Boston Red Sox Looking To Add Right-Handed Bat

[Hugh2]

7 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

He thinks if you don't agree with him, you cant or don't understand his point.

He wildly changes his criteria and expects us to follow along and agree with them.

"Now" matters only when it fits "What [he] said before..." 

he replied to your SSS comment with his “here and now” comment.  I then baited him in with a completely different example and he took the bait and switched the goalposts.

Here and now.  When Jordan was traded the “here and now” was he was a lower ranked prospect who was seen as a right handed platoon at 1b with no speed and struggled against velocity.

“The here and now” is he’s still only ranked 25th in the Cardinals system with the same profile but a decent batting line in only 31 at bats. 
 

somehow a different SSS reverses the logic.  What a guy is doing now doesn’t change the history when it doesn’t make one’s point I suppose.

I suppose some people just can’t appreciate the here and now of Caleb Durbin.

[Hugh2]

Contreras has played better than Alonso too, but the here and now doesn’t matter here and now but rather the here in now back in early December.  I suppose that would be the here and then?

[Old Red]

9 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

he replied to your SSS comment with his “here and now” comment.  I then baited him in with a completely different example and he took the bait and switched the goalposts.

Here and now.  When Jordan was traded the “here and now” was he was a lower ranked prospect who was seen as a right handed platoon at 1b with no speed and struggled against velocity.

“The here and now” is he’s still only ranked 25th in the Cardinals system with the same profile but a decent batting line in only 31 at bats. 
 

somehow a different SSS reverses the logic.  What a guy is doing now doesn’t change the history when it doesn’t make one’s point I suppose.

Bait? You a fisherman? I like the lobster boats myself. Who said anything about changing history? Who? Yes the here, and now Jordan is playing for the big league Cardinals. 1-4 Friday night with 2 RBI. The here, and now.

[Old Red]

1 minute ago, Hugh2 said:

Contreras has played better than Alonso too, but the here and now doesn’t matter here and now but rather the here in now back in early December.  I suppose that would be the here and then?

Crochet I was told was the CY runner up last year. What’s he doing now? Big difference is it not?

[Hugh2]

4 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Bait? You a fisherman? I like the lobster boats myself. Who said anything about changing history? Who? Yes the here, and now Jordan is playing for the big league Cardinals.

Ryan Braiser played for the Dodgers after the Sox DFA’d him that made him a big league pitcher for the best team….so what?

[Old Red]

10 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Ryan Braiser played for the Dodgers after the Sox DFA’d him that made him a big league pitcher for the best team….so what?

And the Red Sox picked up Dustin May…..so what?

[notin]

1 hour ago, Old Red said:

Bait? You a fisherman? I like the lobster boats myself. Who said anything about changing history? Who? Yes the here, and now Jordan is playing for the big league Cardinals. 1-4 Friday night with 2 RBI. The here, and now.

Jordan is a suspect at best.  Right?

[Duran Is The Man]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes, I cherry-picked. (IMO, his last start was 6.1 IP and 2 ERs, which is good or very good but not really excellent.)

now compare him to the dogshit we've got from Crochet this year.

[Duran Is The Man]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Agreed.

Harrison is having an excellent season.

Priester was last year, and now we hardly hear about that "horrible trade."

Someday, the Harrison trade may be viewed differently, just as the Priester deal might be, depending on how YRod, Holobetz and Phillips turn out. 

Using only the "now" criteria when you trade for prospects is seriously flawed.

The Harrison for Durbin trade was not that type of trade, and it's perfectly okay to say we have lost on the trade so far, but the final judgement is years away.

the Crochet trade may end up horrible for us, jsut like the Priester trade, right? i mean, they're all TBD, right?

[Old Red]

3 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

now compare him to the dogshit we've got from Crochet this year.

Exactly! Cro Man may have been CY runner up last year, but how’s that helped the Red Sox this year?

[Old Red]

6 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

the Crochet trade may end up horrible for us, jsut like the Priester trade, right? i mean, they're all TBD, right?

The Sale trade looked good too until they gave him that extension.

[notin]

5 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Exactly! Cro Man may have been CY runner up last year, but how’s that helped the Red Sox this year?

So that makes it a bad trade?

[Old Red]

31 minutes ago, notin said:

Jordan is a suspect at best.  Right?

Jordan? Jordan? Where have I heard that name before? I saw a Blaze Jordan in Portland one time, so can that be him? Was he traded, or something?🤔

[Hugh2]

52 minutes ago, notin said:

Jordan is a suspect at best.  Right?

But here and now here and now….unless it’s here and then then it’s here and then.

[Old Red]

15 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

But here and now here and now….unless it’s here and then then it’s here and then.

Inside out, round, and round, and how low can you go. I think you’re trying to find that 3rd option in the fork in the road, but that’s ok. Keep looking.

[Hugh2]

2 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Inside out, round, and round, and how low can you go. I think you’re trying to find that 3rd option in the fork in the road, but that’s ok. Keep looking.

Calling your plays out loud while you move the goal posts I see???

[Old Red]

5 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Calling your plays out loud while you move the goal posts I see???

