Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[mvp 78]

That's been said about Story too.

 

We really do think they're a bunch of clueless bozos now.

 

I don't remember there being pressure that offseason? They were coming off an ALCS run and that Story move came from out of nowhere at the end of the offseason.

[notin]

Strider pitched more innings, had a higher k/9, lower bb/9, 20 WINS!, better FIP. Aside from ERA, everything about Strider's season was better AND he played on a team that was competitive and got to the playoffs. I would have went Strider > Gallen > Snell.

 

Gallen and Snell over Wheeler and Steele?

[notin]

Sure thing:

 

99 BB (led league), 5.9 BB/9, 5.8 H/9 (led league), .256 BABIP (league average around .301), 86.9% LOB rate (around 72% in 2023).

 

This isn't an issue of twisting numbers to make Snell look bad. He was, for all intents and purposes, one of the luckiest starting pitchers in the majors. He struck out a lot of guys, sure, but he walked a ton of guys, and the contact he gave up turned into outs at a rate that's almost miraculous, and most of the above average amount of guys that did reach base did not score. Dude had the perfect storm of luck, and that's unlikely to repeat. All of this without even touching the health risks. For context, two different projections systems peg him for a 3.65 ERA/ 3.73 FIP. Note that this year his FIP (3.44) was more than a full run higher than his ERA (2.25).

 

 

Snell was also helped immensely by a league-best defense behind him…

[Hugh2]

Strider pitched more innings, had a higher k/9, lower bb/9, 20 WINS!, better FIP. Aside from ERA, everything about Strider's season was better AND he played on a team that was competitive and got to the playoffs. I would have went Strider > Gallen > Snell.

 

Strider was also drafted in the 4th round. Proof that Boston can still draft high school short stops from California with their first pick and still get more pitching talent in the system in any given draft.

[Dipre]

Strider was also drafted in the 4th round. Proof that Boston can still draft high school short stops from California with their first pick and still get more pitching talent in the system in any given draft.

 

They are bad at drafting pitching. I thought we already established that?

[Hugh2]

They are bad at drafting pitching. I thought we already established that?

 

Oh, that's well established. The good news is, that is a fixable problem.

[notin]

Strider was also drafted in the 4th round. Proof that Boston can still draft high school short stops from California with their first pick and still get more pitching talent in the system in any given draft.

 

I figured Bloom was avoiding pitchers because position players are safer picks and he was looking to bolster the value of the system.

 

You can always trade those California shortstops for pitching…

[Bellhorn04]

I don't remember there being pressure that offseason? They were coming off an ALCS run and that Story move came from out of nowhere at the end of the offseason.

 

But they hadn't spent much, and there was grumbling about it.

[mvp 78]

Gallen and Snell over Wheeler and Steele?

 

Steele threw less innings and had less k's. Gallen pitching two extra starts for a Cindarella playoff team gets him in over Wheeler, but they were pretty similar.

[mvp 78]

But they hadn't spent much, and there was grumbling about it.

 

Not much grumbling from what I remember, at least nothing like now. It was just "how do they replace ERod?"

[mvp 78]

They are bad at drafting pitching. I thought we already established that?

 

You can't prove they are good at if they don't try. The first 2-3 rounds are usually the GM picks.

[notin]

Steele threw less innings and had less k's. Gallen pitching two extra starts for a Cindarella playoff team gets him in over Wheeler, but they were pretty similar.

 

Steele threw 7 fewer innings than Snell.

 

Steele had a better fWAR, but Snell had a better bWAR.

 

Wheeler lead MLB in fWAR..

[mvp 78]

Strider was also drafted in the 4th round. Proof that Boston can still draft high school short stops from California with their first pick and still get more pitching talent in the system in any given draft.

 

And constantly pushing their pitching picks to the 4th round has given them what?

 

Matt Duffy, last year's pitchability pick is currently unranked on SoxProspects.

