Craig Breslow hired as Head Of Baseball Operations

[Randy Red Sox]

Fans who pay more have a right to expect more. Yes. It's not lunacy when the industry is drowning in cash.

 

I don't believe the Red Sox are entitled to a title or anything. But consumers of the Red Sox are charged higher prices than any other consumer base by any other team, and so fans rightly have higher expectations of the product. The team does not have to spend more than anybody else, but it is not wrong for consumers to expect that Boston act like a big market team, to be in on big free agents, to retain good players in their primes, all of that.

 

Fans should expect that the Red Sox would take a deadweight contract as a fair price to get a premium asset - heck, sometimes that deadweight contract becomes a World Series MVP - and to push their weight around smartly. Fans should rightly get upset when Sox management scolds them for wanting nice things.

 

I remember the SEVERAL times when John Henry stated that his goal was for the Red Sox to be WS contenders every year. What a lie that was.

[sk7326]

I remember the SEVERAL times when John Henry stated that his goal was for the Red Sox to be WS contenders every year. What a lie that was.

 

I actually do think he believes that - he just hates participating in a seller's market.

[mvp 78]

I actually do think he believes that - he just hates participating in a seller's market.

 

Dude is the definition of a miser.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I remember the SEVERAL times when John Henry stated that his goal was for the Red Sox to be WS contenders every year. What a lie that was.

 

But did he specifically specify baseball?

 

Quick Google search for World Series brought up poker, comedy, pop culture, rock, and team roping...

[Dipre]

Dude is the definition of a miser.

 

Are we talking about the owner for the A's? Let's not get carried away here.

[moonslav59]

FSG is making money hand over fist off the Sox. Not putting money back into the franchise is an embarrassment.

 

How many other teams and owners could we say this about, to varying degrees?

[Dipre]

How many other teams and owners could we say this about, to varying degrees?

 

Including the sons of The Boss?

[moonslav59]

Including the sons of The Boss?

 

Even the poorest ownership group in MLB can afford to blast past the tax line, here and there, if not every year.

[Bellhorn04]

Even the poorest ownership group in MLB can afford to blast past the tax line, here and there, if not every year.

 

Really? What are the gross annual revenues of the A's, Rays, Pirates etc.?

[moonslav59]

Really? What are the gross annual revenues of the A's, Rays, Pirates etc.?

 

I did not say go over and make a profit, but with all the side money made and an increase in team interest, they probably could all make something plus.

 

They can afford it because they are all rich enough to spare a few hundred million.

[Dipre]

Really? What are the gross annual revenues of the A's, Rays, Pirates etc.?

 

They're all making money hand over fist because of revenue sharing and don't invest anything into the product.

[harmony]

Seattle fans are leveling similar criticisms at Mariner owners.

 

For years the message was that the Mariners would spend for the finishing pieces after developing the cost-efficient young core of Julio Rodriguez, George Kirby, Cal Raleigh, Logan Gilbert, J.P. Crawford, Ty France, Bryce Miller, Bryan Woo, Matt Brash and Andres Munoz.

 

Instead, coming off Mariner seasons of 90, 90 and 88 wins, the owners reportedly are looking to limit payroll.

 

The Red Sox are not the only team with a frustrated fanbase.

[mvp 78]

Are we talking about the owner for the A's? Let's not get carried away here.

 

A person who spends as little as possible. If Henry spent any less, the house of cards would collapse. The 78 win Red Sox already have a fanbase that's either tuning out or in revolt.

[mvp 78]

How many other teams and owners could we say this about, to varying degrees?

 

To varying degrees is overselling it. The Sox aren't paying any debt on the Fenway. The tickets prices are at the tippy top. Other owners envy the money that Henry is getting off the Sox.

[mvp 78]

Seattle fans are leveling similar criticisms at Mariner owners.

 

For years the message was that the Mariners would spend for the finishing pieces after developing the cost-efficient young core of Julio Rodriguez, George Kirby, Cal Raleigh, Logan Gilbert, J.P. Crawford, Ty France, Bryce Miller, Bryan Woo, Matt Brash and Andres Munoz.

 

Instead, coming off Mariner seasons of 90, 90 and 88 wins, the owners reportedly are looking to limit payroll.

 

The Red Sox are not the only team with a frustrated fanbase.

 

You've had your moment in the spotlight. Time to let us downtrodden Red Sox fans have a good season again.

[moonslav59]

To varying degrees is overselling it. The Sox aren't paying any debt on the Fenway. The tickets prices are at the tippy top. Other owners envy the money that Henry is getting off the Sox.

 

I've agreed to this. My point is every owner could spend to and over the tax line, every year, if they wanted to.

 

It sounds like you think my "varying degrees" is an undersell.

 

Of course, some teams make way more money than others and could spend way more, but even the poorest ownership group can afford to spend $100-200M more, every year. That's all I'm saying.

 

If they all did, maybe JH would spend $200-300M more, (or $100-200M more than he does now, as he surely can, if he wants to.)

[Bellhorn04]

I've agreed to this. My point is every owner could spend to and over the tax line, every year, if they wanted to.

 

It sounds like you think my "varying degrees" is an undersell.

 

Of course, some teams make way more money than others and could spend way more, but even the poorest ownership group can afford to spend $100-200M more, every year. That's all I'm saying.

 

It seems like an assumption more than anything based on actual numbers.

[moonslav59]

It seems like an assumption more than anything based on actual numbers.

 

These owners are all mega rich, and they have seen the value of their initial investment in the team they won grow by leaps and bounds.

 

I could be wrong about 1 or 2 owners or ownership groups, but I feel confident my statement is accurate.

