just wondering

[mvp 78]

Good thing. He’d probably injure himself putting his name on the contract….

 

Since 2013:

Wood 984 Innings

Eovaldi 988 Innings

[notin]

Bloom: "Old woman!"

 

Joe Smith: "Man."

 

B: "Sorry. Old man! Whose clubhouse is that?"

 

J: "I'm 37!"

 

B: "What?"

 

J: "I'm 37, I'm not old!"

 

B: "Well, I can't just call you 'man'."

 

J: "Well, you could say 'Joe Smith'."

 

B: "I didn't know you were called Joe Smith."

 

J: "You never bothered to find out, did you?"

 

B: "I did say sorry about the old woman, but from behind you looked--"

 

Don’t do that!!

 

I nearly spit coffee all over my monitor!! Which I don’t own because I’m at work!

[mvp 78]

That’s not his real name…

 

When I'm scrolling through the list of FA candidates, I read Joe Smith and just pass right on by. A perfect name for a team that hasn't sniffed the playoffs in 20 years or whatever. He's 37 and playing for his 7th organization. Also, notin needs to point out Smith's numbers from HOU this season.

[mvp 78]

Don’t do that!!

 

I nearly spit coffee all over my monitor!! Which I don’t own because I’m at work!

 

I'm just providing a free service to all. I was told that the only way I'd get a new work laptop was to through mine into the river. Good luck.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Forgive 5Gold. He operates on the assumption that Bloom doesn’t know the Red Sox have money and will continue to operate the Sox as a small market team, much like how Dan Duquette did when he came over from Montreal or like how Bloom’s predecessor in Tampa is doing with the Dodgers, frantically scavenging and cost-cutting to keep that payroll below the $500 million mark. Just look at his team! He has 3 starters whose previous jobs were all utility infielder!!

 

Nah. I'm just duped by the Moneyball scene when John Henry approaches Billy Beane to say how much he wants that same approach to approach Boston, Massachusetts, East of Worcester, USofA.

 

And posters are right, the RaysWay narrative about exactly why Henry approached Chaim Bloom needs to go away -- and will, as soon as Bloom signs a closer like Liam Hendricks for $54 million. Dollars.

[Bellhorn04]

Nah. I'm just duped by the Moneyball scene when John Henry approaches Billy Beane to say how much he wants that same approach to approach Boston, Massachusetts, East of Worcester, USofA.

 

And you fell asleep like Rip Van Winkle after that and missed 2018 and 2019, huh?

[notin]

Nah. I'm just duped by the Moneyball scene when John Henry approaches Billy Beane to say how much he wants that same approach to approach Boston, Massachusetts, East of Worcester, USofA.

 

And posters are right, the RaysWay narrative about exactly why Henry approached Chaim Bloom needs to go away -- and will, as soon as Bloom signs a closer like Liam Hendricks for $54 million. Dollars.

 

And maybe he will overpay for the closer tied for third in the AL in blown saves, one off the lead.

 

That seems like an odd line in the sand to me, however, as the team could be improved without going and getting a new closer and spending that money elsewhere…

[harmony]

And maybe he will overpay for the closer tied for third in the AL in blown saves, one off the lead.

 

That seems like an odd line in the sand to me, however, as the team could be improved without going and getting a new closer and spending that money elsewhere…

Would the Red Sox be interested in closer Edwin Diaz if the Mets clean house in the offseason?

 

Diaz remains under team control for one more season working off his 2021 salary of $7 million.

[notin]

Would the Red Sox be interested in closer Edwin Diaz if the Mets clean house in the offseason?

 

Diaz remains under team control for one more season working off his 2021 salary of $7 million.

 

You’d have to ask Bloom.

 

But why would the Mets clean house so soon after committing too many years to Francisco Lindor?

[notin]

Since 2013:

Wood 984 Innings

Eovaldi 988 Innings

 

 

I’ve never been known to praise Eovaldi for his durability. That Wood is in his class - especially as I use Eovaldi as a benchmark for oft-injured pitchers - does not inspire confidence in this forum poster.

 

However, if the Sox got clever and tried Wood out as a relief pitcher capable of handling high leverage situations, I am all on board…

[moonslav59]

I think Bloom looks for an under the radar RP'er or two who were not even closers, this year, but he thinks can do the job, next year, then, he'll go with Houck and they will be set-up men.