 

Anyone excited about Dalton Rogers or Noah Dean from 2022? Drafting guys with the ceiling of "emergency back end starters" isn't great for that pitching pipeline IMO.

[Hugh2]

You can't prove they are good at if they don't try. The first 2-3 rounds are usually the GM picks.

 

Is it even that much? I always thought the GM might get involved in the first pick and after that it's pretty much your scouting department.

[mvp 78]

Steele threw 7 fewer innings than Snell.

 

Steele had a better fWAR, but Snell had a better bWAR.

 

Wheeler lead MLB in fWAR..

 

I don't care. It's not an award for who got the most fWAR. At some point, there are lots of stats to look at and determining "better season" can come down to personal opinion especially when bWAR and fWAR don't play nicely with each other.

[notin]

You can't prove they are good at if they don't try. The first 2-3 rounds are usually the GM picks.

 

Drafting pitchers is like high risk investments in the ol’ 401k.

 

Bloom played it safe with low risks and just wanted guaranteed growth. There’s no safer draft pick than the best shortstop available…

[Hugh2]

And constantly pushing their pitching picks to the 4th round has given them what?

 

Matt Duffy, last year's pitchability pick is currently unranked on SoxProspects.

 

Anyone excited about Dalton Rogers or Noah Dean from 2022? Drafting guys with the ceiling of "emergency back end starters" isn't great for that pitching pipeline IMO.

 

I'm not arguing against any of that, I just think the Sox inability to develop elite pitchers is multi-faceted. They don't draft them high, they don't draft them often, and they don't do a good job at developing guys either.

[notin]

I don't care. It's not an award for who got the most fWAR. At some point, there are lots of stats to look at and determining "better season" can come down to personal opinion especially when bWAR and fWAR don't play nicely with each other.

 

 

I think the WAR stats are both worth looking at. More so than wins…

[notin]

I'm not arguing against any of that, I just think the Sox inability to develop elite pitchers is multi-faceted. They don't draft them high, they don't draft them often, and they don't do a good job at developing guys either.

 

All of that was true even when they were drafting pitchers high…

[Hugh2]

All of that was true even when they were drafting pitchers high…

 

Whether or not you're drafting pitchers high, it would still pay huge dividends to be able to scout, and develop them better. I don't believe they don't have a lot of pitching talent solely because they don't draft them high.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm not arguing against any of that, I just think the Sox inability to develop elite pitchers is multi-faceted. They don't draft them high, they don't draft them often, and they don't do a good job at developing guys either.

 

A perfect shitstorm.

[Hugh2]

A perfect shitstorm.

 

A category 5 shitstorm.

[Dipre]

That's why they got Breslow and Bailey, but that's more focused on future rosters than the current one.

[mvp 78]

Drafting pitchers is like high risk investments in the ol’ 401k.

 

Bloom played it safe with low risks and just wanted guaranteed growth. There’s no safer draft pick than the best shortstop available…

 

Boring!

[mvp 78]

I'm not arguing against any of that, I just think the Sox inability to develop elite pitchers is multi-faceted. They don't draft them high, they don't draft them often, and they don't do a good job at developing guys either.

 

I'll be patient with the changes Crag makes in that regard. Bloom had his ways of handling the pipeline, Crag will do things differently.

[mvp 78]

I think the WAR stats are both worth looking at. More so than wins…

 

It all goes into the voting stew buddy.

[Bellhorn04]

I'll be patient with the changes Crag makes in that regard. Bloom had his ways of handling the pipeline, Crag will do things differently.

 

And we can count on Henry to give a plan time to come to fruition!

[Randy Red Sox]

Checked on MLBTR this am and I see the M/L signings are in full bloom again

[notin]

Boring!

 

Decidedly so. But a possible accurate assessment…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Snell was also helped immensely by a league-best defense behind him…

 

... even with a five-time Silver Slugger shortstop whose former team only made the playoffs five times, and won two world championships, in his 10 AL seasons?

 

Edit: in his first World Series, he actually played third base... for the first time... as a 20-year-old.