Red Sox Starting Rotation 2023

[a700hitter]

Garrett Whitlock:

 

Career as a starter 4.72 ERA 1.29 WHIP

Career as a reliever 2.24 ERA .99 WHIP

 

Let’s hope that he doesn’t end up like Daniel Bard.

[mvp 78]

@tylermilliken_

Red Sox continue to add pitching depth by signing Dinelson Lamet to a minor league deal.

 

He was just released by the Rockies after posting a 11.57 ERA/6.57 over 25.2 IP. 10.9 K/9 and 7.7 BB/9.

[notin]

@tylermilliken_

Red Sox continue to add pitching depth by signing Dinelson Lamet to a minor league deal.

 

He was just released by the Rockies after posting a 11.57 ERA/6.57 over 25.2 IP. 10.9 K/9 and 7.7 BB/9.

 

Lamet is 10 pounds of talent jammed into a 5 lb sling. Great move if he can stay healthy. But he can’t…

[notin]

Let’s hope that he doesn’t end up like Daniel Bard.

 

Bard got 2 wins against us a last week…

[mvp 78]

Lamet is 10 pounds of talent jammed into a 5 lb sling. Great move if he can stay healthy. But he can’t…

 

MiLB deal, so nothing to worry about.

[moonslav59]

We’ve used 27 pitchers before the AS break. (One was Reyes.)

 

It’s hard to plan for depth that deep.

[Larry Cook]

We’ve used 27 pitchers before the AS break. (One was Reyes.)

 

It’s hard to plan for depth that deep.

 

But shouldn’t we have planned for this given that must of our pitchers spend a ton of time in the trainers room

[notin]

But shouldn’t we have planned for this given that must of our pitchers spend a ton of time in the trainers room

 

26 might be a bit much. (Not counting Reyes.)

 

But Tampa has used 30 pitchers. New York, Baltimore and Toronto have all used in the 18-23 range…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

We’ve used 27 pitchers before the AS break. (One was Reyes.)

 

It’s hard to plan for depth that deep.

 

I mean, can't they hire competent doctors or actors who play them on TV to check out prospective pitchers for brittle ribs or shoulder blades or elbows or even cheekbones?

 

Where in the name of Brusdar Graterol are the damn medicals when recruiting these guys?

[moonslav59]

26 might be a bit much. (Not counting Reyes.)

 

But Tampa has used 30 pitchers. New York, Baltimore and Toronto have all used in the 18-23 range…

 

17 pitchers with 17+ IP

22 with 7+ IP

[moonslav59]

17 pitchers with 17+ IP

22 with 7+ IP

 

The Rays have 13 pitchers with17+ IP, but 22 over 11 IP.

[Dojji]

I feel like things are looking up. I think over the next 5 years we'll all get to know Bello and Kutter quite well. Having the farm system come up with competent starters is huge. Before these two I think the last truly homegrown top starter we pulled out of our farm was Jon Lester. Bello could be a 1, arguably may already be a 1. Kutter looks like a possible 3. Getting both beginning to find their feet at the same time is wonderful.

 

I don't think we'll ever see Chris Sale be Chris Sale again but if we do, alongside Crawford and Bello, that'd be one hell of a rotation. even if not, having those 2 for the next few years should give us something stable to build on for the future.

Edited July 16, 2023 by Dojji

[mvp 78]

I feel like things are looking up. I think over the next 5 years we'll all get to know Bello and Kutter quite well. Having the farm system come up with competent starters is huge. Before these two I think the last truly homegrown top starter we pulled out of our farm was Jon Lester. Bello could be a 1, arguably may already be a 1. Kutter looks like a possible 3. Getting both beginning to find their feet at the same time is wonderful.

 

I don't think we'll ever see Chris Sale be Chris Sale again but if we do, alongside Crawford and Bello, that'd be one hell of a rotation. even if not, having those 2 for the next few years should give us something stable to build on for the future.

 

I don't see Bello as a TOTR guy. He's probably could be a decent #2 though. He doesn't get enough k's, gives up a lot of hard contact and most of the underlying metrics are average. He has a good 4 pitch mix, but none of the pitches are really plus plus.

 

Nice to have you back on here.

[Dipre]

I don't see Bello as a TOTR guy. He's probably could be a decent #2 though. He doesn't get enough k's, gives up a lot of hard contact and most of the underlying metrics are average. He has a good 4 pitch mix, but none of the pitches are really plus plus.

 

Nice to have you back on here.

 

Bello's development is similar to a lot of guys who wind up being 1's. If he starts striking out more guys, watch out.

[Dojji]

We’ve used 27 pitchers before the AS break. (One was Reyes.)

 

It’s hard to plan for depth that deep.

 

Kinda reminds me of 06. That one didn't end particularly well either. We went deep into the weeds for starters that year, Kyle Snyder, Kason Gabbard, Kevin Jarvis, Devern Hansack, Julian Tavarez, and those were the relatively successful ones.

[mvp 78]

Bello's development is similar to a lot of guys who wind up being 1's. If he starts striking out more guys, watch out.

