Trades?

[Old Red]

And I bet even Devers has softened on it, since Vazquez went on to do pretty well contract-wise, and Abreu and Valdez have shown they have some skills (or skill, in the case of Valdez)…

 

It doesn’t matter now on how it affected the ball club at that time,but it did at the time in the clubhouse

This is an example of a trade grade that went up over time.

[notin]

It doesn’t matter now on how it affected the ball club at that time,but it did at the time in the clubhouse

This is an example of a trade grade that went up over time.

 

Stories of disgruntlement from remaining players on selling teams are ubiquitous throughout MLB history.

 

Do you know how pissed the remaining Red Sox were all through the 1920s as they literally watched teammate after teammate reconvene in New York and proceed to dominate the sport?

[notin]

It doesn’t matter now on how it affected the ball club at that time,but it did at the time in the clubhouse

This is an example of a trade grade that went up over time.

 

Exactly, which to me defeats the purpose of the initial grade…

[Old Red]

So they declared Houston the winner of the trade?

 

Fansided graded the Astros with a B+, and the Red Sox a C+ at the time. Graded now that could be flipped around.

[notin]

Fansided graded the Astros with a B+, and the Red Sox a C+ at the time. Graded now that could be flipped around.

 

Isn’t Fansided just a fan blogging site? Not that the Yahoo grades have proven any better…

[Old Red]

Exactly, which to me defeats the purpose of the initial grade…

 

Pretty much every move in sports gets graded at the time it happens, and I don’t see that happening anytime soon. Even in fantasy.

[Old Red]

Isn’t Fansided just a fan blogging site? Not that the Yahoo grades have proven any better…

 

I don’t know anything about it. I just looked up a trade grade, and that was the first that popped up.

[Maxbialystock]

This year Bloom has a couple small wins on trades that were panned previously. That grades change over time defeats the purpose of grading them, especially when it’s known that they will change…

 

Meh. We always have moonslav reminding us of the potential long term value of guys like Grissom. To me there is no way, no how Grissom can make up for the loss of Sale at exactly the wrong time--a major misread by Breslow. Moreover, because Sale was booted to Atlanta, Breslow went out at got Giolito for $38M, half of which is already down the drain.

 

As for Vazquez, I liked him when they brought him up because of that great arm and release for nailing guys trying to steal 2b. Over time, I decided he was just stupid, but he hung on because for a while it looked like he could hit. I loved when Vazquez was traded away and am fine with Wong and McGuire--plus Teel at Portland.

[moonslav59]

My recollection is that most of the fuss about trading Vazquez was the way he found about it. I don't think anyone was freaking because we lost Vazquez for the last couple of months.

 

As of now? Yeah, a small win for Bloom with Abreu.

 

Many viewed it as a sign of giving up and sending the wrong message to the team, going forward.

[mvp 78]

Fansided graded the Astros with a B+, and the Red Sox a C+ at the time. Graded now that could be flipped around.

 

Could be?

[moonslav59]

Meh. We always have moonslav reminding us of the potential long term value of guys like Grissom. To me there is no way, no how Grissom can make up for the loss of Sale at exactly the wrong time--a major misread by Breslow. Moreover, because Sale was booted to Atlanta, Breslow went out at got Giolito for $38M, half of which is already down the drain.

 

As for Vazquez, I liked him when they brought him up because of that great arm and release for nailing guys trying to steal 2b. Over time, I decided he was just stupid, but he hung on because for a while it looked like he could hit. I loved when Vazquez was traded away and am fine with Wong and McGuire--plus Teel at Portland.

 

At the time, I looked at the Vaz for Abreu and Valdez, plus the Diekman dump for McGuire, together, as a big plus and still do.

 

McGuire was supposed to be very good on D and with the staff. He did very well at the end of 2022, but has not lived up to my hopes.

[moonslav59]

The Workman & Hembree for Pivetta deal worked out well, but nobody minded us being sellers in 2020.

The Beni nondeadline trade for Franchy and Gambrell did not look all that great, but then Wink did pretty well, and Beni has largely sucked and been overpaid.

The other nondeadline trade of Renfroe for JBJ, looks a little better now that DHam is doing pretty well.

The Betts nondeadline trade has always sucked, and when Jeter Downs s*** the bed, it looked even worse. Now that Wong is doing well, it still sucks, but at least we got something out of that trade (Verdugo, too, and now what we got for Dugo: Fitts & Weissert.)

 

Grading trades early is natural, but no grade is complete until all teh terms of control are finished.