 

We spend big on starters.

[harmony]

You’d have to ask Bloom.

 

But why would the Mets clean house so soon after committing too many years to Francisco Lindor?

From Sunday's MLB Trade Rumors chat:

Mets fan

6:52 Is everything going to be ok? What encouraging things can you say to me? What a terrible collapse.

Mark P

6:53 The hope is that the new president of baseball operations is allowed to basically clean house. I realize Alderson will still be there and Cohen has been a part of the ownership picture for a long time, but the new PoBO should be allowed to bring in his/her own people and make a clean break from this era of Mets baseball

https://www.jotcast.com/chat/mlbtr-live-chat-11501.html

[notin]

From Sunday's MLB Trade Rumors chat:

 

https://www.jotcast.com/chat/mlbtr-live-chat-11501.html

 

I think that refers more to front office personnel as opposed to the MLB roster.

 

The Mets would actually be crazy to rebuild right now, especially if deGrom is ready for 2021…

[harmony]

I think that refers more to front office personnel as opposed to the MLB roster.

 

The Mets would actually be crazy to rebuild right now, especially if deGrom is ready for 2021…

If not Edwin Diaz, how about Seattle reliever Diego Castillo, who has AL East experience (and is the same age as Diaz) but who remains under team control for three arbitration years?

 

Diaz has an ERA of 3.25 and an ERA+ of 127 in 341 career appearances while Castillo has an ERA of 2.97 and an ERA+ of 141 in 188 career appearances.

 

The Seattle bullpen will welcome Ken Giles and Andres Munoz in 2023 but the problem is that the Mariners and Red Sox do not match up well in a trade.

[Kimmi]

It could be done. Players and owners could suddenly agree to take less. Front row tix could go for $10. And at that point, since there would be no prestige to sitting there, corporations and celebrities would no longer buy up all the good seats. You could walk to the park, just like in the sixties, and buy any ticket you want. And every fan in NE with $100, all 500,000 of them, would drive their kids every weekend to Fenway, eat hot dogs, drink beer, and walk back to their car parked a block away on the street or in a two-dollar lot ... There would be no poverty. No disease. We would all wear Fedoras. And the G*P would vanish from the earth.

 

The political statement aside, this is how things would be in my little world.

[Kimmi]

Why should be players be loyal to fans, Kimmi? Fans are the first to want them gone when they're not performing. Fans are only loyal as long as the player is consistently delivering.

 

Fans should be more loyal to the players too. Loyalty is a 2 way street.

[Kimmi]

There's no way Bloom spends big bucks on "proven" relievers. The Rays never do; instead, they constantly deal for young power arms to stockpile and develop -- and as soon as one becomes established and possibly expensive, they trade him while he's still good, but always for two more pitchers.

 

Bloom had a chance to sign plenty of "proven" relievers last winter and refused, while they landed instead all over the MLB map. He finally caved and extended Barnes this summer... and got burned. Expect our CBO to turnover the bullpen, but via trades and promotions.

 

I have always been of the opinion that a team should not spend big bucks on relievers. IMO, resources are better spent on other parts of the team.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I have always been of the opinion that a team should not spend big bucks on relievers. IMO, resources are better spent on other parts of the team.

 

I'm in total agreement with you. Relievers that are not unanimous Hall of Famers are the shooting stars of the big leagues: Did you SEE tha- poof...

 

Some posters seem to think I'm advocating the opposite (even though I wrote today that Bloom will never sign a big money closer). As far as the bullpen, all I've pushed for is help -- last winter, and especially at the deadline this summer. I admire the RaysWay when it comes to pitchers, pumping them out of the gate like Minions.

 

I don't think for a second our beloved CBO isn't constantly scouring the databases for next year's Rasmussen or Kittredge or Nick Anderson or Pagan, etc., etc.

[dgalehouse]

In today's baseball , the bullpen is more important than ever. Possibly equal to, or more important, than the starting rotation. There are a ton of young hard throwers who can pitch a clean inning for you. So , it is possible to build a good pen on the cheap. But you have to either be very good or very lucky at assembling the pen that way. You should not be afraid to spend money on the pen if it will improve your chances . No sense having a good rotation if your pen is going to blow it late.

[moonslav59]

Many of the RPers signed, last winter did not do well.

