Red Sox hitting approach - what is going on?

[moonslav59]

28 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Yes. I believe that they have tried to tweak the approach, but have given him free reign when it has not worked (i.e. '23). His k rate is starting to climb again after hovering at 10% for a few weeks. I think it will be back to 24% by year end. 

Since STL: 29 PA, 6 H, 1 BB, 8 K, 1 XBH

I'm not claiming they fixed Rafaela's approach for good. I just pointed out that it seemed like someone finally got through to him, and agreed with you that it doesn't necessarily mean for the good of is production.

His best extended MLB stretch was 90 games long (.779 from 4/27/24 to 8/13/24) where he still had 84Ks in 347 PAs.

Before 4/27/24: .560 OPS (54Ks and 8 BB in 173 PAs)

After 8/13/24: .506 OPS (40Ks and ZERO BBs in 127 PAs) 

2025: .520 OPS (12Ks & 4BB in 62 PAs)

His career stats are carried by that one 90 games stretch. The rest of the time, he has been a .500 to .560 OPS guy with varying K rates.

 

[Kimmi]

22 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Agreed. It's too early to make a trade, until we know more about some situations.

I will say one thing: any chance we have to trade Yoshida needs to be explored. I'd like to wait and see him build some value, but at whose expense? Devers needs to get hurt to give Yoshi DH time. LF seems ever more complicated. Even if we agree to move Rafaela to super utility, we still have Duran FT, Abreu-Refsnyder platoon and Anthony as better choices than an awful defensive guy like Yoshida. Campbell can play CF, too.

He's not playing 1B. I'm thinking trade him for a $3-5M savings a year, or throw in a 2025 Rule 5 prospect we might not want to protect and get more salary relief. I've scoured the roster of other teams to find a salary swap that makes sense, but I found nothing.

I am sure the FO is exploring all the possibilities for trade.  Unless there's an injury, I really don't know what they'll do with Yoshida when he gets healthy.  As they say, these things have a way of working themselves out.

 

[Kimmi]

19 hours ago, jdc69 said:

I don't see why Yoshida creates a log jam. Not if Casas keeps on playing the way he is. When Yoshida gets healthy and if Casas hasn't heated up, bring Yoshida up, put Casas back to AAA, have Devers play first (which he may appreciate) and put Yoshida back on DH. Yoshidas batting would fit our needs nicely. He's got a good average and low strike outs.

Of course I have no way of knowing, but Casas seems to have fallen out of favor with Cora.  If Casas doesn't get it together soon, I can see him being sent to AAA to get his head right.  Or the phantom injury bug might bite him.

[Kimmi]

7 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

If the Pirates didn't have Oneil Cruz, they'd be far and away the biggest embarrassment in baseball. They are making a big case. 

Yes, the Pirates are also a big mess.  I became an Oneil Cruz fan last year.  For some reason, I watched way more Pirates games than I should have, even though it was more about watching their opponents than it was about watching them.

[Old Red]

7 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

Of course I have no way of knowing, but Casas seems to have fallen out of favor with Cora.  If Casas doesn't get it together soon, I can see him being sent to AAA to get his head right.  Or the phantom injury bug might bite him.

I think Casas is still in the taking imaginary swings in his head mode from last year, and it’s hard to get it out.

[Kimmi]

7 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I think Casas is still in the taking imaginary swings in his head mode from last year, and it’s hard to get it out.

He's an odd one, for sure.  I guess we all have our little quirks though.  LOL

That said, I like Casas and I've had high hopes for him being our long-term first baseman.  I know he has it in him.

[moonslav59]

32 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

I am sure the FO is exploring all the possibilities for trade.  Unless there's an injury, I really don't know what they'll do with Yoshida when he gets healthy.  As they say, these things have a way of working themselves out.

 

The thing is, how much does Yoshida's trade value rise, if he's hitting .950 in AAA for 6-8 weeks?

Unless someone gets hurt, he won't get a real look on the big team, IMO.

Keeping him as DH insurance does have some value, but DH is the easiest position to fill or refill. Ref, Casas and Romy could be about as good a DH as Yoshi, anyway.

[moonslav59]

We all heard of the Casas for Castillo trade, and apparently wanting SEA to take Yoshida held up the deal, but I also wonder what other Casas deals were discussed.

I am far from giving up on Tristan. The guy can hit, and I think he will again.

His defense looks permanently flawed, but 1B can be easy to hide, if the rest of the D is good.

[Bellhorn04]

Lifted from SOSH:

Julian McWilliams had some interesting insights during his interview on the “Off the Pike” podcast regarding both Pete Fatse and his assistant Dillon Lawson. Regarding Fatse he had this to say:
“the core of Pete's teachings is just to have you at your base and then sort of build on that base. The infrastructure that you built and building on top of that to make you a better hitter.”
 

