Article: Checking In On Dave Dombrowski, Five Years After He Left The Red Sox

[mvp 78]

The closer in 2015 wasn't the reason they were in last place though!

Uehara 2015: 40.1 IP, 2.23 ERA, 2.44 FIP, 0.917 WHIP

[mvp 78]

Look how they massacred my boy...

 

[notin]

1 hour ago, dgalehouse said:

This is just nitpicking Dombrowski's moves. The important thing is that he took a cellar dwelling team and won three straight division titles. The Sox have not done that before or since. It's like saying the dinner was great, but the chef should be fired because he used a little too much oregano and not quite enough garlic. 

We nitpick moves from every CBO or GM.  So do you.  Why is Dombrowski supposed to be exempt? 

[notin]

3 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

The Bogaerts extension should have been longer. It was just a bad deal IMO.

I didn't like the Eovaldi extension as he's shown not to be healthy year in and year out. 

Would Xander have signed a longer deal?  As he was one year from free agency at the time, I’m surprised he signed one at all, let alone a below-market-value one

[mvp 78]

6 minutes ago, notin said:

Would Xander have signed a longer deal?  As he was one year from free agency at the time, I’m surprised he signed one at all, let alone a below-market-value one

Was it below market? 

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

4 minutes ago, notin said:

Would Xander have signed a longer deal?  As he was one year from free agency at the time, I’m surprised he signed one at all, let alone a below-market-value one

I'm not surprised he left the Red Sox' yellow uniforms, but his new team colors include both yellow and pinstripes. Ugh...

At least the Pads still wear camo once in awhile, for guys who want to blend into the desert, ashamed from wearing yellow and pinstripes.

[Bellhorn04]

4 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Was it below market? 

Yes, but not like Pedroia's extension was. 😜

[moonslav59]

Kimbrel was really his first move (NOV '15) followed by Chris Young and Price in early DEC. That Price signing shocked the hell out of me, and others.

Midseason '16: traded Rijo & Wilkerson for Aaron Hill and traded Basabe & Almonte for Brad Ziegler, then Espinoza for Pomeranz. At the deadline, Pat Light for Fernando Abad.

2nd offseason (Fall '16-Spring '17): Dubon, Shaw & Pennington for Thornburg and the big shocker: 4 players for Chris Sale. Selected Josh Rutledge Rule 5. Singed Mitch Moreland. Traded Buch for Josh Tobias. Paid cash for Hector Velazquez.

2017 midseason: Doug Fister off waivers. Traded Longhi, I Diaz & S Espinal for IFA bonus pool space. Traded Shaun Anderson & G Santos for Nunez and then 3 prospects for Addison Reed.

3rd offseason ('17-'18): Re-signed Moreland & Nunez. Signed JD Martinez.

Midseason: Santiago Espinal for Steve Pearce, then Beeks for Nate. Also, Buttrey & Jerez for Kinsler

4th off season and his last: Quiroz for Colten Brewer (effectively Kimbrel & Kelly's replacement) Extended Sale & Bogaerts.

Midseason: Cash for Andrew Cashner

[Duran Is The Man]

8 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

I think he did a great job through 2018 and ignore what didn't work. However, it really came off the rails that offseason for him IMO. 

Nate extension

Wright PED suspension

Shugart 2nd time drug suspension

Sale extension

Xander extension with opt out

No other offseason trades or deals of note even though the transaction log is littered with injury notes. 

Cora rests his rotation in April.

INTL signings: Perales, Garcia Bros, Castro (DD doesn't know who these guys are)

Draft: Cannon, Lugo, Zeferjahn, Song, Murphy, Walter

Acquired Andrew F'n Cashner

It was the only year I can remember that he thought to himself "what if I didn't add anything and just ran back an exhausted team by handing out extensions?"

 

easy to look back now. but as bad as that was, i'd say it's no worse than what the clowns that replaced him have done.

[mvp 78]

4 hours ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Yes, but not like Pedroia's extension was. 😜

Pedroia’s was the largest 2b contract in history when it was signed.

