sox fan in the country---including Nixon.

 

Keep in mind when the Yankees opened their new stadium in 2009 they christened it with a WS Title that year. Contrast that to our anniversary year this past season. Quite a contrast, wouldn't you say?

I agree with you completely. IMO the Red Sox Marketing department is where all the talent resides in the organization. The baseball operations is full of duds.

[seabeachfred]

It took 70 days to sign JD Drew. This deal won't get done anytime soon.

 

As I recall MVP you are right on the money, but aren't there some differences this time around? In J.D's case the money was a big bundle and no o ther team was doing to offer him anything like what the Red Sox were offering, that, plus the word around was that he wanted to play for the Red Sox. We're hearing another team is already talking to Napoli, and whether that is hot air or the truth, it would seem a little more urgency to get this done, that, or move on, would seem to be the prudent move about now. The more this drags on the more chance it has to blow up IMHO.

[seabeachfred]

No i don't. There are several things they do that i don't particularly like (Victorino and Gomes come to mind) the difference is that i don't spend my time writing about how much the FO sucks, how much more i know than everyone else about baseball and insulting other posters.

 

You can express your displeasure (as misguided as it may be) without being an asshat, but it seems like you're incapable of managing such a monumental task.

 

And for the record, yes, some Red Sox fans around here are extremely entitled and they DO talk TOO MUCH.

 

The point here is that there's nothing they can do that satisfies you, you will always find something to bitch about, and that gets old. IF they blow it, then you can bitch about it, but for the love of God, why whine whine whine about it now.

 

Also, Cody Ross? Are you serious?

 

Yea Cody Ross!!!!!! I'm serious. Certainly in comparison to the declining Victorino and that bloated contract he got, or Gomes who can't field a ball or hit a RH to save his sorry ass. Oh yea, you don't approve of those moves you say, so let me hear why they are better moves than resigning Ross. There's your chance to reverse course again and defend the moves after all.

 

And who the hell am I insulting? I state that you are a strong defender of the front office as I am a critic. That isn't insulting; it is the TRUTH, and you know it and most of the board knows it. Nothing satisfies me so you say but I recall lauding the Napoli "signing", trading for Hanrahan, and signing Uehara. I don't remember bitching at that. The fact is you don't like what I write so you accuse me of being a know-it-all when I have never said that I consider myself above anyone on this board knowledge wise.

 

The asshat comes in because you don't like or agree with what I write because we are wired differently. As for entitled about what has t ranspired over the years, you can go right ahead and be cool and comforted with one AL East Title in 17 years and two AL Pennants in 26. I not at all with that record and doubt too many on this or any other board are satisfied with it either.

[Palodios]

As I recall MVP you are right on the money, but aren't there some differences this time around? In J.D's case the money was a big bundle and no o ther team was doing to offer him anything like what the Red Sox were offering, that, plus the word around was that he wanted to play for the Red Sox. We're hearing another team is already talking to Napoli, and whether that is hot air or the truth, it would seem a little more urgency to get this done, that, or move on, would seem to be the prudent move about now. The more this drags on the more chance it has to blow up IMHO.

 

There are other teams in on Napoli, but no one is at all interested in paying him what the Red Sox did. The Mariners reportedly backed off him when they found about his hip issues-- it limits him from being a catcher and puts him into a 1B/DH only role, and there are not many teams looking for a first baseman right now.

 

Put it into perspective-- Laroche won a gold glove, hit 30 HRs, had 100 RBIs... and he can't seem to find a 3 year deal.

[seabeachfred]

There are other teams in on Napoli, but no one is at all interested in paying him what the Red Sox did. The Mariners reportedly backed off him when they found about his hip issues-- it limits him from being a catcher and puts him into a 1B/DH only role, and there are not many teams looking for a first baseman right now.

 

Put it into perspective-- Laroche won a gold glove, hit 30 HRs, had 100 RBIs... and he can't seem to find a 3 year deal.

 

Once again Palodios you hit a booming extra base hit. Is money that tight or is there a red flag with LaRoche? IPOT, who sometimes post here, believes the Nationals are holding fast to a two year offer on Adam because they have a solid alternate in that Morse fellow. That could be a reason for the delay. The contrast is the Nats have Morse while we have Gomez or Salty, a piss poor comparison IMHO.