It seems like there could be a rift between Fatse and his assistant as McWilliams suggested that Dillon Lawson is the Driveline guy teaching everyone to pull the ball in the air whereas Fatse is more of traditional hitting coach who tries to build on each hitters’ strengths. There are some other interesting tidbits in the interview particularly that Lawson was the only coach Cashman fired mid-season in his 28-year tenure with the Yankees and hitters like DJ LeMahieu proclaimed that it was a relief.
 

All this is to say that it seems that the Fatse/Lawson divide is yet another instance of the coaching staff and front office not being on the same page.

[Bellhorn04]

If the above is true, and I have a bad feeling it is, it means Sox hitters are getting conflicting messages from their coaches.

I would think that is one of the worst things possible for young hitters especially.

[Kimmi]

On 6/7/2025 at 10:30 AM, Bellhorn04 said:

If the above is true, and I have a bad feeling it is, it means Sox hitters are getting conflicting messages from their coaches.

I would think that is one of the worst things possible for young hitters especially.

If it is true, it sounds like it's time for Lawson to go.

I am way more on board with Fatse's philosophy.

[Bellhorn04]

5 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

If it is true, it sounds like it's time for Lawson to go.

I am way more on board with Fatse's philosophy.

Of course they have swung the bats pretty well the last 4 games. 🙂

[mvp 78]

They have stressed "pull Air" but haven't really done so. They are really just piling up the k's. It's a rollercoaster ride offense. 

[Kimmi]

On 6/10/2025 at 8:05 AM, mvp 78 said:

They have stressed "pull Air" but haven't really done so. They are really just piling up the k's. It's a rollercoaster ride offense. 

Perhaps the stressing of "pull air" is why the K's are piling up so high.

[mvp 78]

17 hours ago, Kimmi said:

Perhaps the stressing of "pull air" is why the K's are piling up so high.

A little bit of this, a little bit of that (bad roster construction). 

[mvp 78]

Ranking the BoSox hitting coaches since 1980:

Walt Hriniak

Ron Jackson

Dave Magadan

Tim Hyers

Jim Rice

Chili Davis

Greg Colbrunn

Richie Hebner

Pete Fatse

Mike Easler

Dwight Evans

Rick Burleson

Rick Down

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 minute ago, mvp 78 said:

Ranking the BoSox hitting coaches since 1980:

Walt Hriniak

Ron Jackson

Dave Magadan

Tim Hyers

Jim Rice

Chili Davis

Greg Colbrunn

Richie Hebner

Pete Fatse

Mike Easler

Dwight Evans

Rick Burleson

Rick Down

You forgot the guys at the very bottom: the organizational analysts who built this system-wide swing-and-miss juggernaut -- when they weren't shushing Hall of Famers from trying to answer a current hitter's question.

[notin]

On 4/18/2025 at 4:14 PM, moonslav59 said:

The thing is, how much does Yoshida's trade value rise, if he's hitting .950 in AAA for 6-8 weeks?

Unless someone gets hurt, he won't get a real look on the big team, IMO.

Keeping him as DH insurance does have some value, but DH is the easiest position to fill or refill. Ref, Casas and Romy could be about as good a DH as Yoshi, anyway.

Yoshida could have been activated already if not for some questionable management and selfish teammates.  The guy was a DH all through ST and then got injured?  
 

Im seriously questioning Casas’ worth.  He is going to miss most of 2024 and 2025 because he injured himself 1) seining a bat and 2) running to first. Whats 2026 hold? He going to miss next year because he hurt himself fielding a ground ball? I’d trade him in a second if I thought he had any value (and I had a job that allowed me to do so).  Most likely, he’s a non-tender candidate.  

[mvp 78]

2 hours ago, notin said:

Yoshida could have been activated already if not for some questionable management and selfish teammates.  The guy was a DH all through ST and then got injured?  
 

Im seriously questioning Casas’ worth.  He is going to miss most of 2024 and 2025 because he injured himself 1) seining a bat and 2) running to first. Whats 2026 hold? He going to miss next year because he hurt himself fielding a ground ball? I’d trade him in a second if I thought he had any value (and I had a job that allowed me to do so).  Most likely, he’s a non-tender candidate.  

Agree about Masa. Disagree that they'll nontender Casas. They'll rehab him and then not figure out how to work him into a steady rotation of PA's at 1B. 

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, notin said:

Yoshida could have been activated already if not for some questionable management and selfish teammates.  The guy was a DH all through ST and then got injured?  
 

Im seriously questioning Casas’ worth.  He is going to miss most of 2024 and 2025 because he injured himself 1) seining a bat and 2) running to first. Whats 2026 hold? He going to miss next year because he hurt himself fielding a ground ball? I’d trade him in a second if I thought he had any value (and I had a job that allowed me to do so).  Most likely, he’s a non-tender candidate.  

It makes sense to make him the DH. he sucks on D and is a china doll.

I would not count on him for anything, though.

I don't think he has the trade value that matches what he could become. The guy can hit, despite what Max tells us about his 3 week sample size to start the year.