6/19 @ Land of 10,000 Mistakes

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Looks like it won't matter, but that is a ridiculous number of K's and a DP with RISP from the middle of the batting order. But as always , when the bottom 3 of the order ( Casas, Wong, Reyes) participate ( currently 5-10) good things happen. Duran and Dugo doing their best helped too. They went 5 for 7 BUT neither scored a run, telling you sharpies something just as obvious to the eye testers. Technically, Ref batting for Duran in an oft questioned move by AC or the analytics guy did score a run on Dugo's triple.

 

The SOX are much better off than the Yankems. They can't win much w/o their best player. The SOX, otoh, would be much more competitive offensively if they were to lose their best offensive player. IOW, W/O Judge, the Yankems' offense sucks!

[Tedballgame]

Paxton needs to be back next year. 3 years and 36 million would seem reasonable if he keeps pitching well.

[vegasbob]

I’m letting it go some they’re up by 6 runs with 6 outs to go…

 

Speaking of 6's, I apologize in my excitement last night for loving the Fenway sweep of NYY to misstate that the Sox swept NY in NY the prior week. In my heart, I still think they did and am awaiting the outcome of the appeal on the alleged 3-1 loss to the Yankees

[wyo-sox]

Only a guess, but the analytics vs a LH reliever brought in to face Duran suggested moving to Refsnyder. Remember it was 2 outs, 2 on and Duran may have been too excited to take the walk

 

Makes sense.

[wyo-sox]

I was lamenting about Casas at a family gathering yesterday.... my brother (a Yankees fan, but with far greater baseball knowledge than I) reminded me how Pedroia was pretty bad his first year- and had to be sent back to AAA before turning into an allstar. He reminded me these guys understand potential in a way I can't.

[Jasonbay44]

Christian Arroyo has looked really bad this year.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Paxton needs to be back next year. 3 years and 36 million would seem reasonable if he keeps pitching well.

 

Based on current prices, that would almost be a steal.

[wyo-sox]

Christian Arroyo has looked really bad this year.

 

quite

[Jasonbay44]

Based on current prices, that would almost be a steal.

 

He's going to be 35 though and has a very lengthy injury history. Not sure I'd want to commit three years to him.

[wyo-sox]

He's going to be 35 though and has a very lengthy injury history. Not sure I'd want to commit three years to him.

 

Agreed- but will we ever see a pitcher's contract we like again? You have to massively over pay if it is not home grown.

[vegasbob]

When you realize that the about to be 36-37 Twins, lead the AL Central and the about to be 38-35 Red Sox are 5th in the AL East baseball is not quite as balanced as some think

[Maxbialystock]

In defense of posters here.

 

We recognized how bad Kluber was before Cora.

 

Posters recognized Pivetta has been bad for over a year. Something Cora did not see.

 

Finally Cora was forced to admit Kike was not a shortstop.

 

I'd say that is three major f*** ups that destroyed early part of the season.

 

Yes keep kissing his ass.

 

You seriously believe Cora didn't recognize the problems with Kluber, Pivetta, and Kike? I like your posts a lot, but, if you believe that, you aren't nearly as smart as I thought you were.

 

Kluber got his shot as any acquired starter would, especially one with his background--especially when he's being paid $10M. As for Pivetta, as recently as last year he had the 3d best WAR among Sox pitchers and the 2d best among Sox starters. He started 33 games and had 12 quality starts. You appear to think he was dog doodoo. This year, agreed, he got hammered as a starter, but in the last month has learned how to be an effective reliever. The point is, when Pivetta started this year, Cora didn't have a whole lot of choices.

 

Finally, Kike. Another $10M player having a bad year. Two years ago as the Sox centerfielder his WAR was 4.9. This year he was moved to SS because Story and Chang are on the IL. That didn't work, but he also is 4th on the Sox in rbi's with 29. His WAR is a pretty bad -0.4, but it's still better than Schwarber's -0.6. Nevertheless the Talksox experts (like you) have branded him the world's biggest loser.

 

This year the Sox total salaries are ranked 15th in MLB. I know that's the lowest ranking in the John Henry era and suspect it's the lowest ranking in 40 years. And you act as though Cora's job is so easy, despite the dearth of front line starters and the injuries to Story, Duvall (who still isn't the Duvall of the first 8 games), Houck, Sale, Schreiber, Chang, et al--to say nothing of Devers WAR sinking to roughly what it was in 2017, the year before official rookie year.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Based on current prices, that would almost be a steal.

 

I don't know if this is likely, but perhaps Paxton would accept a contract like that based on the fact the SOX were paying him for quite a while when he wasn't able to pitch. But, cynical me believes he'll go to whomever pays him the most.

