And the off season begins (2018-19)

[notin]

Going the cheap route might not be the best way to defend a championship.

 

It’s not.

 

If the team is that strapped against the budget, maybe Eovaldi wasn’t the best idea...

[Larry Cook]

Wasn’t the bullpen the Achilles heel of dombrowski’s Detroit teams?

[Kimmi]

Some candidates might include:

 

Hunter Strickland

Sergio Rimo

Brad Boxberger

Ryan Madsen

Brad Brach

Brandon Maurer

Blake Parker

Greg Holland

Jim Johnson

Matt Bush

 

Any others?

 

I can't think of any other candidates, but there are plenty of options available that won't cost a fortune. The task is to find the Brasiers and the Okajimas of the world.

[Kimmi]

Going the cheap route might not be the best way to defend a championship.

 

Going cheap does not mean going ineffective.

[cp176]

It’s not.

 

If the team is that strapped against the budget, maybe Eovaldi wasn’t the best idea...

 

I don't think that going the cheap route is necessarily the plan no matter what it sounds like. I think that he is apt to go the practical route and not overpay for a relief pitcher. Looks like he is waiting for the relief pitching market to settle down. I don't think that I am going to criticize him showing patience. I think that the Dodgers overpaid for Kelly. I think that he will sign a significant piece before long. Might even be Kimbrel. Who knows.

[Bellhorn04]

Going the cheap route might not be the best way to defend a championship.

 

It’s not.

 

If the team is that strapped against the budget, maybe Eovaldi wasn’t the best idea...

 

I'm not convinced that DD has decided not to spend another nickel on the bullpen...I'll believe it if I see it on Opening Day.

 

There's another story floating around that the Sox are still in contact with Kimbrel, after all...

[cp176]

I'm not convinced that DD has decided not to spend another nickel on the bullpen...I'll believe it if I see it on Opening Day.

 

There's another story floating around that the Sox are still in contact with Kimbrel, after all...

 

I saw Kimbrel's name mentioned as well - you never know. I'm happy for Kelly but I'm glad he didn't sign that contract with Boston.

 

I also read those comments by DD about what he thinks about the "cliff" theorists and the disappearing "window". I think that I get it finally. There is one for sure with this core of players. I think that that is what needs to be emphasized. He doesn't think though that the winning stops as you lose some of this core. I like that (although everybody here knows that I am a lover of all things DD - lol)

[oldtimer]

I saw Kimbrel's name mentioned as well - you never know. I'm happy for Kelly but I'm glad he didn't sign that contract with Boston.

 

I also read those comments by DD about what he thinks about the "cliff" theorists and the disappearing "window". I think that I get it finally. There is one for sure with this core of players. I think that that is what needs to be emphasized. He doesn't think though that the winning stops as you lose some of this core. I like that (although everybody here knows that I am a lover of all things DD - lol)

 

The idea of a cliff when we lose some of our assets is a reasonable concern but we do have first base candidates in the minors so losing Moreland won't be felt that much. If we were to lose Bogie, that would hurt as CJ Chatam is all we have in the minors. He could be a quality defensive player and a decent hitter, but without a lot of power. The presumption is we lose players because we don't want to pay what the FA market will offer them, making a minor league substitute more likely. JBJ is another who we may have to replace and our best minor league defensive fielder (Cole Brennan) has yet to show he can hit enough to be in the mix.

 

Starting pitching is where we will likely be hurting. Sale and Porcello will possibly be gone and Price getting toward the end of his effectiveness. Lots of concern, but DD has shown himself to be up to the task of filling holes with quality players.

[cp176]

The idea of a cliff when we lose some of our assets is a reasonable concern but we do have first base candidates in the minors so losing Moreland won't be felt that much. If we were to lose Bogie, that would hurt as CJ Chatam is all we have in the minors. He could be a quality defensive player and a decent hitter, but without a lot of power. The presumption is we lose players because we don't want to pay what the FA market will offer them, making a minor league substitute more likely. JBJ is another who we may have to replace and our best minor league defensive fielder (Cole Brennan) has yet to show he can hit enough to be in the mix.

 

Starting pitching is where we will likely be hurting. Sale and Porcello will possibly be gone and Price getting toward the end of his effectiveness. Lots of concern, but DD has shown himself to be up to the task of filling holes with quality players.

 

There will be challenges for sure but I don't think that from the sounds anyway that our ownership and management have any intention of backing off the pedal of success. I think that we are in good hands and I look forward actually to how these guys will successfully handle all of the many challenges that people here are so concerned about as we move forward.

[moonslav59]

The big issue is the budget. Does DD have the authority to go past the $40M mark or even go over by a little?

 

If yes, he can spend a little on a FA pen arm and maybe trade a couple out of options guys like Johnson, Swihart or Hembree for a better pen arm than we have now.

 

If we have only $4-5M to spend, then we may be looking to save it for mid season needs and try to fill a pen role via trade that does not add salary or better yet, lowers it.

[notin]

I'm not convinced that DD has decided not to spend another nickel on the bullpen...I'll believe it if I see it on Opening Day.

 

There's another story floating around that the Sox are still in contact with Kimbrel, after all...

 

It’s not that he is done spending on the bullpen; he just isn’t chasing longer 8 figure deals right now.

 

MLBTR reported the Sox only offered Kelly 2 years and a lower AAV than Los Angeles, and commented that this does lend support to earlier reports about DD not spending heavy on relievers...

[notin]

Sergio Romo and Brad Brach combined to make $7.7mill and returned a combined 1.2 fWAR. Kimbrel and Kelly combined for 2.2 fWAR.

 

If payroll is a concern, the drop off isn’t as much as one might expect.

