A Realistic View at 2017 Part III

[Kimmi]

I like the Bal-NY set up, one of them HAS to lose 4 games.

 

I don't like either team, but going with the lesser of 2 evils, I hope the Os sweep.

[moonslav59]

Most HRs in Sox system

 

30 Chavis

30 Brentz

28 Devers

24 Barfield

21 HRam

18 Moreland, Beni, Betts

16 Olt

15 Castillo

14 JBJ, Baldwin, Semo

13 Ockimey, J Betts, R Scott, M Dominguez

11 Dalbec, Selsky, Bogusevic

 

RBI

89 Chavis

82 Brentz

78 Betts

77 Devers

75 Ryan Scott

72 Beni & Ockimey

69 Barfield

65 Baldwin

63 Moreland

62 Dominguez

 

[Behindenemylines]

Most HRs in Sox system

 

30 Chavis

30 Brentz

28 Devers

24 Barfield

21 HRam

18 Moreland, Beni, Betts

16 Olt

15 Castillo

14 JBJ, Baldwin, Semo

13 Ockimey, J Betts, R Scott, M Dominguez

11 Dalbec, Selsky, Bogusevic

 

RBI

89 Chavis

82 Brentz

78 Betts

77 Devers

75 Ryan Scott

72 Beni & Ockimey

69 Barfield

65 Baldwin

63 Moreland

62 Dominguez

 

 

These numbers show how much the Sox miss Big Papi! The 2018 version of the Sox need some power bats at 1B and DH. I'm tried of C Young and Hanley seeing so many ABs in these to spots.

[oldtimer]

Sept 1st. Time to take stock. We have a 4 1/2 game lead in the east. We have done that largely with Excellent starting pitching, very good relief pitching 4 or 5 deep, good defense and team speed. Our hitting and run scoring has been below average. Are we vulnerable at this point and if so why?

 

I'd say we are and wouldn't use the excuse of injury, as all teams face similar issues there. Some of our key problems stem from a few key are:

 

Hard Luxury Cap Limit

 

Whille other teams have been able to spend to add power bats and pitching, we have clearly had a mandate to stay below the limit. DD has made some astute moves to pick up Nunez, Fister and Reed and to a lesser extent Davis, all have been with the cap limit in mind. Had that not been true, Castillo would have been brought up instead of going to Davis.

 

Bad Luck with Acquisitions

 

Thornburg and Smith might have helped us a great deal had we gotten their us earlier. So maybe we get something from Smith this year and Thornburgh next. Its either bad luck or lack of due diligence.

 

Underperformance of Key Sox Players

 

While Beni, Moreland, Hanley (now), JBJ, Devers, Pedey, Vaz and Nunez have done as well or better than expected and Leon has done probably close to what we should have expected both Bogey and Betts have not been able to hit even close to what has been hoped for. Bogey looked totally lost at the plate in the seconnd half while Betts hasn't been able to adjust to the way he is being pitched. With the outside part of the plate being targeted, he pops up or hits to center where his balls in play are being caught. Bogey's defense is average while Betts is A+. Without these two hitting we are not going to strike fear into anyone. Is our coaching deficient? Or, are the guys just not as good as we had hoped?

 

Farrell's Moves

 

Is Farrell so constrained by what he has available that he is unable to make moves that might help the club? His bench has proven to be very weak and the Sox have chosen to keep only three players on it with extra pitching instead. Was he instrumental in holding Devers back for as long as they did? And what about placing Bogey and Betts in the middle of the lineup and using Young. Seems to me he continues to try to do the same thing while expecting different results. Maybe there is no better solution as we are so limited with our minors. We will get Pedey and JBJ back very soon and that should help our flexibility. We will see if JF is willing to make moves with the return of those two and also whether the call ups will reflect a need to where we are currently weak.

[Nick]

Fans were ready to give out 10 year $300M and $250M contracts to Betts and Xander. That would be the biggest mistake we can make. Let the arbitration years go by and PAY WHAT THEY ARE WORTH when that time comes. Can we get over this 'home team discount' concept? Pay for Value, regardless of where that Value originated.

[Bellhorn04]

Sept 1st. Time to take stock. We have a 4 1/2 game lead in the east. We have done that largely with Excellent starting pitching, very good relief pitching 4 or 5 deep, good defense and team speed. Our hitting and run scoring has been below average. Are we vulnerable at this point and if so why?

 

I'd say we are and wouldn't use the excuse of injury, as all teams face similar issues there. Some of our key problems stem from a few key are:

 

Hard Luxury Cap Limit

 

Whille other teams have been able to spend to add power bats and pitching, we have clearly had a mandate to stay below the limit. DD has made some astute moves to pick up Nunez, Fister and Reed and to a lesser extent Davis, all have been with the cap limit in mind. Had that not been true, Castillo would have been brought up instead of going to Davis.

