A Realistic View at 2024: Part I

[Bellhorn04]

There were moves made, you know. The only two players on the 2019 team and 2023 team were Chris Sale and Ryan Brasier.

 

How would you characterize the state of the Sox after 2019?

 

That's a fair observation, aside from the Devers omission, but it also shows Bloom did in fact have room to maneuver through the supposed scorched earth left by DD...and look at some of the DD prospects that hit in 2023.

[moonslav59]

The DD ship has left Boston Harbor forever.

 

No doubt.

[moonslav59]

That's a fair observation, aside from the Devers omission, but it also shows Bloom did in fact have room to maneuver through the supposed scorched earth left by DD...and look at some of the DD prospects that hit in 2023.

 

Hitting in 2023 was a little too late to save Bloom's ass.

 

I know I sound like a broken record, and Bloom did blunder enough to deserve to be fired, but massive budget cuts and only Houck from the farm the 5 years that started 2 years before Bloom's arrival has to be part of the DD conversation.

 

Again, I have no issues with what DD did. 2016 to 2018 would have been worth it all, even if he had traded Houck, Casas and Bello on top of the ones he did trade.

[mvp 78]

Hitting in 2023 was a little too late to save Bloom's ass.

 

I know I sound like a broken record, and Bloom did blunder enough to deserve to be fired, but massive budget cuts and only Houck from the farm the 5 years that started 2 years before Bloom's arrival has to be part of the DD conversation.

 

Again, I have no issues with what DD did. 2016 to 2018 would have been worth it all, even if he had traded Houck, Casas and Bello on top of the ones he did trade.

 

Massive budget cuts are a myth. He was just asked to get under the CBT like most other GM's have to do. It shouldn't have been that tall of a task.

[Bellhorn04]

Hitting in 2023 was a little too late to save Bloom's ass.

 

I know I sound like a broken record, and Bloom did blunder enough to deserve to be fired, but massive budget cuts and only Houck from the farm the 5 years that started 2 years before Bloom's arrival has to be part of the DD conversation.

 

I think it's a JH conversation, personally.

[Old Red]

Massive budget cuts are a myth. He was just asked to get under the CBT like most other GM's have to do. It shouldn't have been that tall of a task.

 

The MASSIVE budget cuts were a MASSIVE exaggeration to fit a continuing narrative for a reason Bloom couldn’t succeed. Obviously it was a tall task for Bloom who did go over the CBT in 2022 with all his wheeling, and dealing.

[notin]

Massive budget cuts are a myth. He was just asked to get under the CBT like most other GM's have to do. It shouldn't have been that tall of a task.

 

 

How far over it were they?

[Hugh2]

2016 to 2018 would have been worth it all

 

Well this says it all right there.

 

When people critique DD, I wonder if they are willing to recognize that fact.

[notin]

That's a fair observation, aside from the Devers omission, but it also shows Bloom did in fact have room to maneuver through the supposed scorched earth left by DD...and look at some of the DD prospects that hit in 2023.

 

Yes he maneuvered. But not in the way we as Sox fans were used to. He couldn’t keep Betts and get under the tax line (and Betts’ willingness to sign seems up in the air). And his biggest expenditure was Trevor Story, whose contract seemed large until one year later when you realize it fell far short of Brandon Nimmo…

[Bellhorn04]

Yes he maneuvered. But not in the way we as Sox fans were used to. He couldn’t keep Betts and get under the tax line (and Betts’ willingness to sign seems up in the air). And his biggest expenditure was Trevor Story, whose contract seemed large until one year later when you realize it fell far short of Brandon Nimmo…

 

The amount of Story's contract is fine, but everything else about the signing is questionable.

[notin]

The amount of Story's contract is fine, but everything else about the signing is questionable.

 

Right not Story’s contract looks like a steal, assuming he can stay on the field. Given the mediocre free agent market, he’s actually tradable. (San Fran?)

[moonslav59]

Massive budget cuts are a myth. He was just asked to get under the CBT like most other GM's have to do. It shouldn't have been that tall of a task.

 

2019 to 202 was not "massive?" No Betts, half Price, Porcello and others.

 

Then, the trickle of funds slowly increased.

[moonslav59]

I think it's a JH conversation, personally.

 

Maybe, mostly, but if we praise DD for the results, he deserves to be discussed on the aftermath.

[moonslav59]

Well this says it all right there.

 

When people critique DD, I wonder if they are willing to recognize that fact.