Hut, hut,hut!🤓

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Duran Is The Man said:

the Crochet trade may end up horrible for us, jsut like the Priester trade, right? i mean, they're all TBD, right?

Yes, it can turn out that way, and the extension, too.

That trade is far from its final grade. It looked like an A to A+ last year, but it's maybe a B+ to B or TBD, now.

[Old Red]

4 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes, it can turn out that way, and the extension, too.

That trade is far from its final grade. It looked like an A to A+ last year, but it's maybe a B+ to B or TBD, now.

What a difference a year makes. Then it was great, but NOW it’s a whole different story. Tomorrow? 

[a700hitter]

7 hours ago, notin said:

Your goal posts for “here and now” shift to cover your agenda…

Red, I didn’t know that you had an agenda.  What is it?  Are you trying to turn TalkSox into a commie organization.

[a700hitter]

6 hours ago, notin said:

Jordan is a suspect at best.  Right?

He was hitting 400 foot homers when he was 14.  He might be legit.  We will have to wait and see.  What we got from Matz was very limited and it is over.  Jordan could be around for a while.

[Old Red]

9 minutes ago, a700hitter said:

Red, I didn’t know that you had an agenda.  What is it?  Are you trying to turn TalkSox into a commie organization.

You have to consider the neighborhood, and who said it, and especially when it’s NNN.

[moonslav59]

4 minutes ago, a700hitter said:

He was hitting 400 foot homers when he was 14.  He might be legit.  We will have to wait and see.  What we got from Matz was very limited and it is over.  Jordan could be around for a while.

He might, but his profile is much like hundreds and probably thousands who have failed.

He spent 6 seasons in the minors and never impressed many people. He did well in A+ then kinda meh.

73 HRs in 2367 PAs (24 in 620 at AAA.) That's not bad, but he's a longshot.

[notin]

1 hour ago, a700hitter said:

He was hitting 400 foot homers when he was 14.  He might be legit.  We will have to wait and see.  What we got from Matz was very limited and it is over.  Jordan could be around for a while.

I know his story.  But Old Red calls all Sox prospects as suspects until, well, no idea.  But prospects they trade away get no such designation.

Matz is over and done, but the Sox were making a playoff push.  If you want the Sox to add help on deadlines when the team is good, it helps to accept the Sox might occasionally deal away a good prospect.  It happens. 

[a700hitter]

7 minutes ago, notin said:

I know his story.  But Old Red calls all Sox prospects as suspects until, well, no idea.  But prospects they trade away get no such designation.

Matz is over and done, but the Sox were making a playoff push.  If you want the Sox to add help on deadlines when the team is good, it helps to accept the Sox might occasionally deal away a good prospect.  It happens. 

Dave D had a knack for trading the guys that never made it.   Breslow seems to trade guys without giving them any opportunity with the RedSox who go on to have significant success elsewhere..

[notin]

1 hour ago, a700hitter said:

Dave D had a knack for trading the guys that never made it.   Breslow seems to trade guys without giving them any opportunity with the RedSox who go on to have significant success elsewhere..

Well, not really fair comp.  Dave D traded quite a few players that would have been considered successful after only 32PA or a handful of IP.  Remember when Ty Buttrey silted into the closer role for the Angels?  It was like “damnit!!”  Interestingly,  DD did deal away an All Star (Santiago Espinal) in a deadline deal and no one blinked.  But Breslow is being held to some insane scrutiny where players performing the same or worse as they did in Boston are considered to have gotten away.

Plus DD might have gotten some help from Sale forcing his way out of Chicago.  Crochet was less immature about the situation there.

 

[a700hitter]

Do you really want to compare the track record of Breslow to Dave D?  Seriously?

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, a700hitter said:

Dave D had a knack for trading the guys that never made it.   Breslow seems to trade guys without giving them any opportunity with the RedSox who go on to have significant success elsewhere..

Was DD a genius because our farm was over-rated? Hardly anyone did well.

No, he was genius because almost every big signing worked, almost every trade worked, and the prospects he kept were largely unknowns who ended up being better than many highly ranked prospects he dealt.

No, comparing Brez and DD is pointless.

[mvp 78]

17 hours ago, Old Red said:

Exactly! Cro Man may have been CY runner up last year, but how’s that helped the Red Sox this year?

Exactly! The Sox won 4 WS since 2000. I know many people said they would die happy if they could live to just see one, but how's that helped the Red Sox this year? 

[mvp 78]

9 hours ago, notin said:

Well, not really fair comp.  Dave D traded quite a few players that would have been considered successful after only 32PA or a handful of IP.  Remember when Ty Buttrey silted into the closer role for the Angels?  It was like “damnit!!”  Interestingly,  DD did deal away an All Star (Santiago Espinal) in a deadline deal and no one blinked.  But Breslow is being held to some insane scrutiny where players performing the same or worse as they did in Boston are considered to have gotten away.

Plus DD might have gotten some help from Sale forcing his way out of Chicago.  Crochet was less immature about the situation there.

 

AS Espinal's career high fWAR was 2.4.

Buttrey was traded so that the Sox could have a 2b for a WS team. He slid into the role in '18 and got 4 saves. He retired after 2020. Not a big loss there.