 

Sure, if he becomes a different pitcher THEN we can call him a #1. I just see a lot of people jumping the gun and proclaiming him a top of the rotation pitcher RIGHT NOW. His underlying metrics are middle of the road. He gets hit hard and doesn't miss bats. Since his BB rate is down, he's a very solid starter. It's just hard to say if his current success (ERA outpacing xFIP) is going to continue long term.

[Dojji]

I don't see Bello as a TOTR guy. He's probably could be a decent #2 though. He doesn't get enough k's, gives up a lot of hard contact and most of the underlying metrics are average. He has a good 4 pitch mix, but none of the pitches are really plus plus.

 

Nice to have you back on here.

 

One migha said the same thing about Jon Lester in 07 though. Numbers don't lie, the command is there he's at ~8 strikeouts per 9 innings which is actually better than where Lester lived for the most part. WHIP is good less than a hit per inning is good, the man eats innings, whether he's a 1 or a 2 is ultimately a semantics game. The guy has the stuff to lead a rotation and if he stays heathy we'll be very glad of him

 

If you're looking for a comp for bello, I think I can feel confident in giving you Mike Mussina. That's a good guy to have in one of the high leverage slots in the rotation. bello misses bats a bit better than the Moose did too.

Edited July 17, 2023 by Dojji

[mvp 78]

Kinda reminds me of 06. That one didn't end particularly well either. We went deep into the weeds for starters that year, Kyle Snyder, Kason Gabbard, Kevin Jarvis, Devern Hansack, Julian Tavarez, and those were the relatively successful ones.

 

Nope, don't remember that one! All 3 starts were in September in a year they missed the playoffs. That's a blur.

[Dipre]

Sure, if he becomes a different pitcher THEN we can call him a #1. I just see a lot of people jumping the gun and proclaiming him a top of the rotation pitcher RIGHT NOW. His underlying metrics are middle of the road. He gets hit hard and doesn't miss bats. Since his BB rate is down, he's a very solid starter. It's just hard to say if his current success (ERA outpacing xFIP) is going to continue long term.

 

His fastball lacks spin rate. That is fixable.

[Dojji]

Nope, don't remember that one! All 3 starts were in September in a year they missed the playoffs. That's a blur.

 

That's kinda my point, we had to go deeeeeep into the well that year. and it started at the beginning of the year when Clement and Wells turned into pumpkins.

 

On the other hand some of those guys played roles in the championship season. Kyle Snyder matured into a decent inning chewing MR, Gabbard spun some gems in June and July before being traded (I still wonder what his career mighta been if he didn't blow out his elbow), and I think there were a couple others that showed up at times.

Edited July 17, 2023 by Dojji

[Bellhorn04]

When it comes to deep statistical dives, mvp and Dipre are the men in the bathysphere.

[mvp 78]

That's kinda my point, we had to go deeeeeep into the well that year. and it started at the beginning of the year when Clement and Wells turned into pumpkins.

 

On the other hand some of those guys played roles in the championship season. Kyle Snyder matured into a decent inning chewing MR, Gabbard spun some gems in June and July before being traded (I still wonder what his career mighta been if he didn't blow out his elbow), and I think there were a couple others that showed up at times.

 

It was definitely an in between year. It also didn't help that the guy they acquired to lead their staff had a really bad first year in Boston. He settled down and pitched ok the next 5 years though.

[mvp 78]

When it comes to deep statistical dives, mvp and Dipre are the men in the bathysphere.

 

I was surprised he didn't mention David Pauley.

[Dojji]

It was definitely an in between year. It also didn't help that the guy they acquired to lead their staff had a really bad first year in Boston. He settled down and pitched ok the next 5 years though.

 

Don't get me started about the consistent inconsistency of Josh Beckett. We'll be here all month, lol. At least he was on when it mattered in 07.

[mvp 78]

Don't get me started about the consistent inconsistency of Josh Beckett. We'll be here all month, lol. At least he was on when it mattered in 07.

 

Well, if Beckett doesn't give up 8 runs in Game 2 against the Rays in 08, maybe they get to another WS.

[Dojji]

Needlesss to say that at a bare minimum Bello looks like he's gonna play out better than Beckett did. Here's hoping anyway.

[Bellhorn04]

Don't get me started about the consistent inconsistency of Josh Beckett. We'll be here all month, lol. At least he was on when it mattered in 07.

 

And 03 (if you were rooting for the Marlins against the Yankees).

[Bellhorn04]

Well, if Beckett doesn't give up 8 runs in Game 2 against the Rays in 08, maybe they get to another WS.

 

Probably the biggest error of Tito's tenure with us.

 

Beckett did win Game 6 in that series.

[moonslav59]

Don't get me started about the consistent inconsistency of Josh Beckett. We'll be here all month, lol. At least he was on when it mattered in 07.

 

He was on his way to becoming the best playoff pitcher of all time.

 

So much for “clutch” being a sustainable skill.

[Bellhorn04]

He was on his way to becoming the best playoff pitcher of all time.

 

So much for “clutch” being a sustainable skill.

 

There are no sustainable skills. Players inevitably age and get hurt and all that stuff.

 

Beckett's postseason record remains one that any pitcher would want to have. Instrumental to 2 rings for 2 teams.