Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[notin]

Some people like to say that posters never change their minds, but if you've noticed I have recently stopped using the L-word (not Losers) when referring to 75% of the Red Sox standings during the Bloom Era.

 

From now on, our beloved, beheaded Sox will be known only as the fifth-best team in the greatest division in baseball history that hasn't won a World Series since 2018.

 

 

Right. Going next level with the sarcasm really supplies that missing perspective.

 

After all, the AL West is clearly top to bottom the toughest division. In the past two years, that division has two World Series titles despite playing the A’s (110-214) and Angels (148-176). These teams provide no relief for that grueling schedule. Even the Rangers (158-166) were just potential stumbling blocks…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Right. Going next level with the sarcasm really supplies that missing perspective.

 

After all, the AL West is clearly top to bottom the toughest division. In the past two years, that division has two World Series titles despite playing the A’s (110-214) and Angels (148-176). These teams provide no relief for that grueling schedule. Even the Rangers (158-166) were just potential stumbling blocks…

 

Can sarcasm even exist in a milieu where groan men and growing boys and girls post daily about the various vagaries of a kid's game?

[cp176]

We'll see what the FO does with this. If they realize they are out, they need to be on the phone with option 2. If they fumble the bag, it's over. It'll take a good playoff run before they'll get me to buy into the nonsense again no matter what they do.

 

I think that they should have been on the phone long ago looking into any and all options that might give this year’s team a shot at actually competing. Maybe they have been.

[mvp 78]

Someone like Merrifield is capable of other positions. Given the possibility of two rookies in the outfield, Yorke might end up replacing one of them through some rearrangement as well…

 

"Capable" is a polite way of talking about his horrible OFing.

[mvp 78]

This is why Brandon Drury checks every box.

 

1. Plays decent 2b.

2. Right-handed bat with some pop

3. One year of control (at $8.5mill)

4. Can play 1b and 3b, negating any need to keep Dalbec.

 

Sure. Fine.

[mvp 78]

Some people like to say that posters never change their minds, but if you've noticed I have recently stopped using the L-word (not Losers) when referring to 75% of the Red Sox standings during the Bloom Era.

 

From now on, our beloved, beheaded Sox will be known only as the fifth-best team in the greatest division in baseball history that hasn't won a World Series since 2018.

 

Last place in the division in the past two seasons, but not in the bottom third of the MLB (12th and 14th picks). They've been frustratingly below average teams. The 2020 team (4th pick) was a dumpster fire. That was the team that felt like a last place team. I'm glad we don't see many of those.

[mvp 78]

I think that they should have been on the phone long ago looking into any and all options that might give this year’s team a shot at actually competing. Maybe they have been.

 

Considering all the fake news from the lame stream media that has been reported so far. We have no idea what the FO has been up to. There was no smoke to the trade of Verdugo to the Yanks. The O'Neill trade came out of nowhere. Seems like the "leaks" we have been given were just conjecture. Maybe they are busy? Maybe they are doing nothing? We just don't know. Until Crag assembles his first squad, we don't really know his capabilities.

[Bellhorn04]

Considering all the fake news from the lame stream media that has been reported so far. We have no idea what the FO has been up to. There was no smoke to the trade of Verdugo to the Yanks. The O'Neill trade came out of nowhere. Seems like the "leaks" we have been given were just conjecture. Maybe they are busy? Maybe they are doing nothing? We just don't know. Until Crag assembles his first squad, we don't really know his capabilities.

 

Crag certainly appears to have plenty of patience.

[mvp 78]

Crag certainly appears to have plenty of patience.

 

He was decisive when he wanted to make that trade in Rule 5. Maybe he can be both patient and strike like a cobra when he needs to?

[Bellhorn04]

He was decisive when he wanted to make that trade in Rule 5. Maybe he can be both patient and strike like a cobra when he needs to?

 

I wonder if the Sox front office by committee allows such a thing as striking like a cobra. I think you have to go along to get along with these folks.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm beginning to have doubts we get Moto, Monty OR Snell. I think the Sox turn up their noses at the prices.

[mvp 78]

I'm beginning to have doubts we get Moto, Monty OR Snell. I think the Sox turn up their noses at the prices.

 

JH to fans: Prices for thee, not for me!

[notin]

"Capable" is a polite way of talking about his horrible OFing.

