6/11 Phillies @ SOX 7:10PM ET

[FredLynn]

I'm one of the faithful who likes Dalbec, but that doesn't keep my from recognizing that he flat cannot hit MLB pitching.

 

Dalbec sucks. Like you wrote he can’t hit. Isn’t that sort of required at the mlb level unless you’re a stud in the field and you’re surrounded by excellent hitters?

[Maxbialystock]

Dalbec sucks. Like you wrote he can’t hit. Isn’t that sort of required at the mlb level unless you’re a stud in the field and you’re surrounded by excellent hitters?

 

It sure is. In fact, I've said--to moonslav's chagrin--that hitting is the primary skill for a lineup player. The two key defensive positions are usually SS and CF, but the Sox have consistently tried to put good hitters in both positions. As soon as they get a good fielding SS, they fire his ass--unless his OPS is over .800. Thus Bogey and the guy who was supposed to replace him, Story.

 

And what's kind of interesting about the 2024 Sox is that the lineup stinks in the field and at the plate.

[Duran Is The Man]

Why can't the SOX get players like KS?

 

Yoshida is costing the Sox almost as much as Schwarber is costing the Phils. LOLOLOL....nice job BLoom you stupid mother f***er.

[moonslav59]

It sure is. In fact, I've said--to moonslav's chagrin--that hitting is the primary skill for a lineup player. The two key defensive positions are usually SS and CF, but the Sox have consistently tried to put good hitters in both positions. As soon as they get a good fielding SS, they fire his ass--unless his OPS is over .800. Thus Bogey and the guy who was supposed to replace him, Story.

 

And what's kind of interesting about the 2024 Sox is that the lineup stinks in the field and at the plate.

 

Chagrin this!!

 

2024 SS OPS

 

.723 Red Sox SS

.581 Bogey

 

Maybe Bogey at $225M/5 might not have been all that great, no?

 

(LOL)

[vegasbob]

Chagrin this!!

 

2024 SS OPS

 

.723 Red Sox SS

.581 Bogey

 

Maybe Bogey at $225M/5 might not have been all that great, no?

 

(LOL)

 

Not signing Bogaerts to a 5-10 year deal was smart , not trading him for some value was stupid. Sort of like what the Angels did with Ohtani. Take the heat, what are the fans going to do about it.

[moonslav59]

Not signing Bogaerts to a 5-10 year deal was smart , not trading him for some value was stupid. Sort of like what the Angels did with Ohtani. Take the heat, what are the fans going to do about it.

 

We should have traded Boget, JD, Nate, Wacha, Duval, Hill and anything and everything not tied down.

[FredLynn]

Chagrin this!!

 

 

2024 SS OPS

 

.723 Red Sox SS

.581 Bogey

 

Maybe Bogey at $225M/5 might not have been all that great, no?

 

(LOL)

 

Bogaerts has a career ops of over .800. We let him get away. Henry was too cheap to pay Schwarber or Betts. These are examples of why we have stiffs playing for the team now.

[Maxbialystock]

Bogaerts has a career ops of over .800. We let him get away. Henry was too cheap to pay Schwarber or Betts. These are examples of why we have stiffs playing for the team now.

 

Maybe we should agree to disagree. The 2019 Sox had the highest payroll in MLB, but Betts was becoming a free agent, and Price and Sale, both being paid king ransoms, were worthless. To outspend the Dodgers to keep Mookie, to spend big to replace Price and Sale, and to spend more to cover Bogey's pay raise (which San Diego gave him), to keep Eovaldi, to Keep ERod, and to keep Devers going to cost what, $100M more than the biggest payroll in MLB?

[FredLynn]

Maybe we should agree to disagree. The 2019 Sox had the highest payroll in MLB, but Betts was becoming a free agent, and Price and Sale, both being paid king ransoms, were worthless. To outspend the Dodgers to keep Mookie, to spend big to replace Price and Sale, and to spend more to cover Bogey's pay raise (which San Diego gave him), to keep Eovaldi, to Keep ERod, and to keep Devers going to cost what, $100M more than the biggest payroll in MLB?

