A Realistic View at 2021: Part III

[mvp 78]

The team, unfortunately, was due for some correction in terms of W-L. IMO, it had nothing to do with the trade deadline. That said, the 'correction' has gone to the other extreme. The Sox should realistically be .500 in the month of August, not 6-11.

 

We're going to get some of that good ol' positive regression.

[mvp 78]

I respected Manny as a great hitter and was in awe of how many dead grandmothers Manny had.

 

It takes a village to raise a Manny.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

It takes a village to raise a Manny.

 

Lol!

[Fan_since_Boggs]

To place it in context: (1) Schwarber has always been a no-field DH type, he can’t even play LF very well, and he has almost no experience at 1b. Why should we assume that that kind of player would make a seamless transition to 1b? (2) The Arroyo move to 1b didn’t go very well and the Red Sox could have learned something from that experience but apparently didn’t. (3) In acquiring Schwarber the Red Sox knowingly traded for an injured player and so using an injury as an excuse for not adequately addressing 1b at the trade deadline seems disingenuous to me. Injured players can always reaggravate an injury, that isn’t difficult to fathom.

 

If Bloom couldn’t see potential trouble on the horizon with the idea of moving an injured K.Schwarber to 1b then he probably doesn’t deserve to be the GM of the Red Sox or any organization for that matter. But I don’t think it is fair to blow the Red Sox’s trade deadline debacle out of proportion. General managers make mistakes at trade deadlines—it happens and we know it happens. To evaluate a general manager, we need to evaluate the whole picture rather than isolate one moment in time when the general manager failed to bring in adequate reinforcements.

 

I've been impressed with Bloom overall, even though I think he blew it at the 2021 trade deadline.

Edited August 19, 2021 by Fan_since_Boggs

[notin]

To place it in context: (1) Schwarber has always been a no-field DH type, he can’t even play LF very well, and he has almost no experience at 1b. Why should we assume that that kind of player would make a seamless transition to 1b? (2) The Arroyo move to 1b didn’t go very well and the Red Sox could have learned something from that experience but apparently didn’t. (3) In acquiring Schwarber the Red Sox knowingly traded for an injured player and so using an injury as an excuse for not adequately addressing 1b at the trade deadline seems disingenuous to me. Injured players can always reaggravate an injury, that isn’t difficult to fathom.

 

If Bloom couldn’t see potential trouble on the horizon with the idea of moving an injured K.Schwarber to 1b then he probably doesn’t deserve to be the GM of the Red Sox or any organization for that matter. But I don’t think it is fair to blow the Red Sox’s trade deadline debacle out of proportion. General managers make mistakes at trade deadlines—it happens and we know it happens. To evaluate a general manager, we need to evaluate the whole picture rather than isolate one moment in time when the general manager failed to bring in adequate reinforcements.

 

I've been impressed with Bloom overall, even though I think he blew it at the trade deadline.

 

I was wondering that day if the acquisition of Schwarber was done so because the Sox wanted to see what they d could get for Duran.

[mvp 78]

I was wondering that day if the acquisition of Schwarber was done so because the Sox wanted to see what they d could get for Duran.

 

Couldn't they see what they could get for Duran without having to trade for Schwarber?

[notin]

Couldn't they see what they could get for Duran without having to trade for Schwarber?

 

 

Yes, but Schwarber would have allowed them to move Verdugo to CF permanently, which was important with Arroyo out and Kike needed at 2b

 

It also gave them a Plan B (Schwarber to 1b) if no satisfying trade for Duran could be found…

[mvp 78]

Yes, but Schwarber would have allowed them to move Verdugo to CF permanently, which was important with Arroyo out and Kike needed at 2b

 

It also gave them a Plan B (Schwarber to 1b) if no satisfying trade for Duran could be found…

 

Why would anyone want Verdugo in CF permanently. Now THAT would be torture.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

LIke maybe they were working on doing something like Schwarber for LF, Verdugo to CF, and trade Duran to the Twins for Berrios or something like that but then the Blue Jays increased their offer. That's very possible, maybe the Red Sox were aiming high but then the Duran deal fell apart, and they still saw the value in acquiring Schwarber.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Why would anyone want Verdugo in CF permanently. Now THAT would be torture.