[wyo-sox]

You seriously believe Cora didn't recognize the problems with Kluber, Pivetta, and Kike? I like your posts a lot, but, if you believe that, you aren't nearly as smart as I thought you were.

 

Kluber got his shot as any acquired starter would, especially one with his background--especially when he's being paid $10M. As for Pivetta, as recently as last year he had the 3d best WAR among Sox pitchers and the 2d best among Sox starters. He started 33 games and had 12 quality starts. You appear to think he was dog doodoo. This year, agreed, he got hammered as a starter, but in the last month has learned how to be an effective reliever. The point is, when Pivetta started this year, Cora didn't have a whole lot of choices.

 

Finally, Kike. Another $10M player having a bad year. Two years ago as the Sox centerfielder his WAR was 4.9. This year he was moved to SS because Story and Chang are on the IL. That didn't work, but he also is 4th on the Sox in rbi's with 29. His WAR is a pretty bad -0.4, but it's still better than Schwarber's -0.6. Nevertheless the Talksox experts (like you) have branded him the world's biggest loser.

 

This year the Sox total salaries are ranked 15th in MLB. I know that's the lowest ranking in the John Henry era and suspect it's the lowest ranking in 40 years. And you act as though Cora's job is so easy, despite the dearth of front line starters and the injuries to Story, Duvall (who still isn't the Duvall of the first 8 games), Houck, Sale, Schreiber, Chang, et al--to say nothing of Devers WAR sinking to roughly what it was in 2017, the year before official rookie year.

 

Well sure... if you want to cloud the narrative with facts.

[wyo-sox]

Boy I liked Vazquez... good player. Wong has been great- but still miss V

[Dipre]

Well sure... if you want to cloud the narrative with facts.

 

How dare he!!!

[vegasbob]

If Cora is just short of being an idiot, how did he just reach 400 wins as a manager ? He's special

[Jasonbay44]

Agreed- but will we ever see a pitcher's contract we like again? You have to massively over pay if it is not home grown.

 

This is true - but as we've seen with Sale and Kluber, you need to be cautious paying injury prone pitcher, especially older ones and giving them long term contracts. Eovaldi only got two years $34 million and he is two years younger than Paxton. I'm not sure what Paxton is looking for but I'd be fine committing 1-2 years to him, but I'd probably pass on anything longer.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Jasonbay44

[Dipre]

Is this officially a win streak?

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Good win. 9 runs should win most games, but the SOX could have scored 15 or more tonight. So those runners they stranded tonight, they will drive in tomorrow.

[Dipre]

This is true - but as we've seen with Sale and Kluber, you need to be cautious paying injury prone pitcher, especially older ones and giving them long term contracts. Eovaldi only got two years $34 million and he is two years younger than Eovaldi. I'm not sure what Paxton is looking for but I'd be fine committing 1-2 years to him, but I'd probably pass on anything longer.

 

Eovaldi being younger than Eovaldi is what makes his contract such a steal.

[vegasbob]

Is this officially a win streak?

 

Depends on the definition of "Is"

[Jasonbay44]

If Cora is just short of being an idiot, how did he just reach 400 wins as a manager ? He's special

 

The 2012 Red Sox manager had over a 1000 wins.

[notin]

If Cora is just short of being an idiot, how did he just reach 400 wins as a manager ? He's special

 

Well, bear in mind that if you measure managerial success in pennants, who the best manager in Sox history is…

[moonslav59]

Christian Arroyo has looked really bad this year.

 

With Duran and Ref heating up as a platoon, maybe we'll see Kike at 2B more than Arroyo.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

AL Central is a joke and a long running one at that.

[d-money]

Good guys win! With Crawford going tomorrow the streak could end. Hope not. Go Sox!

[Dipre]

The 2012 Red Sox manager had over a 1000 wins.

 

Valentine was good for a time in his managerial career.

[Maxbialystock]

I was lamenting about Casas at a family gathering yesterday.... my brother (a Yankees fan, but with far greater baseball knowledge than I) reminded me how Pedroia was pretty bad his first year- and had to be sent back to AAA before turning into an allstar. He reminded me these guys understand potential in a way I can't.

 

Actually, I'm pretty sure they did not send Pedey back to AAA. He had a horrible start, all right, but they were confident he would come around--which he did, I think in June. The very next year he was the AL MVP.

 

I think Casas is getting a chance to prove himself because everyone else has been so bad at 1B and because they believe he can in fact hit.

[Jasonbay44]

Valentine was good for a time in his managerial career.

 

Sure, but managerial wins are also usually linked to what team you managed and depend on a lot of variables. You can be an idiot with a stacked team or be a genius with not a lot of talent to work with. Most people consider Aaron Boone an idiot but he's approaching 500 wins as a manager.

 

I think its clear Valentine was bad in 2012