 

They couldn’t keep all of them. We should have kept Betts and Bogey and built around them. We use to be a higher payroll team. Now we are middle third. Henry has reduced payroll to the detriment of the product on the field-as well as hiring Bloom who did little to improve the franchise.

[Dipre]

This team is actively harming my mental health.

[Bellhorn04]

This team is actively harming my mental health.

 

You must be one of those poor unfortunate folks with unrealistic expectations.

 

Just read what Henry said, it will get your mind right.

[Dipre]

You must be one of those poor unfortunate folks with unrealistic expectations.

 

Just read what Henry said, it will get your mind right.

 

Oh no, I know they suck right now. It just pisses me off even more when they waste good pitching performances.

[vegasbob]

So Dom Smith admits he shortarmed the not great throw from Valdez to avoid getting his arm injured by the runner. Must have been out of concern for the team as a whole. Nice guts, Dom, you suck and will be the next DFA after Casas returns, unless Dalbec beats you to it. But there are many who thought they would outlive Big Cat Bobby and are currently unemployed.

[Bellhorn04]

The good news is we would have lost even if Dom made the play.

[moonslav59]

Bogaerts has a career ops of over .800. We let him get away. Henry was too cheap to pay Schwarber or Betts. These are examples of why we have stiffs playing for the team now.

 

Bets, yes. Bogey, I'm not so sure.

 

2017-2022

.855 OPS (126 OPS+)

Per 162 gms:

.295 24 95

 

2023-2024:

.741 OPS (107 OPS+)

.270 18 58

 

Is this worth $225M/5, let alone what he ended up getting?

.811 OPS (124 OPS+)

.296 17 66

 

[mvp 78]

Bogey was an overpay. Schwarber was an overpay (minor).

[notin]

Bogaerts has a career ops of over .800. We let him get away. Henry was too cheap to pay Schwarber or Betts. These are examples of why we have stiffs playing for the team now.

 

Too cheap to pay Betts - yes.

 

But Schwarber? Was he supposed to tip that ludicrous offer the Phillies made to get a backup DH with no defensive skills whatsoever? Sure they could have buried him at 1b and hoped it worked out. But given that Schwarber was a low 2 bWAR player who had been non-tendered the previous offseason, I can understand not topping a 4-year $80mill contract…

[Maxbialystock]

Too cheap to pay Betts - yes.

 

But Schwarber? Was he supposed to tip that ludicrous offer the Phillies made to get a backup DH with no defensive skills whatsoever? Sure they could have buried him at 1b and hoped it worked out. But given that Schwarber was a low 2 bWAR player who had been non-tendered the previous offseason, I can understand not topping a 4-year $80mill contract…

 

One more time, and I know by now I sound like a broken record.

 

If Mookie was the only guy the Sox needed to be successful, I would agree. But in fact the 2019 Sox, who had all the same talented pitchers and lineup they had in the incredible 2018 season, collapsed because of the pitching and didn't even make it to the postseason.

 

The 2019 Sox payroll was the highest in MLB. So just to keep their talent at the same level, they would have had to get in a bidding war with the Dodgers for Mookie, continue to pay outlandish salaries to two starters, Price and Sale, who couldn't actually freaking start, and to pay additional outlandish salaries to new starters to replace Price and Sale. Plus down the road they would have to at least explore the possibility of paying Devers enough to retain him.

 

If my take on 2019--and retaining Mookie--is correct, there was no limit to the amount of money DD would have needed to keep the Sox competitive.

 

That said, I agree DD is an excellent CBO, which he has demonstrated with several teams, including the current Phillies.

[Maxbialystock]

Too cheap to pay Betts - yes.

 

But Schwarber? Was he supposed to tip that ludicrous offer the Phillies made to get a backup DH with no defensive skills whatsoever? Sure they could have buried him at 1b and hoped it worked out. But given that Schwarber was a low 2 bWAR player who had been non-tendered the previous offseason, I can understand not topping a 4-year $80mill contract…

 

Ahem. I think you have to be wrong about Schwarber, and I say that because to me the choice turned out to be Schwarber or Yoshida. Schwarber has made a difference for the Phillies, as he would have done with the Sox--even with all the K's and the weak defensive skills.