 

Verdugo can't play CF permanently, not good enough defensively? If that is the case, then Duran is definitely needed.

 

I just hope the Red Sox resign Schwarber, I want him here for next several years. The Red Sox need his plate discipline.

Edited August 19, 2021 by Fan_since_Boggs

[Kimmi]

Merloni has said as much previously.

 

I don't buy into that argument, but he's a former MLBer.

 

I do believe that acquiring a player can provide a spark to a team. I'm not so sure about it the other way though when the team had been playing very well and they knew they were getting Sale, Houck, and Schwarber. I think the team believes in itself more than that.

[mvp 78]

Verdugo can't play CF permanently, not good enough defensively? If that is the case, then Duran is definitely needed.

 

Duran should be starting almost every day. Otherwise, he should be in AAA.

[Kimmi]

We're going to get some of that good ol' positive regression.

 

^^Good stuff.

[moonslav59]

To place it in context: (1) Schwarber has always been a no-field DH type, he can’t even play LF very well, and he has almost no experience at 1b. Why should we assume that that kind of player would make a seamless transition to 1b? (2) The Arroyo move to 1b didn’t go very well and the Red Sox could have learned something from that experience but apparently didn’t. (3) In acquiring Schwarber the Red Sox knowingly traded for an injured player and so using an injury as an excuse for not adequately addressing 1b at the trade deadline seems disingenuous to me. Injured players can always reaggravate an injury, that isn’t difficult to fathom.

 

If Bloom couldn’t see potential trouble on the horizon with the idea of moving an injured K.Schwarber to 1b then he probably doesn’t deserve to be the GM of the Red Sox or any organization for that matter. But I don’t think it is fair to blow the Red Sox’s trade deadline debacle out of proportion. General managers make mistakes at trade deadlines—it happens and we know it happens. To evaluate a general manager, we need to evaluate the whole picture rather than isolate one moment in time when the general manager failed to bring in adequate reinforcements.

 

I've been impressed with Bloom overall, even though I think he blew it at the 2021 trade deadline.

 

Nobody said or assumed a "seamless" transition to 1B by Schwarber.

 

I think they expected he could play there 10-15 days after the trade- well or not. I mean, why start caring about 1B D, now?.

 

The groin injury may have ended up preventing any chance at 1B, at least for 17-25 days.

 

It didn't work out. That doesn't mean Bloom knew he'd never play 1B.

[mvp 78]

I do believe that acquiring a player can provide a spark to a team. I'm not so sure about it the other way though when the team had been playing very well and they knew they were getting Sale, Houck, and Schwarber. I think the team believes in itself more than that.

 

I believe Merloni extensively ripped the Sox in 2019 and blames the end of the season on the lack of deadline moves.

 

@WEEI

Lou Merloni sounds off on Red Sox not making deadline deal: 'Dave Dombrowski just quit on his baseball team'

 

@NBCSBoston

"I would be disgusted hearing my GM say 'we're not going to do anything contradictory to our goals' & start talking about the CBT"

 

A fired up @LouMerloni on how much blame Bloom deserves for what's happening with the Red Sox

[mvp 78]

Nobody said or assumed a "seamless" transition to 1B by Schwarber.

 

I think they expected he could play there 10-15 days after the trade- well or not. I mean, why start caring about 1B D, now?.

 

The groin injury may have ended up preventing any chance at 1B, at least for 17-25 days.

 

It didn't work out. That doesn't mean Bloom knew he'd never play 1B.

 

Why underestimate the risk in trading for a guy on the IL?

[moonslav59]

Why would anyone want Verdugo in CF permanently. Now THAT would be torture.

 

At the start of the year, many posters were happy with Verdugo in CF. Some, like me, thought we'd see Renfroe/Cordero in LF, Kike in CF and Verdugo in RF.

 

I totally misjudged Renfroe's RF abilities.

[moonslav59]

I believe Merloni extensively ripped the Sox in 2019 and blames the end of the season on the lack of deadline moves.