 

By “capable”, I meant “he knows where right field is located in most ballparks.”

[mvp 78]

I wonder if the Sox front office by committee allows such a thing as striking like a cobra. I think you have to go along to get along with these folks.

 

We'll see how the Crag regime goes. If it's meet the new boss same as the old boss then we have a good idea that it doesn't work. With DD, the problem was always "well he doesn't work well or listen to others!" But he'd go out and make moves! You know, the thing a CBO is supposed to do.

[notin]

I'm beginning to have doubts we get Moto, Monty OR Snell. I think the Sox turn up their noses at the prices.

 

They reportedly did offer $300mill for Yamamoto. They are setting that pace…

[Bellhorn04]

They reportedly did offer $300mill for Yamamoto. They are setting that pace…

 

That report was ******** and has been debunked.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/12/yoshinobu-yamamoto-rumors-offers-300-million-yankees-mets.html

[mvp 78]

@WEEI

Sox Manager Alex Cora spoke this morning with @bradfo & @BBisntBoring on the free agent market: "It's not lack of effort. We're working. Bres is working. It hasn't happened... yet. Business wise. These two guys have dominated the game"

[mvp 78]

That report was ******** and has been debunked.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/12/yoshinobu-yamamoto-rumors-offers-300-million-yankees-mets.html

 

Yup, that was caused by the fake news lame stream media member Mario Pepen!

[Bellhorn04]

@WEEI

Sox Manager Alex Cora spoke this morning with @bradfo & @BBisntBoring on the free agent market: "It's not lack of effort. We're working. Bres is working. It hasn't happened... yet. Business wise. These two guys have dominated the game"

 

"These two guys have dominated the game"?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

"These two guys have dominated the game"?

 

Ohtani and Yamamoto: unanimous 2023 Offseason Player and Pitcher of the Year (ending)!

[mvp 78]

"These two guys have dominated the game"?

 

Wonder if there was any pushback to that from Bradford?

[moonslav59]

This year the Red Sox got only a combined 13.6 fWAR from their position players, and that total included 5.1 fWAR from the departed Alex Verdugo, Adam Duvall and Justin Turner.

 

Yet focus is on the starting rotation.

 

The Sox have holes to fill.

 

Of course, I'm assuming a healthy season from Story and continued growth from Wong, Casas (on D), Abreu and or Rafaela.

 

I've never said we have studs in all but 3 slots on the 26. Yes, we could certainly improve at more than 3 slots on the 26, but to me, we have only 3 "major" holes, and they are at key and expensive positions:

 

SP1

SP2 or 3

2B (RH b at)

 

Once could argue our catching tandem in weaker than the norm, and the 2023 numbers back that up and the CF/RF situation depends a lot on 2 of these 3 guys to come through: O'Neill, Rafaela and Abreu. I suppose Duran could play CF, but I prefer he not do that.

 

Also, while I was talking about 2024, it's nice to know our top 4 prospects- 3 maybe ready by late '24 or early '25 play in areas we need help the most, beyond pitching:

OF: Anthony

SS: Mayer (Story to 2B?)

C: Teel

 

I think we are better than the norm at ...

DH (Yoshida)

1B (Casas)

SS (Story)

3B (Devers)

LF (Duran/Refsnyder)

 

We look near the norm at...

CF & RF (O'Neil, Rafaela, Abreu)

C (Wong & McGuire)

 

Our bench will have Rafaela or Abreu + Refsnyder in the OF

Reyes + EValdez in MI

1B depth is questionable

 

Add two top SP'ers, and IMO, the rest of our rotation looks near norm or better and IMO, or pen will look top 3 in skill and depth.

SP1

SP2

Bello

Sale

Pivetta

Houck, Crawford, Whitlock

Jansen, Martin, Winckowski, Schreiber and Slaten (Rule 5) or Mata (out of options)

This minor league pen depth looks fantastic:

Campbell

Bernardino

Fitts

Murphy

Criswell

Weissert

Kelly

Walter & Gambrel

Guerrero & Hagenman (Wikelman, Benitez & Olivares)

 

If we end up trading for one key need, and he's not expensive, then we could fill the other 2 slots through free agency and have some funds left over to upgrade C and OF, too. Maybe both.