[mvp 78]

39 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

easy to look back now. but as bad as that was, i'd say it's no worse than what the clowns that replaced him have done.

Did Bloom keep his job and I didn’t hear about it?

[Randy Red Sox]

On 10/12/2024 at 1:23 PM, Maddie Landis said:

I don’t hate Dave Dombrowski. He got us a World Series and I, along with many other Red Sox fans, will always be grateful for that. I think the team parted ways with Dombrowski at the right time. 

Looking at the Phillies, it’s becoming more apparent that his MO doesn’t yield the greatest ROI, especially if your superstars can't win an NLDS, NLCS, or World Series. 

Would Dombrowski have traded Duran and Casas for some aging superstar past his prime? Would  Bogey be inked to an albatross contract?

After their window closed, Dombrowski didn’t have the opportunity to “fix” the Tigers or the Red Sox. It’ll be interesting to see if he can do it with the Phillies. 

name me one single 'top' prospect that DD traded that has really worked out for the team acquiring him?

[Randy Red Sox]

5 hours ago, notin said:

We nitpick moves from every CBO or GM.  So do you.  Why is Dombrowski supposed to be exempt? 

because he was far superior to the bozos who followed him although to be fair they have had their hands tied by Ebenezer Henry

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

easy to look back now. but as bad as that was, i'd say it's no worse than what the clowns that replaced him have done.

I'm not saying DD was bad- just the opposite. 

I won't say I wish he stayed, because he'd have had a rough time with JH's budget's, too. Probably couldn't have done any worse.

[notin]

1 hour ago, Randy Red Sox said:

name me one single 'top' prospect that DD traded that has really worked out for the team acquiring him?

If you want to argue DD got good or better value for the prospects he gave up, that’s one thing.  But the notion that no one he gave up has worked out is a complete fallacy.

Michael Kopech is currently closing for the Dodgers in the postseason.  Santiago Espinal was an All Star.  Mauricio Dubon and Jalen Beeks have both carved out decent careers.

Also, while not prospects, certainly Travis Shaw and Wade Miley both went on to far more successful careers than the players acquired for them (Tyler Thornburg and Carson Smith), who were both complete flops.  Yet, like the Chris Sale trade, both deals made sense at the time…

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Randy Red Sox said:

name me one single 'top' prospect that DD traded that has really worked out for the team acquiring him?

Exactly. The best ones were Dubon and Beeks- not the ones we thought, like Moncada, Kopech, Espinoza and others.

[notin]

1 hour ago, Randy Red Sox said:

because he was far superior to the bozos who followed him although to be fair they have had their hands tied by Ebenezer Henry

It’s arguable (and many believe true) that DD’s spending was the reason Henry tightened the purse strings.  Spending $240mill for a World Series championship team is one thing, but spending $240mill for an 84-78 team that misses the postseason by a dozen games won’t help you keep your job…

[moonslav59]

1 minute ago, notin said:

If you want to argue DD got good or better value for the prospects he gave up, that’s one thing.  But the notion that no one he gave up has worked out is a complete fallacy.

Michael Kopech is currently closing for the Dodgers in the postseason.  Santiago Espinal was an All Star.  Mauricio Dubon and Jalen Beeks have both carved out decent careers.

Also, while not prospects, certainly Travis Shaw and Wade Miley both went on to far more successful careers than the players acquired for them (Tyler Thornburg and Carson Smith), who were both complete flops.  Yet, like the Chris Sale trade, both deals made sense at the time…

Gotta say that list is not something to moan and groan about, right?

It turned out rather amazingly, how few did real well.

I know the argument that he barely knew the ones decided to keep, except maybe Devers & Beni, but facts are facts. He kept the best and traded almost all the higher/highest stock ones.

Also, the returns of Sale, Kimbrel, Nate and Pearce far outweighed the misses like Thornburg, C Smith and maybe PomPom.