 

It’s not always about spending the most. The Rays never do.

[notin]

I'm in total agreement with you. Relievers that are not unanimous Hall of Famers are the shooting stars of the big leagues: Did you SEE tha- poof...

 

Some posters seem to think I'm advocating the opposite (even though I wrote today that Bloom will never sign a big money closer). As far as the bullpen, all I've pushed for is help -- last winter, and especially at the deadline this summer. I admire the RaysWay when it comes to pitchers, pumping them out of the gate like Minions.

 

I don't think for a second our beloved CBO isn't constantly scouring the databases for next year's Rasmussen or Kittredge or Nick Anderson or Pagan, etc., etc.

 

That still doesn’t support the ridiculous notion that the Sox are Tampa North until Bloom signs a big money closer. And passing on Hendricks or any other reliever last winter probably had more to do with not worrying about the game behind Sale until the Sox had Sale back. Not to mention, is Hendricks really the ideal choice here? He’s good, but he’s paid like he’s great. And paying good players like they’re great doesn’t make them great, but it does bump your payroll up against the tax threshold and prevent you from spending elsewhere.

 

I’d rather Bloom extended Devers and/or Bogaerts than bring in some Liam Hendricks type.

 

And the way you cite the methods that find Kittedge/Anderson, etc. makes it sound contemptuous. I’d rather have a CBO capable of finding talent no one else takes a chance on than one whose baseball acumen is limited solely to writing large checks. Money runs out sometimes…

Edited September 28, 2021 by notin

[Bellhorn04]

Fans should be more loyal to the players too. Loyalty is a 2 way street.

 

But fans aren't loyal to the players. This forum makes that obvious. The emotional fans heap abuse on them for playing bad in a particular game. The rational fans talk about how they can be replaced cheaper next year.

 

Am I wrong about that?

[jad]

But fans aren't loyal to the players. This forum makes that obvious. The emotional fans heap abuse on them for playing bad in a particular game. The rational fans talk about how they can be replaced cheaper next year.

 

Am I wrong about that?

 

I'm not sure there is any coherent entity "the fans." Nor that they can be divided into those categories. I assume a lot of us older fans who developed our silly sports enthusiasm before free agency are used to following particular players for years, and carry that over into today's sports. I.e., we like certain players and follow them, for better or worse. I will always root for Betts, JBJ, Hembree and players I happened to like (for whatever reason), and root generally against, say, ex-RS I didn't like (can't think ... ok, Price, although my feelings about him have changed after his paying the minor leaguers out of his own wallet). So I suppose that makes me irrational (of course! there is nothing that bores me more than fantasy sports, competitive GM-ing, salary cap machinations). But I never heap abuse on players I like who have bad games.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm not sure there is any coherent entity "the fans." Nor that they can be divided into those categories. I assume a lot of us older fans who developed our silly sports enthusiasm before free agency are used to following particular players for years, and carry that over into today's sports. I.e., we like certain players and follow them, for better or worse. I will always root for Betts, JBJ, Hembree and players I happened to like (for whatever reason), and root generally against, say, ex-RS I didn't like (can't think ... ok, Price, although my feelings about him have changed after his paying the minor leaguers out of his own wallet). So I suppose that makes me irrational (of course! there is nothing that bores me more than fantasy sports, competitive GM-ing, salary cap machinations). But I never heap abuse on players I like who have bad games.

 

You're right, I'm generalizing. I'm not talking about every single fan. But I do think you get a decent feel for the way fans think on forums like this.

 

My point is mainly about Betts and how I don't blame him for not having any 'loyalty' to the Red Sox.

 

If there is a two-way street, it's a cold-blooded one, IMHO.

 

Players want money.

 

Fans want performance.

[moonslav59]

You're right, I'm generalizing. I'm not talking about every single fan. But I do think you get a decent feel for the way fans think on forums like this.

 

My point is mainly about Betts and how I don't blame him for not having any 'loyalty' to the Red Sox.

 

If there is a two-way street, it's a cold-blooded one, IMHO.

 

Players want money.

 

Fans want performance.

