Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[notin]

Has Duvall even been linked to the Sox? I heard Turner hasn't been contacted by the Sox this offseason.

 

Has Duvall been linked to anyone?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Has Duvall been linked to anyone?

 

Not the CODA (good for him).

[Bellhorn04]

If they sign Imanaga and Duvall in the next couple days maybe they can still have the Town Hall.

[mvp 78]

If they sign Imanaga and Duvall in the next couple days maybe they can still have the Town Hall.

 

Crag is probably unable to interact with the general public due to his 200 IQ; Henry due to his agoraphobia.

[notin]

Crag is probably unable to interact with the general public due to his 200 IQ; Henry due to his agoraphobia.

 

And Kennedy due to his Multiple Personality Disorder, where he has one for each face…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

And Kennedy due to his Multiple Personality Disorder, where he has one for each face…

 

... which all have Pinocchio nose

[notin]

... which all have Pinocchio nose

 

Emblazoned with a Louisville Slugger logo, as Kennedy is ever the opportunist…

[dgalehouse]

MLB trade rumors should change their name to: " Signings and trades that have already been reported on "X". The rumors seldom actually come to pass. But they are quick to report what others have already posted.

[notin]

MLB trade rumors should change their name to: " Signings and trades that have already been reported on "X". The rumors seldom actually come to pass. But they are quick to report what others have already posted.

 

Do you like any baseball-related sites other than Dave Dombrowski’s OnlyFans page?

[dgalehouse]

Do you like any baseball-related sites other than Dave Dombrowski’s OnlyFans page?

 

I kind of like BTV for the ultimate in nonsensical fantasy. Seriously, I am old school and that will not change. But if some of these dweebs can make a living by playing around with numbers on their i-pad, more power to them. I am content to watch a ballgame with my beer and hot dog while checking basic stats like wins and losses , ERA, batting average and rbis. Sorry if my critique of the misnamed MLB trade rumors site displeased you. But it would be nice if one of their rumors actually happened.

[mvp 78]

MLB trade rumors should change their name to: " Signings and trades that have already been reported on "X". The rumors seldom actually come to pass. But they are quick to report what others have already posted.

 

That site is just a news aggregator, but I'm not sure it ever claimed to be anything more. I used to use it for their Free Agent Tracker, but I find FanGraphs to be more user friendly now.

[Old Red]

I kind of like BTV for the ultimate in nonsensical fantasy. Seriously, I am old school and that will not change. But if some of these dweebs can make a living by playing around with numbers on their i-pad, more power to them. I am content to watch a ballgame with my beer and hot dog while checking basic stats like wins and losses , ERA, batting average and rbis. Sorry if my critique of the misnamed MLB trade rumors site displeased you. But it would be nice if one of their rumors actually happened.

 

👍👍👍 I’m still waiting for a BTV accepted trade to actually happen.

[Bellhorn04]

Specific BTV trades that people post don't usually happen, but at least it gives you a rough idea of what we'd have to give up to make one of those trades for a young starting pitcher that everyone likes to dream about.

[Old Red]

Specific BTV trades that people post don't usually happen, but at least it gives you a rough idea of what we'd have to give up to make one of those trades for a young starting pitcher that everyone likes to dream about.

 

Like I’ve said before if you like it it’s fine for you, but to me it’s just a useless toy. RBI, and BA sets off bells, and whistles whenever I mention it. That’s fine for me, and if anyone wants to use more advanced analytics, and it works for you that’s fine too, but I don’t use it, or need it.

[mvp 78]

I’m still waiting for a BTV accepted trade to actually happen.

 

I'm still waiting for you to write your first good post.

[Old Red]

I'm still waiting for you to write your first good post.

 

You’ve been at it a lot longer than I have. Once again bells, and whistles went off, because i mentioned RBI, and that was fine, but if I diss analytics, or the precious BTV it’s a crime. 🙈🤭🤮.

[notin]

Specific BTV trades that people post don't usually happen, but at least it gives you a rough idea of what we'd have to give up to make one of those trades for a young starting pitcher that everyone likes to dream about.

 

That’s really the whole point.

 

Sure most of their trade proposals never happen. Neither do most of the trade proposals from any other source anywhere in the world.

 

But most trades that actually do happen are accepted on their model. So they might actually be on to something…

[notin]

Like I’ve said before if you like it it’s fine for you, but to me it’s just a useless toy. RBI, and BA sets off bells, and whistles whenever I mention it. That’s fine for me, and if anyone wants to use more advanced analytics, and it works for you that’s fine too, but I don’t use it, or need it.