 

 

[mvp 78]

Fitts isn't bullpen depth IMO. He'd be an emergency starter most likely. He has the best SP profile of the 5 guys listed in the WOO rotation on SoxProspects (Winck, Walter, Fitts, Gambrell, Van Belle).

[moonslav59]

I don't put a lot of trust in all the BTV numbers, but according to them, we look okay to pretty well set at 2B, CF and LF:

 

34.0 Duran (they list him in CF)

12.3 Rafaela (OF, but can play 2B)

8.1 Valdez (2B)

7.8 Abreu (OF- maybe the hardest guy to place a firm value on)

5.7 O'Neill (OF)

 

Take away the money and they see their and others' projected productionvalue as suck:

 

323/10 Devers

87/5 Casas

78/4 Yoshida

60/5 Duran

34/4 Story

25/6 Abreu

20/6 EValdez

19/6 Rafaela

11/1 O'Neill

6/2 McGuire

4.4/5 Wong

 

According to BTV, Catching is our biggest non-pitching need. Maybe we try to add a short term catcher to carry us to Teel.

 

[moonslav59]

"Expected." With Yorke in AAA, I'm not sure how big they'll go at 2B.

 

Maybe a one year deal sort of guy.

 

Polanco has 2 years. Maybe we get him and trade Yorke or EValdez. Then, hopefully, Mayer comes up in 2025 to solve our MI issue for a while.

[moonslav59]

And if every time I refer to the 2022 and 2023 teams as 78 win teams, I get corrected by someone who saying “you mean last place teams”, then I’m allowed to do that because maybe just maybe some of us don’t need to live in a world where we get to talk about even bad Sox seasons without over-emphasizing the negativity. As if failing to underscore every failure in the worst possible light is construed as not understanding the situation…

 

Very well stated.

 

Also, how any sort of display of optimism is met with a 2 by 4 to the noggin, then gloating and self-back slapping by the eternal pessimists.

[mvp 78]

I don't put a lot of trust in all the BTV numbers, but according to them, we look okay to pretty well set at 2B, CF and LF:

 

34.0 Duran (they list him in CF)

12.3 Rafaela (OF, but can play 2B)

8.1 Valdez (2B)

7.8 Abreu (OF- maybe the hardest guy to place a firm value on)

5.7 O'Neill (OF)

 

Take away the money and they see their and others' projected productionvalue as suck:

 

323/10 Devers

87/5 Casas

78/4 Yoshida

60/5 Duran

34/4 Story

25/6 Abreu

20/6 EValdez

19/6 Rafaela

11/1 O'Neill

6/2 McGuire

4.4/5 Wong

 

According to BTV, Catching is our biggest non-pitching need. Maybe we try to add a short term catcher to carry us to Teel.

 

 

I mean, that's all about TRADE value, not current value. I don't think it's necessarily the same thing. Abreu has a certain amount of value over the next 6 years, but maybe less value for '24.

[mvp 78]

Maybe a one year deal sort of guy.

 

Polanco has 2 years. Maybe we get him and trade Yorke or EValdez. Then, hopefully, Mayer comes up in 2025 to solve our MI issue for a while.

 

I wouldn't necessarily trade Yorke to clear space. I'd trade Yorke if you were bringing back pitching. He has a chance to stick as an everyday regular now that his glove is average at 2B.

[moonslav59]

This is why Brandon Drury checks every box.

 

1. Plays decent 2b.

2. Right-handed bat with some pop

3. One year of control (at $8.5mill)

4. Can play 1b and 3b, negating any need to keep Dalbec.

 

You are talking me into this.

 

5.8 fWAR 2021-2023, while ranked 20th at 2B, it is a big improvement over what we have had.

.806 OPS (4th best by 2Bmen since '21) and his .493 SLG is second only to Altuve.

His D has mixed metrics:

-2 DRS (28th out of 42 2Bmen with 900+ innings at 2B)

+3.8 UZR/150 (9th out of 42)

+5 OAA (24th out of 111)

 

BTV accepts:

Bleis, Yorke and Wikelman

for

Sandoval (3 yrs) & Dury (1 yr)

 

 

[moonslav59]

I mean, that's all about TRADE value, not current value. I don't think it's necessarily the same thing. Abreu has a certain amount of value over the next 6 years, but maybe less value for '24.

 

The second list is value before money is factored.

 

Yes, the younger players would project to less in '24.