 

Right now the Phillies are 4th in MLB in runs scored with 336, just 10 runs behind the leaders, the Dodgers, with 346. And Schwarber is 3d on the Phillies in total bases, 2d in dingers, and 3d in rbi's. He has the same dingers, 13, as Devers, more rbi's, 38 vs 32, and fewer total bases, 101 vs. 112.

Edited June 12, 2024 by Maxbialystock

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

So Dom Smith admits he shortarmed the not great throw from Valdez to avoid getting his arm injured by the runner. Must have been out of concern for the team as a whole. Nice guts, Dom, you suck and will be the next DFA after Casas returns, unless Dalbec beats you to it. But there are many who thought they would outlive Big Cat Bobby and are currently unemployed.

 

Bobby has 9 lives and a thousand options.

[moonslav59]

Ahem. I think you have to be wrong about Schwarber, and I say that because to me the choice turned out to be Schwarber or Yoshida. Schwarber has made a difference for the Phillies, as he would have done with the Sox--even with all the K's and the weak defensive skills.

 

Right now the Phillies are 4th in MLB in runs scored with 336, just 10 runs behind the leaders, the Dodgers, with 346. And Schwarber is 3d on the Phillies in total bases, 2d in dingers, and 3d in rbi's. He has the same dingers, 13, as Devers, more rbi's, 38 vs 32, and fewer total bases, 101 vs. 112.

 

Schwarber signed in '22, when we still had JD. Yoshida signed in '23, before we knew Duran was Duran.

 

Now, had we traded JD, and maybe ate some of his salary, signing Schwarber would look better.

 

I wish we had him, now, over Yoshida, but I don't think the comp matches up so smoothly.

[FredLynn]

Too cheap to pay Betts - yes.

 

But Schwarber? Was he supposed to tip that ludicrous offer the Phillies made to get a backup DH with no defensive skills whatsoever? Sure they could have buried him at 1b and hoped it worked out. But given that Schwarber was a low 2 bWAR player who had been non-tendered the previous offseason, I can understand not topping a 4-year $80mill contract…

 

Like I said there’s no way to keep all of the good players who departed. And I would have liked to see them build the team around Betts and Bogaert. They were expensive for sure but I think you need a couple of excellent players to complement a bunch of good players to compete.

Who exactly has Henry opened up his wallet for over the past 3-4 years? I can’t remember a single high priced talent he has paid. He has been very successful in reducing payroll but putting out a competitive team, not so much.

[moonslav59]

Like I said there’s no way to keep all of the good players who departed. And I would have liked to see them build the team around Betts and Bogaert. They were expensive for sure but I think you need a couple of excellent players to complement a bunch of good players to compete.

Who exactly has Henry opened up his wallet for over the past 3-4 years? I can’t remember a single high priced talent he has paid. He has been very successful in reducing payroll but putting out a competitive team, not so much.

 

The highest contracts given out by JH since 2019's Sale. Bogey & Nate extensions:

 

$313M/10 Devers (extension)

$140M/6 Story

$90M/5 Yoshida (plus $10M fee)

$39M/2 Giolito

$36M/2 Jansen

[FredLynn]

The highest contracts given out by JH since 2019's Sale. Bogey & Nate extensions:

 

$313M/10 Devers (extension)

$140M/6 Story

$90M/5 Yoshida (plus $10M fee)

$39M/2 Giolito

$36M/2 Jansen

 

The only smart signing in that group is Devers. Bogaerts>Story. Yoshida was a horrible signing.

Gotta spend the money but you also have to evaluate talent. They have failed on both counts lately.

[moonslav59]

The only smart signing in that group is Devers. Bogaerts>Story. Yoshida was a horrible signing.

Gotta spend the money but you also have to evaluate talent. They have failed on both counts lately.

 

Yup.

 

The signings are as bad as the budget cuts