 

I always do.

 

It was worth every penny and sacrifice.

[mvp 78]

How far over it were they?

 

$12 over. He needed to reduce the budget by 6% from 2019 to 2020. If he could have traded Price and paid 50% of his contract for a nothing prospect, he could have been under in 2020.

[mvp 78]

The amount of Story's contract is fine, but everything else about the signing is questionable.

 

Don't sign guys with pre-existing injuries!

[moonslav59]

Don't sign guys with pre-existing injuries!

 

Pretty small list, isn't it?

[moonslav59]

How far over it were they?

 

Was the 2020 mandate to just "get under?"

 

Was Bloom just showing off by going way under?

[mvp 78]

Was the 2020 mandate to just "get under?"

 

Was Bloom just showing off by going way under?

 

They were 10M under on Opening Day per Cots. It gave them enough room for a few deadline deals.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Don't sign guys with pre-existing injuries!

 

Unless you specifically hire a CBO whose specialty is signing and trading for those guys;

 

... but why pay a premium, when you can sift through tag sales and flea markets for forgotten treasures?

 

The unfortunate part is when the Chief finds a rarity, but refuses to take it to the Pawn Shop or Antiques Roadshow before they're off the air.

 

At least you still get to keep what you pay for.

[moonslav59]

They were 10M under on Opening Day per Cots. It gave them enough room for a few deadline deals.

 

That's not an answer, and they did make some deadline deals in 2020: all selling.

[mvp 78]

That's not an answer, and they did make some deadline deals in 2020: all selling.

 

They must have done it because of a mandate from ownership not to spend!!!

[mvp 78]

Unless you specifically hire a CBO whose specialty is signing and trading for those guys;

 

... but why pay a premium, when you can sift through tag sales and flea markets for forgotten treasures?

 

The unfortunate part is when the Chief finds a rarity, but refuses to take it to the Pawn Shop or Antiques Roadshow before they're off the air.

 

At least you still get to keep what you pay for.

 

How about a Greinke, Longoria, Ryu, Brantley and Carrasco offseason to scratch the Antiques Roadshow itch?

[moonslav59]

They must have done it because of a mandate from ownership not to spend!!!

 

I do think the "mandate" was to cut significantly below the tax line in 2020.

 

Despite the sunken cost of Sale, Pedey and half-Price in 2021, we still stayed under by about $4-5M. That was an increase from 2020, but still not really near 2018 or 2019 levels.

 

It wasn't until the Story signing we got back near the 2018 level, and by then several teams had passed us and stayed ahead.

[Bellhorn04]

Right not Story’s contract looks like a steal, assuming he can stay on the field. Given the mediocre free agent market, he’s actually tradable. (San Fran?)

 

I have my doubts that Story's .566 OPS and 55/9 K/BB is screaming "steal" to most teams...

[mvp 78]

I do think the "mandate" was to cut significantly below the tax line in 2020.

 

Despite the sunken cost of Sale, Pedey and half-Price in 2021, we still stayed under by about $4-5M. That was an increase from 2020, but still not really near 2018 or 2019 levels.

 

It wasn't until the Story signing we got back near the 2018 level, and by then several teams had passed us and stayed ahead.

 

"Oh hey, you can't be #1 in payroll going forward, but you can spend up to the CBT so work with 5% less."

 

"Guess we'll have to be a 78 win team now... "

[moonslav59]

I have my doubts that Story's .566 OPS and 55/9 K/BB is screaming "steal" to most teams...

 

I doubt many teams are asking about Story, but GMs don't make decisions based on small sample sizes, especially from players who were playing injured or returning from long times off due to an injury.

 

Many GMs would like Story on their team- just not the contract.

[moonslav59]

"Oh hey, you can't be #1 in payroll going forward, but you can spend up to the CBT so work with 5% less."

 

"Guess we'll have to be a 78 win team now... "

 

Are you talking about now or 2020? I thought this was about no massive cuts from 2019 to 2020.

[Bellhorn04]

I doubt many teams are asking about Story, but GMs don't make decisions based on small sample sizes, especially from players who were playing injured or returning from long times off due to an injury.

 

Many GMs would like Story on their team- just not the contract.

 

Let's not forget his 2022 numbers with the bat were nothing special either.

[mvp 78]

Are you talking about now or 2020? I thought this was about no massive cuts from 2019 to 2020.

 

2020, 2021, 2022, 2023...