 

@WEEI

Lou Merloni sounds off on Red Sox not making deadline deal: 'Dave Dombrowski just quit on his baseball team'

 

@NBCSBoston

"I would be disgusted hearing my GM say 'we're not going to do anything contradictory to our goals' & start talking about the CBT"

 

A fired up @LouMerloni on how much blame Bloom deserves for what's happening with the Red Sox

 

Is Merloni some kind of expert?

[Bellhorn04]

Why underestimate the risk in trading for a guy on the IL?

 

Plus they had Arroyo injure his hammy in one game at first.

[moonslav59]

Why underestimate the risk in trading for a guy on the IL?

 

Hindsight does not mean he "underestimated" anything.

 

Do guys on the IL get a new injury more than often non IL guy?

 

[mvp 78]

At the start of the year, many posters were happy with Verdugo in CF. Some, like me, thought we'd see Renfroe/Cordero in LF, Kike in CF and Verdugo in RF.

 

I totally misjudged Renfroe's RF abilities.

 

The more we see Verdugo, the more I don't want to see him in CF. Kiké is good there, like you suggested. Renfroe is great in RF. Verdugo can hang out in LF and try to replicate Mike Greenwell.

[mvp 78]

Hindsight does not mean he "underestimated" anything.

 

Do guys on the IL get a new injury more than often non IL guy?

 

 

I think you are more likely to reinjure or have a major setback if you are working your way back from the IL than if you are just a regular healthy player.

[mvp 78]

Is Merloni some kind of expert?

 

No, but he's a big proponent of the "lack of deadline moves affect player morale" idea.

[notin]

No, but he's a big proponent of the "lack of deadline moves affect player morale" idea.

 

Yeah it really lit a fire under the Blue Jays…

[mvp 78]

Yeah it really lit a fire under the Blue Jays…

 

Their winning % has gone up since the trade deadline. The Red Sox % has dropped.

 

I don't think morale has anything to do with it.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Maybe it wasn't "poor management" at all.

 

I'm curious what all these people thought we should have given up for enough players to have made this team into a ring winner.

 

To get Scherzer or some other big name player, we'd have had to sacrifice a big chunk of the farm? Not doing that was "GOOD" management, not poor.

 

To get another moderate or minor piece to play 1B or bolster the pen might or might not have been enough to make a difference,

 

 

Getting one good reliever that Cora could actually trust in high leverage could've made a difference. The rest of the bullpen would've been fortified, and thus better rested. Barnes wouldn't be used on back-to-back days, which we all know is never a good idea. The Sox could very well have a few more victories today and be in a stronger position to make the playoffs.

 

It wouldn't have made Boston the WS favorite, but certainly more favored to qualify for the crapshoot... The cost would've been better prospects than what was exchanged for Robles and Davis, but would it have really ruined the future of the franchise?

[Bellhorn04]

No, but he's a big proponent of the "lack of deadline moves affect player morale" idea.

 

And the 2021 Red Sox are helping his case.

 

The idea is not without merit. Bloom did as much as say this is a first place team not worth investing further in.

[notin]

And the 2021 Red Sox are helping his case.

 

The idea is not without merit. Bloom did as much as say this is a first place team not worth investing further in.

 

Or … he said “the mediocre players that were the best we could get for our best prospects just weren’t worth it.” It really depends on how you read into it.

[mvp 78]

And the 2021 Red Sox are helping his case.

 

The idea is not without merit. Bloom did as much as say this is a first place team not worth investing further in.

 

I'm not sure he said exactly that. He said that the deals at the deadline were cost prohibitive and he did everything he could to stay under the luxury tax and not negatively impact the future of the ballclub.

[notin]

Their winning % has gone up since the trade deadline. The Red Sox % has dropped.

 

I don't think morale has anything to do with it.

 

Check out the strength of schedule since, and factor in two lucky wins off Barnes.

 

My point is that the “morale” thing is a myth. Some players might care, but there are very few broad brushes that can be applied to everyone.

 

Not to mention, the losing started a couple days earlier…