 

Perhaps this Napoli thing will work its way out, but remember we have blown sky high negotiations for players before when the front office insisted on clauses that were insulting to players or the amount of money wasn't right or whatever. I think I'm reading that you think this will turn out right for us after all and if so I hope you are right on about that.

 

If I may say so, it looks like you're not in agreement with my take on things but couch it in terms that tell me I'm probably wrong with calling me an asshat like Nixon does, nor getting all bent out of shape because I take a different tack on things. Hell, we're all in this together and while many of us have different ways of expressing ourselves we all are of a mind that we want what is best for the Red Sox.

[mvp 78]

ALE titles are way more important than actually winning 2 WS, right?

[a700hitter]

ALE titles are way more important than actually winning 2 WS, right?

of course that's what was meant.

[jung]

It appears to me that teams are willing to pay all the money but are now somewhat more stubborn about the condition of the player and the potential for injury.

 

Any player can fall prey to injury but this is starting to feel a little like players with an existing condition that looks like it is headed toward injury are between a rock and a hard place, there value in the market tumbling in terms of either term or per annum....term being more likely.

 

I actually never thought I would see the day where some semblance of sanity entered the equation as teams continued to try to outbid each other for aging players with some star power. But I actually think there is finally a line teams are finding more difficult to cross.

 

Taking on salary obligations with the ceiling created by the LT tax penalty and additional penalties and under the umbrella of the guaranteed contract simply makes no sense. Of course we are likely to argue that teams should just spend above the cap penalties be damned but I don't think that is reasonable either.

 

I do think the next CBA negotiation might be the most interesting one we have had in awhile. It will be the second since the money has gotten completely ridiculous and the first since teams appear to be adopting positions that are somewhat more risk averse on a player by player basis. MLB had no stomach for that fight in the last negotiation but by the time we get to the next both sides PA and League may well be looking for a better way out of these messes than they have now.

[Palodios]

Once again Palodios you hit a booming extra base hit. Is money that tight or is there a red flag with LaRoche? IPOT, who sometimes post here, believes the Nationals are holding fast to a two year offer on Adam because they have a solid alternate in that Morse fellow. That could be a reason for the delay. The contrast is the Nats have Morse while we have Gomez or Salty, a piss poor comparison IMHO.

 

Perhaps this Napoli thing will work its way out, but remember we have blown sky high negotiations for players before when the front office insisted on clauses that were insulting to players or the amount of money wasn't right or whatever. I think I'm reading that you think this will turn out right for us after all and if so I hope you are right on about that.

 

If I may say so, it looks like you're not in agreement with my take on things but couch it in terms that tell me I'm probably wrong with calling me an asshat like Nixon does, nor getting all bent out of shape because I take a different tack on things. Hell, we're all in this together and while many of us have different ways of expressing ourselves we all are of a mind that we want what is best for the Red Sox.

 

Here's the thing: If you look at the top 15 teams with the highest salaries, almost all of them have very good first basemen already. So essentially the only teams bidding for Napoli/Laroche either don't need him, or don't have the money to come anywhere near what the Red Sox would pay.

 

Is Laroche a big enough upgrade over Brandon Belt to give him 3/45? Freddie Freeman? Anthony Rizzo? Morneau? Mitch Mooreland? Nope.

 

The Red Sox are in good shape here because first base is perhaps the only position in baseball that is actually a buyer's market.

[a700hitter]

Here's the thing: If you look at the top 15 teams with the highest salaries, almost all of them have very good first basemen already. So essentially the only teams bidding for Napoli/Laroche either don't need him, or don't have the money to come anywhere near what the Red Sox would pay.

 

Is Laroche a big enough upgrade over Brandon Belt to give him 3/45? Freddie Freeman? Anthony Rizzo? Morneau? Mitch Mooreland? Nope.

 

The Red Sox are in good shape here because first base is perhaps the only position in baseball that is actually a buyer's market.

As solely a first baseman, 3/$39 million is an overpay for Napoli.

[Palodios]

As solely a first baseman, 3/$39 million is an overpay for Napoli.