He knew how to run a high budget team. That 2018 team was a juggernaut. 2016, 2017 and 2019 were all really good, on paper.

[notin]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Exactly. The best ones were Dubon and Beeks- not the ones we thought, like Moncada, Kopech, Espinoza and others.

Curious about why Dubon (5.7 bWAR) and Beeks (0.9 bWAR) are better than Moncada (14.3 bWAR) and Kopech (5.9 bWAR)…

[moonslav59]

I didn't realize their bWARs were so high, and maybe expectations biased my statement.

[mvp 78]

9 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Exactly. The best ones were Dubon and Beeks- not the ones we thought, like Moncada, Kopech, Espinoza and others.

Moncada 2019: 5.2 bWAR

Moncada 2021: 4.0 bWAR

Dubon career bWAR: 5.7

C'mon man!

[mvp 78]

9 hours ago, notin said:

It’s arguable (and many believe true) that DD’s spending was the reason Henry tightened the purse strings.  Spending $240mill for a World Series championship team is one thing, but spending $240mill for an 84-78 team that misses the postseason by a dozen games won’t help you keep your job…

I don't think it's the reason. I think he tightened the spending because he was able to finally surround himself with yes men. He's always wanted to be able to field a team without spending. Just go back to his appearance in Moneyball. 

[mvp 78]

9 hours ago, notin said:

Curious about why Dubon (5.7 bWAR) and Beeks (0.9 bWAR) are better than Moncada (14.3 bWAR) and Kopech (5.9 bWAR)…

I guess I piled on a little. 🫠

[Bellhorn04]

9 hours ago, notin said:

It’s arguable (and many believe true) that DD’s spending was the reason Henry tightened the purse strings.  Spending $240mill for a World Series championship team is one thing, but spending $240mill for an 84-78 team that misses the postseason by a dozen games won’t help you keep your job…

Which is a blatantly circular argument.

Henry obviously wouldn't have brought DD in unless it was to go for a title and spend.

Let's put the blame where it really belongs - on the pale, mercurial fellow, JH.

[notin]

10 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Which is a blatantly circular argument.

Henry obviously wouldn't have brought DD in unless it was to go for a title and spend.

Let's put the blame where it really belongs - on JH.

Oh my God.  You’ve become one of them.  Those Who Never Speak Ill of Dombrowski. To any degree.

It’s one thing to be an overall fan of him or the job he did.  But DD is human.  I hear he even bleeds red. He does make mistakes.  It’s ok to acknowledge them.  I’m sure DD does…

[mvp 78]

Ah, but you see, Anderson Espinoza didn't turn into an All Star so the Drew Pomeranz trade was a good bit of business! 🙃

[Bellhorn04]

3 minutes ago, notin said:

Oh my God.  You’ve become one of them.  Those Who Never Speak Ill of Dombrowski. To any degree.

It’s one thing to be an overall fan of him or the job he did.  But DD is human.  I hear he even bleeds red. He does make mistakes.  It’s ok to acknowledge them.  I’m sure DD does…

I'm just saying that blaming DD for spending is a really dumb argument.  It's what he does.  JH sort of knew that.  If you want to argue against that position, have at it.

[moonslav59]

3 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

I'm just saying that blaming DD for spending is a really dumb argument.  It's what he does.  JH sort of knew that.  If you want to argue against that position, have at it.

Ben, Bloom and Brez would have spent $50M more year, if JH allowed them to do it.

[Bellhorn04]

3 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Ben, Bloom and Brez would have spent $50M more year, if JH allowed them to do it.

The ironic thing is that Bloom, like Dombrowski, seemed to do exactly what he was hired to do but was shown the door anyway.  They each made expensive mistakes, but so does every CBO of a big market team.  The GOAT Epstein made 'em too.

[mvp 78]

5 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Ben, Bloom and Brez would have spent $50M more year, if JH allowed them to do it.

Ben Cherington did spend. He won a 2013 WS with FA acquisitions. His problem was he spent poorly: Hanley, Pablo, Rusney so he had the keys taken away.