 

I googled this from 2021, and two owners (COL/MIL) is at $700M net worth, and a few others are near $1.1B, so I can see why maybe they would not want to spend a big chunk of their own money, but they could, at least for a couple years.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/12/mlb-owners-net-worth.html

 

Would you be okay with saying 25+ teams can?

 

Also, with all the side money teams make on concessions, memorabilia and TV contracts and revenue sharing for some), do you really think any owner is losing money? They may not be making $100-200M a year, but they make some and could add their own money, if they wanted to.

 

Sox fans seem to expect JH to do it, despite his being involved with other ventures that may need capital, at the moment.

 

[Bellhorn04]

These owners are all mega rich, and they have seen the value of their initial investment in the team they won grow by leaps and bounds.

 

I could be wrong about 1 or 2 owners or ownership groups, but I feel confident my statement is accurate.

 

I googled this from 2021, and two owners (COL/MIL) is at $700M net worth, and a few others are near $1.1B, so I can see why maybe they would not want to spend a big chunk of their own money, but they could, at least for a couple years.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/12/mlb-owners-net-worth.html

 

Would you be okay with saying 25+ teams can?

 

Also, with all the side money teams make on concessions, memorabilia and TV contracts and revenue sharing for some), do you really think any owner is losing money? They may not be making $100-200M a year, but they make some and could add their own money, if they wanted to.

 

Sox fans seem to expect JH to do it, despite his being involved with other ventures that may need capital, at the moment.

 

 

We can't expect any owners to dig into their own pockets to cover their team's losses. Although Steve Cohen is apparently doing it.

 

I think it's reasonable to expect the third most valuable team, the Red Sox, to have the third highest payroll. They did follow that credo for many years. 2019 seems like the turning point.

[Dipre]

We can't expect any owners to dig into their own pockets to cover their team's losses. Although Steve Cohen is apparently doing it.

 

I think it's reasonable to expect the third most valuable team, the Red Sox, to have the third highest payroll. They did follow that credo for many years. 2019 seems like the turning point.

 

No he isn't. They take out loans and the team ends up having to cover it anyway.

[Bellhorn04]

No he isn't. They take out loans and the team ends up having to cover it anyway.

 

And he owns the team. So who repays the loans?

[moonslav59]

We can't expect any owners to dig into their own pockets to cover their team's losses. Although Steve Cohen is apparently doing it.

 

I think it's reasonable to expect the third most valuable team, the Red Sox, to have the third highest payroll. They did follow that credo for many years. 2019 seems like the turning point.

 

Again, my point is not about expecting or not expecting JH to spend more, because we make more and the team is valued more than many teams. My point is, every MLB team has fans that expect, could expect or should expect more spending fromt ehir owners.

 

And, I see a distinction between expecting it and feeling entitled to it, or start demanding a new owner, despite being one of MLB's biggest spenders in the last 21 years. Despite just extending Devers.

[moonslav59]

And he owns the team. So who repays the loans?

 

Future team revenue, or possibly the next owner.

[Bellhorn04]

Again, my point is not about expecting or not expecting JH to spend more, because we make more and the team is valued more than many teams. My point is, every MLB team has fans that expect, could expect or should expect more spending fromt ehir owners.

 

And, I see a distinction between expecting it and feeling entitled to it, or start demanding a new owner, despite being one of MLB's biggest spenders in the last 21 years. Despite just extending Devers.

 

It's the fans who pay the bills and make John Henry's franchise worth $4.5 billion. I think they do have the right to complain when they're seeing inferior teams put on the field, while ticket prices go up and Henry keeps getting richer. Henry deserves the plaudits for the 4 rings, but the fans owe him nothing at this point.

[Bellhorn04]

Future team revenue, or possibly the next owner.

 

If Cohen sells the team with a pile of debt on the books it has to reduce the price. At least that's how it works with normal businesses.

 

I don't see how the Mets can rack up heavy losses without it affecting Cohen.

[moonslav59]

It's the fans who pay the bills and make John Henry's franchise worth $4.5 billion. I think they do have the right to complain when they're seeing inferior teams put on the field, while ticket prices go up and Henry keeps getting richer. Henry deserves the plaudits for the 4 rings, but the fans owe him nothing at this point.

 

I get that. Nobody is entitled to any rich guy's money. You can expect a better product than what you are paying for. No doubt. No disagreement from me.

 

We aren't entitled to it, and more than 25 other teams, and if 25 teams' owners all did what their fans expected and spent $100M more, we'd gain on nobody,

[moonslav59]

If Cohen sells the team with a pile of debt on the books it has to reduce the price. At least that's how it works with normal businesses.

 

Reduce the profit, you mean.

[Bellhorn04]

I get that. Nobody is entitled to any rich guy's money. You can expect a better product than what you are paying for. No doubt. No disagreement from me.

 

We aren't entitled to it, and more than 25 other teams, and if 25 teams' owners all did what their fans expected and spent $100M more, we'd gain on nobody,

 

The teams are not equal in value. It's not a level playing field. That's just reality.

[Bellhorn04]

Reduce the profit, you mean.

 

Yes. Less money in the pocket.

[Old Red]

It's the fans who pay the bills and make John Henry's franchise worth $4.5 billion. I think they do have the right to complain when they're seeing inferior teams put on the field, while ticket prices go up and Henry keeps getting richer. Henry deserves the plaudits for the 4 rings, but the fans owe him nothing at this point.

The Red Sox fans have every right to complain about the product on the field especially the ones who pay the high ticket prices go to Fenway, and pay all the other high prices that goes along with being there. It’s amazing that some on here don’t understand that, and calls them crybabies among other things like it’s the fans that are in the wrong. Like you said the fans owe JH nothing. For a guy that has done so much for the Red Sox he’s a very unpopular owner, who the fans let him know anytime he shows his face in public.