 

That's probably the concern. He's probably healthy enough for first base, but the hip will cause problems at catcher.

[mvp 78]

of course that's what was meant.

 

I know it's not what he meant, but complaining about a lack of division titles is pointless. The goal is to win a WS, not the AL East.

[a700hitter]

I know it's not what he meant, but complaining about a lack of division titles is pointless. The goal is to win a WS, not the AL East.

With the new wild card alignment and the 1 game elimination finishing second will greatly diminish a teams chances of winning the World Championship. Our owners have been aiming for second place most seasons and relying on the relative parity afforded the wild card team. That will no longer be the case.

[Rdsxmbnt]

With the new wild card alignment and the 1 game elimination finishing second will greatly diminish a teams chances of winning the World Championship. Our owners have been aiming for second place most seasons and relying on the relative parity afforded the wild card team. That will no longer be the case.

 

How do you aim for second place? You get second place by not being in first place.

[a700hitter]

How do you aim for second place? You get second place by not being in first place.

Are you serious?

[Rdsxmbnt]

Are you serious?

 

You believe the ownership is somehow not putting in the full effort to get first place and are instead aiming for the wildcard every year. That notion is absurd.

[seabeachfred]

You believe the ownership is somehow not putting in the full effort to get first place and are instead aiming for the wildcard every year. That notion is absurd.

 

Not absurd at all Rdsx. If you followed Theo Epstein's pre-season spiels over the years he always said the first priority was to win between 90-95 games and get into the playoffs. He never said WIN THE DIVISION, I gu ess because he didn't we had to since we usually had better records than other second place teams in other divisions. Now with the new format winning division titles takes on a more important aspect in a teams potential success.

 

In fact the only person connected to the Red Sox who talked about winning the division was Larry Lucchino who said he wanted to win it in 2003 (we didn't) and wanted to win one or two afterward. Interesting to note that when the team looked like it was ready to blow what was once a 12 game lead over the Yankees and finish second again in 2007, the strategy challenged Francona said the WC was fine with him only to have Larry tell him in no uncertain terms that it was not ok, that this year we win that division and stop using Eric Gagne in key situations that last week of the regular season because of his constant failures in key situations that last month. It was the only division we have won in 17 years and it helped us get home field advantage---and that be came critical in the ALCS with Cleveland when the last two games were played at Fenway.

 

Perhaps you remember that.

[Palodios]

Not absurd at all Rdsx. If you followed Theo Epstein's pre-season spiels over the years he always said the first priority was to win between 90-95 games and get into the playoffs. He never said WIN THE DIVISION, I gu ess because he didn't we had to since we usually had better records than other second place teams in other divisions. Now with the new format winning division titles takes on a more important aspect in a teams potential success.

 

I just don't understand why we're focusing on winning the division. In the last decade, it was completely and utterly meaningless. Obviously now it means more... but honestly, besides t-shirt sales that say "AL East Champions", how does it help anything?

 

Sure, the team may face the #2 instead of the #3 team, but there is no guarantee that the seedings are accurate up to the current point in the season.

 

In the future, there will be a different strategy, but you can't harp on getting into the playoffs when you get in with equal footing.

[jung]

IMO, the Sox actually did aim to win the division until the creation of the second WC. Last year was the first year that I can look at what they did to build the roster and then the resultant roster and convince myself that they were "aiming" for one of the two WC births.

 

Ironically, Uncle Bud created this mess in order to draw more fan support for the smaller market teams and give them a hope of post season participation. I doubt seriously that Uncle Bud's intent was to see one or more of his big market teams set their sights so low. Although it does my heart good anytime any part of Uncle Bud's cluster f*** blows up in his face. They had a defensible playoff setup and scraped it for a set up that is not defensible in any regard including generating revenue as that did not happen to any great extent either.

 

I joined a wireless telecom company many years ago. It was active in several wireless telecom markets. One of its newer ventures when I joined was known then as commercial wireless radio, an umbrella term that mainly covered commercial business, public safety and utility applications for radio technology. Their efforts in this area were an abominable failure. I was hired to fix it. Fix it and I had a career, fix it not and I would likely be gone. Well I did enough to fix it temporarily. However I realized that the entire effort before I got there was built on the notion that the market was big enough to support another player and that at some level they could generate enough market share to make some money out of it on a modest effort. A woeful business plan if I ever saw one.