 

100%

 

Plus, the players who make the most money are usually the ones who get boo'd more often and more loudly.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

And the way you cite the methods that find Kittedge/Anderson, etc. makes it sound contemptuous. I’d rather have a CBO capable of finding talent no one else takes a chance on than one whose baseball acumen is limited solely to writing large checks. Money runs out sometimes…

 

Sorry if I confused anyone with my inflection of typed black words on a white screen. Hopefully these points will be clear: I am against spending big money on established relievers, who in my opinion are the most unpredictable players of all big league positions; I admire the way the Rays have emphasized the constant pursuit of young pitching depth; someday I'll even approve of the Angels selecting pitchers in the first 13 rounds of the 2021 Draft. Like most fans, I'm really looking forward to our CBO investing some big market budget on good starting pitching.

 

However, I am not in favor of trading star homegrown fan favorites about to enter their primes. I still hate that Bloom traded Mookie, but understand he had no choice. I'd like to see Boston keep Bogaerts as a lifetime Red Sox, unless he insists on being a shortstop for his entire career. And I certainly hope Bloom will extend and build around Devers, because even though he swings at everything, few batters in the majors or team history have ever been able to do so much damage to so many pitches all over and near the strike zone.

[Bellhorn04]

However, I am not in favor of trading star homegrown fan favorites about to enter their primes. I still hate that Bloom traded Mookie, but understand he had no choice. I'd like to see Boston keep Bogaerts as a lifetime Red Sox, unless he insists on being a shortstop for his entire career. And I certainly hope Bloom will extend and build around Devers, because even though he swings at everything, few batters in the majors or team history have ever been able to do so much damage to so many pitches all over and near the strike zone.

 

Much of the talk about Bogaerts and Devers on this forum is about their mediocre to bad defense.

 

Mookie was that extreme rarity, a complete player.

[moonslav59]

Sorry if I confused anyone with my inflection of typed black words on a white screen. Hopefully these points will be clear: I am against spending big money on established relievers, who in my opinion are the most unpredictable players of all big league positions; I admire the way the Rays have emphasized the constant pursuit of young pitching depth; someday I'll even approve of the Angels selecting pitchers in the first 13 rounds of the 2021 Draft. Like most fans, I'm really looking forward to our CBO investing some big market budget on good starting pitching.

 

However, I am not in favor of trading star homegrown fan favorites about to enter their primes. I still hate that Bloom traded Mookie, but understand he had no choice. I'd like to see Boston keep Bogaerts as a lifetime Red Sox, unless he insists on being a shortstop for his entire career. And I certainly hope Bloom will extend and build around Devers, because even though he swings at everything, few batters in the majors or team history have ever been able to do so much damage to so many pitches all over and near the strike zone.

 

I seriously doubt Bogey agrees to move off SS, and the Sox may not want to do that anyway, at least for a few more years.

 

I hope we lock up Devers long time, but Bogey is a tough call. I'd make him a fair offer, and if he says no, I might see what we can get for him.

 

I'd also ask around about Vaz before taking his $7M contract option.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Much of the talk about Bogaerts and Devers on this forum is about their mediocre to bad defense.

 

Mookie was that extreme rarity, a complete player.

 

Rafie is a rarity with the bat and at 24 too young to give up on because of hot corner issues; Miggy Cabrera was once a third baseman. X is someone who loves Boston and hopefully doesn't sour on the franchise. Pedro was right when he said fans have been seeing Hall of Fame production out of this duo the past three years.

 

Some fans may perceive Mookie as greedy for wanting a contract at the top of his market, but it's hard to argue his overall value as an all-around player. I've never been a fan who feared how much a superstar's contract will "limit" his club's chances to field a contender. If big market teams can't afford great players, then who can? An owner that wants to win needs to hire a front office that can make it happen.

[oldtimer]

In my opinion, Bogaerts is the most consistent and best hitter on the team. His defensive issue is primarily his reduced range. It looks like Marcelo Mayer will be ready to make the club in late 2023 or 2024. until then, Bogie could remain our shortstop but after that perhaps he could move to second or third. I hope he can be signed with that understanding.

 

Devers is more of a natural hitter with great hand-eye coordination. He does swing at a lot of balls out of the strike zone. Will he get better plate discipline as he ages? That is not a given. His defensive issues are major and are due to his inconsistency and sloppiness. I don't see there is another position for him so we either accept his error prone ways in order to get his offensive production or we trade him. I expect we will keep him and hope he becomes more of a complete player.