 

Of corse, Romo’s arm could fall off any second now...

[Fan_since_Boggs]

I guess you guys didn't read Eric Van's posts (on soxprospects) in which he argued that B.Johnson was a middle-of-the rotation starter. I went back to look for his posts on this topic, but couldn't find them. I don't remember his arguments, but I do remember his arguments convinced me. LOL.

 

Teams that are looking for rotation depth and a potential starting catcher should have interest in Brian Johnson and B.Swihart. They are cheap, under team control for a few more years, and could develop into useful contributors. The Red Sox don't have room for them. As such, I would like to see Dombrowski trade Johnson and Swihart for something useful like a quality Doiuble A prospect (CF would be nice). I suppose Dombrowski could shop them for a cost-controlled relief pitcher, but there are so many relief pitchers on the market. I would rather spend some money on relief pitching and deal Swihart and Johnson for a prospect. Moreover, Lakins is guy who could make a big contribution to the bullpen in 2019.

 

The Red Sox could hold on to Johnson for another year but with depth like Velazquez and Shawaryn, he isn't needed. And it is pretty clear that the Red Sox prefer defensive catchers over Swihart, a guy with a better bat.

[cp176]

It’s not that he is done spending on the bullpen; he just isn’t chasing longer 8 figure deals right now.

 

MLBTR reported the Sox only offered Kelly 2 years and a lower AAV than Los Angeles, and commented that this does lend support to earlier reports about DD not spending heavy on relievers...

 

But didn't they in that some note mention that the Kimbrel still might end up back in Boston?

[Bellhorn04]

The Red Sox could hold on to Johnson for another year but with depth like Velazquez and Shawaryn, he isn't needed.

 

But the way teams go through pitchers, he MIGHT be needed. Hang onto him unless you can really get something worthwhile back.

[dgalehouse]

Still too early in the hot stove season to come to any conclusions on Sox spending. So far , from last year's champs , we brought back Eovaldi, lost Kelly and probably lose Kimbrel. We did acquire Gorkys Hernandez and Tony Renda . Not exactly household names , but just the sort of depth ( ham and egger ) signings that many fans love. Stay tuned. Edited December 16, 2018 by dgalehouse

[moonslav59]

But the way teams go through pitchers, he MIGHT be needed. Hang onto him unless you can really get something worthwhile back.

 

True.

 

Teams often need 8, 9 or 10 different starters.

 

This year, we used 11, but only 9 had 4 or more starts.

 

In 2017, we used 10 starters, 8 with 4 or more.

 

In 2016, 10 and 9.

 

2015, 12 and 9.

 

Seems like 8 or 9 is the true number for starters you might need to give you 4 or more starts.

 

[dgalehouse]

True.

 

Teams often need 8, 9 or 10 different starters.

 

This year, we used 11, but only 9 had 4 or more starts.

 

In 2017, we used 10 starters, 8 with 4 or more.

 

In 2016, 10 and 9.

 

2015, 12 and 9.

 

Seems like 8 or 9 is the true number for starters you might need to give you 4 or more starts.

 

 

You don't want to stockpile too many mediocrities. Can always go with a bullpen game here and there.

[notin]

I

You don't want to stockpile too many mediocrities. Can always go with a bullpen game here and there.

 

Why not? There’s no rule that you have to use them all.

 

The more mediocrities you have, the more likely one of them works out...

[notin]

You don't want to stockpile too many mediocrities. Can always go with a bullpen game here and there.

 

Not to mention, using just the bullpen is an awful idea. Using an AAAA starter might cost you one game. Using multiple relievers to cover 9 innings might cost you two or three...

[dgalehouse]

Not to mention, using just the bullpen is an awful idea. Using an AAAA starter might cost you one game. Using multiple relievers to cover 9 innings might cost you two or three...

 

I don't know . The bullpen game thing seems to be catching on.

[notin]

I don't know . The bullpen game thing seems to be catching on.

 

Only in Tampa, where they can’t afford starting pitching...

[d-money]

Haven’t been excited this offseason. This team has to make a couple of more moves.

[notin]

Haven’t been excited this offseason. This team has to make a couple of more moves.

 

Hey last year at this time, all the Sox had done was bring back Mitch Moreland. And it stayed that way for several more weeks...

[Bellhorn04]

Haven’t been excited this offseason. This team has to make a couple of more moves.

 

If you didn't like them re-signing Pearce and Eovaldi, I don't know what to tell ya.

[notin]

If you didn't like them re-signing Pearce and Eovaldi, I don't know what to tell ya.

 

Don’t forget about Gorkys...

[SoxnCycles]

It’s not.

 

If the team is that strapped against the budget, maybe Eovaldi wasn’t the best idea...

 

Yup, if the deal hamstrings them in other areas, or forces them to trade one or more young position players, it's going to go from a so-so contract to a bad none.

[Bellhorn04]

Yup, if the deal hamstrings them in other areas, or forces them to trade one or more young position players, it's going to go from a so-so contract to a bad none.

 

It might be an excellent contract too. Every possibility is in play.

 

There is so much rumor and speculation floating around out there about the Sox plans...but it wouldn't be the offseason if there wasn't.

[fxkatt]

The only soon-move that I can see happening is for a relief pitcher. I think once one top guy goes, all the topsters go, and that could happen at any moment. Once the price is set, we either jump, or bide our time and hustle up someone who can be a piece of our relief puzzle.

[oldtimer]

The only soon-move that I can see happening is for a relief pitcher. I think once one top guy goes, all the topsters go, and that could happen at any moment. Once the price is set, we either jump, or bide our time and hustle up someone who can be a piece of our relief puzzle.

 

The catcher situation will also be clarified soon.