[mvp 78]

The two seasons after Beni was traded:

 

2.6 bWAR

2.5 bWAR

 

The JBJ trade still stinks as it put them over the CBT and pushed the QO comp picks down.

[moonslav59]

The two seasons after Beni was traded:

 

2.6 bWAR

2.5 bWAR

 

The JBJ trade still stinks as it put them over the CBT and pushed the QO comp picks down.

 

Agreed on JBJ-Renfroe. I just said the trade looks a little better.

 

I still like Wink over Beni.

Beni fWAR

1.4

2.2

 

Okay, Wink only has 1.3 fWAR, so far. (1.9 bWAR, but I think he will match Beni or pass him.)

Edited July 23, 2024 by moonslav59

[notin]

The two seasons after Beni was traded:

 

2.6 bWAR

2.5 bWAR

 

The JBJ trade still stinks as it put them over the CBT and pushed the QO comp picks down.

 

 

They also had plenty of time to rectify that, but chose not to for some reason...

[mvp 78]

Agreed on JBJ-Renfroe. I just said the trade looks a little better.

 

I still like Wink over Beni.

 

1.9 bWAR in 3 seasons vs 5 bWAR in the two I listed?

[mvp 78]

They also had plenty of time to rectify that, but chose not to for some reason...

 

Still counts!

[dgalehouse]

JBJ just signed with the Mets.

[notin]

Still counts!

 

Might as well say the Price signing. In 2015 put us over the 2022 tax limit…

[Larry Cook]

I think we need to trade o’neil for a major league reliever. Our bullpen is on fumes

[moonslav59]

I think we need to trade o’neil for a major league reliever. Our bullpen is on fumes

 

We'd need 2 RHBs, then, so why not trade Abreu for a real good one with 2+ years of control?

[Old Red]

We'd need 2 RHBs, then, so why not trade Abreu for a real good one with 2+ years of control?

 

I don’t think Abreu is going to bring you a real good anything unless he’s part of a package.

[Larry Cook]

We'd need 2 RHBs, then, so why not trade Abreu for a real good one with 2+ years of control?

 

Because abreau has multiple years of control and could be the best outfielder we have. O’Neil walks in 3 months

[notin]

I don’t think Abreu is going to bring you a real good anything unless he’s part of a package.

 

He’s not going to bring back a Cy Young caliber pitcher, but Abreu absolutely has value…

[Old Red]

He’s not going to bring back a Cy Young caliber pitcher, but Abreu absolutely has value…

 

I didn’t say he didn’t have value, but just not the kind that Moon thinks he has .

[Old Red]

Because abreau has multiple years of control and could be the best outfielder we have. O’Neil walks in 3 months

 

I don’t believe Abreu could be the best OF the Red Sox could have, and they need more RHB.

[moonslav59]

Because abreau has multiple years of control and could be the best outfielder we have. O’Neil walks in 3 months

 

Ummm, Duran is better.

Rafaela is better on D and bats RH'd

Refsnyder bats RH'd and is one of our best hitters.

We have Anthony LHB and Campbell RHB for the future (to replace O'Neill).

 

L-R Splits

v RHP

.919 Duran

.815 Abreu

.790 Ref

.766 O'Neill

.683 Rafaela

v LHPs

1.076 O'Neill

.898 Ref

.732 Rafaela

.694 Duran

.449 Abreu

 

Abreu is a strongside platoon with the 4th best OF OPS on the team:

.870 O'Neill

.847 Duran

.839 Refsnyder

.798 Abreu

.696 Rafaela (Best OF defender and RHB)

 

 

[moonslav59]

He’s not going to bring back a Cy Young caliber pitcher, but Abreu absolutely has value…

 

He has the value, with 5 years of control to get a 4/5 SP'er with 1.3+ years of control or a decent RP with 2.3+ years of control, IMO.

 

No, he will not bring back anything super.

 

We could also add a #10-30 prospect or two to improve on the return.

[notin]

I didn’t say he didn’t have value, but just not the kind that Moon thinks he has .

 

Not so sure. I think he could bring back Erik Fedde. BTV thinks so, too. Of course the only opinion that matters is Chris Getz, who gives us no real track record or anything and won’t return my calls…

[moonslav59]

Not so sure. I think he could bring back Erik Fedde. BTV thinks so, too. Of course the only opinion that matters is Chris Getz, who gives us no real track record or anything and won’t return my calls…

 

Fedde is even better than I expected, but I'd do it, since Fedde has another year of control. 5 years for 1.3 seems like a big hit on the future, but we need pitching and have OF depth.

 

We have to give to get, so I'd give Abreu plus Paulino or Castro for Fedde.