 

See, but you never end on “don’t use it” and have to add “don’t need it”. But when someone says RBI is a useless evaluation stat, you get all angry and cry victim. Like in the post above (“whenever I mention it”)…

[dgalehouse]

Like I’ve said before if you like it it’s fine for you, but to me it’s just a useless toy. RBI, and BA sets off bells, and whistles whenever I mention it. That’s fine for me, and if anyone wants to use more advanced analytics, and it works for you that’s fine too, but I don’t use it, or need it.

 

Do all of the advanced analytics and the ever growing number of metrics ever translate to wins on the field ? And why does a pitcher's fwar ( wins above a replacement player) matter so much, but his actual wins on the field are meaningless ? I have to admit that I do not have the answers .

[moonslav59]

Do all of the advanced analytics and the ever growing number of metrics ever translate to wins on the field ? And why does a pitcher's fwar ( wins above a replacement player) matter so much, but his actual wins on the field are meaningless ? I have to admit that I do not have the answers .

 

Metrics come closer to evaluating what "translates" to wins (or losses) than traditional stats. They've actually ran the numbers.

 

Even many of those who value traditional stats more than metrics, realize that the RBI stat has a whole lot to do with how many men are on base, when that batter comes up and how many are in scoring position.

 

BA, HRs and RBIs do matter. They do translate to runs and wins. Other things do, too, like BBs, XBHs, SBs and good defense saves runs. A great fielding SS saves more runs than a great fielding 1Bman. Where is that captured in traditional stats?

[Old Red]

Metrics come closer to evaluating what "translates" to wins (or losses) than traditional stats. They've actually ran the numbers.

 

Even many of those who value traditional stats more than metrics, realize that the RBI stat has a whole lot to do with how many men are on base, when that batter comes up and how many are in scoring position.

 

BA, HRs and RBIs do matter. They do translate to runs and wins. Other things do, too, like BBs, XBHs, SBs and good defense saves runs. A great fielding SS saves more runs than a great fielding 1Bman. Where is that captured in traditional stats?

 

Eye test, eye test, eye test still beats them all.

[Old Red]

See, but you never end on “don’t use it” and have to add “don’t need it”. But when someone says RBI is a useless evaluation stat, you get all angry and cry victim. Like in the post above (“whenever I mention it”)…

 

I don’t get angry, and it’s just so amusing that bells, and whistles have to go off in the first place when I mention old time stats. Getting angry just go back a few post when someone didn’t like me saying BTV is useless to me. That was getting angry.

[dgalehouse]

I do think that Breslow is going to do something that will make Sox Nation happier very soon. So far, we haven't heard much from him besides the earth shaking, groundbreaking statement that he likes pitchers with good velocity. As opposed to the GMs who prefer pitchers who lack good velocity, if any of those still exist.

[notin]

Do all of the advanced analytics and the ever growing number of metrics ever translate to wins on the field ? And why does a pitcher's fwar ( wins above a replacement player) matter so much, but his actual wins on the field are meaningless ? I have to admit that I do not have the answers .

 

My thoughts are the goal is to isolate the contributions of an individual player.

 

A team win comes from a team. But - and granted, this is more important to baseball execs than fans - what does a team win mean about an individual player?

[moonslav59]

I do think that Breslow is going to do something that will make Sox Nation happier very soon. So far, we haven't heard much from him besides the earth shaking, groundbreaking statement that he likes pitchers with good velocity. As opposed to the GMs who prefer pitchers who lack good velocity, if any of those still exist.

 

I don't think anyone should cry about Brez trading these 3:

 

Dugo: He had 1 year left, had attitude problems, hit lefties badly.

 

Urias: He had 1 year left, was not a plus defender and didn't look like he was going to get his O from 2-3 years ago back.

 

Sale: He had 1 year left, couldn't stay healthy and when healthy was sort of up and down for 5 years, from 2019 to 2023.

 

I like O'Neill, Grissom, Campbell and Fitts.

 

I'm not high on Gio, but we got better signing him.

 

I'm hoping something exciting happens: I'm expecting nothing.

 

I will not be shocked to see Yoshida and or Jansen traded.

 

I think maybe Story or Martin could be traded, as well, perhaps at the deadline.

 

It's who we add that matters most.

 

[notin]

Eye test, eye test, eye test still beats them all.

 

Eye test at games is acceptable from some folks. Eye test watching TV is hardly worth anything. Eye test watching highlights is beyond useless.

 

Eye test to compare players? Almost impossible…

[Old Red]

Eye test at games is acceptable from some folks. Eye test watching TV is hardly worth anything. Eye test watching highlights is beyond useless.