 

Though I did fix it enough to buy some time I realized we could never survive that way. Our core capabilities were not at all well matched to that end of the market and as soon as we made enough noise to cause some trouble the guys the really had the market share would simply put us out of our misery. So I cast about for an embryonic market that none of my competitors was paying any attention to that we could get into on the ground floor. I would service the businesses providing the main radio piece with our complimentary but necessary accessory product. Found it and convinced ownership that we could invest in and grow with that business. That was almost twenty years ago now and the market was unlicensed wireless data connectivity....the market that ultimately became Wi-Fi and other related FCC Part 15 governed radio technologies. We dominated our end of that market from that day forward. Competitors ten times our size could never catch up to us no matter what they did or tried.

 

The lesson...aiming for second place is a lousy strategy. The Red Sox cannot cast about for something similar to baseball to do with their assets as I did but it is still true that aiming for second will almost assure you of something less than second....like the basement for example.

[reYoukilis]

How can anybody plan for success by aiming for second? Will they be dissapointed if they get first? Hell no! All Epstein was saying is that they need, at least 90-95 wins, it doesnt mean he wasnt aiming for more.

 

The most fair playoff format is the one that will never come back and thats the two pennant winners playing each other in the WS.

[a700hitter]

I just don't understand why we're focusing on winning the division. In the last decade, it was completely and utterly meaningless. Obviously now it means more... but honestly, besides t-shirt sales that say "AL East Champions", how does it help anything?

 

Sure, the team may face the #2 instead of the #3 team, but there is no guarantee that the seedings are accurate up to the current point in the season.

 

In the future, there will be a different strategy, but you can't harp on getting into the playoffs when you get in with equal footing.

The fact is that in most seasons the team was not built to beat the Yanks, but rather to get into the playoffs. The playoffs were paramount under the old wild card system. No one is disputing that, but winning your division does mean that you were the best team over 162 games. That happened once. Their record in that regard was just not very good. They built the best team once. Period. That is their record.

[a700hitter]

How can anybody plan for success by aiming for second? Will they be dissapointed if they get first? Hell no! All Epstein was saying is that they need, at least 90-95 wins, it doesnt mean he wasnt aiming for more.

 

The most fair playoff format is the one that will never come back and thats the two pennant winners playing each other in the WS.

they made it very clear over many years that it was more important to "line up their pitching for the post season" rather than finish first. That is playing for second.

[Bellhorn04]

The fact is that in most seasons the team was not built to beat the Yanks, but rather to get into the playoffs. The playoffs were paramount under the old wild card system. No one is disputing that, but winning your division does mean that you were the best team over 162 games. That happened once. Their record in that regard was just not very good. They built the best team once. Period. That is their record.

 

But on the other hand, who cares about having the best regular season record? It's meaningless.

 

The St. Louis Cardinals won 105 games in 2004 and 100 games in 2005. No cigar. They won 83 games in 2006 and 90 games in 2011. Two cigars.

 

This is just an academic debate IMO.

[BSN07]

This.

 

Do any of your posts start with something other then "This" "I totally agree with you" or some other reference to how much your are 100% on board with anything and everything a700 writes? I mean if thats what you want so be it, I just figure why not be something other then a a700 co-signer? Not trying to be a dick, just trying to encourage you to write something of your own view instead of just agreeing with and re-writing something someone already said all the time. I mean ya I get we all say the same things but most of us venture of on our own thought process as well from time to time. I can honestly not re-call a post written by you that was not co-signing something a700 said.

[BSN07]

Winning the division has far more meaning now then it did. Theo built to win 90-95 games because that should be good enough to get you into the playoffs which was the point. Being the WC team or Division winner had no real advantage. Now it does. I would think most teams would be trying to build for a division title and trying to avoid the WC game all together.

 

The WC has become what it should have been, a last chance not the same chance as a division winner. I think the new format is great. And will feel the same even if the Sox were a one and done team. 1 game is a lot to put 2 teams seasons on the line for, but they didn't win the division, so that's not a luxury the team gets to have.