 

Eye test to compare players? Almost impossible…

 

I can’t believe that eye test in person, and watching on TV are two different things, but to say watching on TV is hardly worth anything I don’t believe is accurate at all. What did any analytic stat tell you that doing the eye test from TV didn’t when it came to how bad Kike was at SS last year, or how bad Raffy, and Casas was on D last year not to mention Franchy Strangeglove try to play 1B. Now I’ll admit being in person is better that watching on TV, but to say the eye test from TV is far from hardly worth anything. Then again it depends who’s watching.

[notin]

I can’t believe that eye test in person, and watching on TV are two different things, but to say watching on TV is hardly worth anything I don’t believe is accurate at all. What did any analytic stat tell you that doing the eye test from TV didn’t when it came to how bad Kike was at SS last year, or how bad Raffy, and Casas was on D last year not to mention Franchy Strangeglove try to play 1B. Now I’ll admit being in person is better that watching on TV, but to say the eye test from TV is far from hardly worth anything. Then again it depends who’s watching.

 

Of course eye test is different in person than on TV. When you watch a game on TV, you only get to watch what the director shows you.

 

For example, you can watch a hitter hit a flyball, and if you’re seated in a good spot, actually watch the outfielder get a jump on it. On TV, by time the camera cuts to the outfielder, he’s already in motion. And you only see a small area of the park. You missed his jump. You probably didn’t get to see if he took a good route. What exactly are you judging at that point? That he caught the ball?

 

And I think far too many people watch baseball and draw weird conclusions because they don’t understand angles and perspective. I can’t tell you how many people have tried to argue with me that left handed pitchers as are biomechanically different from righties, and they throw across their bodies. And not, you know, that they’ve spent their lives watching baseball get filmed from left-center field…

[Bellhorn04]

The eye test thing makes me chuckle. For one thing, most MLB games I've seen in person, I was too far from the field to have anything but a rough idea of what just happened on that play. Thank God for replays on giant video screens!

 

The other thing is, there's obvious stuff, like a ball going through the wickets or a throw that ends up in the dugout. Pretty hard for anybody to miss. There's also stuff that only a trained eye would notice.

[moonslav59]

Of course eye test is different in person than on TV. When you watch a game on TV, you only get to watch what the director shows you.

 

For example, you can watch a hitter hit a flyball, and if you’re seated in a good spot, actually watch the outfielder get a jump on it. On TV, by time the camera cuts to the outfielder, he’s already in motion. And you only see a small area of the park. You missed his jump. You probably didn’t get to see if he took a good route. What exactly are you judging at that point? That he caught the ball?

 

And I think far too many people watch baseball and draw weird conclusions because they don’t understand angles and perspective. I can’t tell you how many people have tried to argue with me that left handed pitchers as are biomechanically different from righties, and they throw across their bodies. And not, you know, that they’ve spent their lives watching baseball get filmed from left-center field…

 

I do think watching nearly every game of one team does give the TV viewer a pretty good idea of who is good- bad, great or crappy, but just like stats and metrics, it is flawed, for many of the reasons you mention.

 

My biggest beef with "eye test" proponents is that Horrible, bad, okay, good and great are all relative terms in MLB. I'll use the defense of Bogey as the example,

 

Bogey is a damn good fielder compared to everyone who every played or tried to play baseball, but in MLB he can be viewed as anywhere from near average to bottom tier. While it might be true, in our own mind that Bogey is a "good fielder," what good does that label mean, if 20-28 SSs are better than him? Is that really "good?"

 

Now, the next point: no single person watched nearly every play of every team, so how can we determine just how Bogey compares to other SSs?

 

We simply cannot by using only the eye test. If we watch nearly every Sox game and just a few other games, we may not even see some SSs play, at all. Others, we may see 3-6 games, each. A few others more than a dozen games, tops.

 

While metrics are highly flawed, they do inspect every play or every game in a way that attempts to be impartial and calibrated to be as consistent as possible, unlike home field scorers, who routinely assign errors and non errors in seemingly haphazard ways.

 

In defense of watching games on TV, often a replay will show a play from another angle that does capture the jump a player gets and how much ground he covers to make the play. This works better for IF'ers than OF'ers, because angles taken, jumps off the crack of the bat and the fielder's speed is harder to judge than an IF'ers.

 

The fact that DRS, OAA and UZR/150 often vary by wide degrees shows none are perfect, but to me, looking at all three, together has to be better than the eye test, when a blindfold is over our eyes for most of 28 out of 30 teams, each day.