 

Bad Luck with Acquisitions

 

Thornburg and Smith might have helped us a great deal had we gotten their us earlier. So maybe we get something from Smith this year and Thornburgh next. Its either bad luck or lack of due diligence.

 

Underperformance of Key Sox Players

 

While Beni, Moreland, Hanley (now), JBJ, Devers, Pedey, Vaz and Nunez have done as well or better than expected and Leon has done probably close to what we should have expected both Bogey and Betts have not been able to hit even close to what has been hoped for. Bogey looked totally lost at the plate in the seconnd half while Betts hasn't been able to adjust to the way he is being pitched. With the outside part of the plate being targeted, he pops up or hits to center where his balls in play are being caught. Bogey's defense is average while Betts is A+. Without these two hitting we are not going to strike fear into anyone. Is our coaching deficient? Or, are the guys just not as good as we had hoped?

 

Farrell's Moves

 

Is Farrell so constrained by what he has available that he is unable to make moves that might help the club? His bench has proven to be very weak and the Sox have chosen to keep only three players on it with extra pitching instead. Was he instrumental in holding Devers back for as long as they did? And what about placing Bogey and Betts in the middle of the lineup and using Young. Seems to me he continues to try to do the same thing while expecting different results. Maybe there is no better solution as we are so limited with our minors. We will get Pedey and JBJ back very soon and that should help our flexibility. We will see if JF is willing to make moves with the return of those two and also whether the call ups will reflect a need to where we are currently weak.

 

Good stuff oldtimer.

[Bellhorn04]

Fans were ready to give out 10 year $300M and $250M contracts to Betts and Xander. That would be the biggest mistake we can make. Let the arbitration years go by and PAY WHAT THEY ARE WORTH when that time comes. Can we get over this 'home team discount' concept? Pay for Value, regardless of where that Value originated.

 

Xander's value is dropping by the day, locking him up is pretty much by the boards now.

 

Locking up Betts still makes sense though, I think, and I believe a 6 or 7 year offer is what is needed.

 

I do believe Mookie will figure it out on the offensive end. I have faith in him as a long term star.

 

If you let him get to free agency there's a good chance he's gone.

[moonslav59]

These numbers show how much the Sox miss Big Papi! The 2018 version of the Sox need some power bats at 1B and DH. I'm tried of C Young and Hanley seeing so many ABs in these to spots.

 

I am too, but HRam does lead the team in HRs, so there's that to ponder.

 

We have nobody else.

[moonslav59]

Sept 1st. Time to take stock. We have a 4 1/2 game lead in the east. We have done that largely with Excellent starting pitching, very good relief pitching 4 or 5 deep, good defense and team speed. Our hitting and run scoring has been below average. Are we vulnerable at this point and if so why?

 

I'd say we are and wouldn't use the excuse of injury, as all teams face similar issues there. Some of our key problems stem from a few key are:

 

Hard Luxury Cap Limit

 

Whille other teams have been able to spend to add power bats and pitching, we have clearly had a mandate to stay below the limit. DD has made some astute moves to pick up Nunez, Fister and Reed and to a lesser extent Davis, all have been with the cap limit in mind. Had that not been true, Castillo would have been brought up instead of going to Davis.

 

I'm not so sure the luxury tax implications is what has kept Castillo down. I think Brentz is a better choice than Rusney anyways.

 

 

Bad Luck with Acquisitions

 

Thornburg and Smith might have helped us a great deal had we gotten their us earlier. So maybe we get something from Smith this year and Thornburgh next. Its either bad luck or lack of due diligence.

 

Bad luck. Don't forget R Ross- one of our most consistent RP'ers for years.

 

 

.

Underperformance of Key Sox Players

 

While Beni, Moreland, Hanley (now), JBJ, Devers, Pedey, Vaz and Nunez have done as well or better than expected and Leon has done probably close to what we should have expected both Bogey and Betts have not been able to hit even close to what has been hoped for. Bogey looked totally lost at the plate in the seconnd half while Betts hasn't been able to adjust to the way he is being pitched. With the outside part of the plate being targeted, he pops up or hits to center where his balls in play are being caught. Bogey's defense is average while Betts is A+. Without these two hitting we are not going to strike fear into anyone. Is our coaching deficient? Or, are the guys just not as good as we had hoped?

 

To me, only Vaz has done better than expected. Moreland is close. Devers has a sample size too small to judge.

 

 

 

Farrell's Moves

 

Is Farrell so constrained by what he has available that he is unable to make moves that might help the club? His bench has proven to be very weak and the Sox have chosen to keep only three players on it with extra pitching instead. Was he instrumental in holding Devers back for as long as they did? And what about placing Bogey and Betts in the middle of the lineup and using Young. Seems to me he continues to try to do the same thing while expecting different results. Maybe there is no better solution as we are so limited with our minors. We will get Pedey and JBJ back very soon and that should help our flexibility. We will see if JF is willing to make moves with the return of those two and also whether the call ups will reflect a need to where we are currently weak.

 

I'm not going to be a broken record here. You guys know my views on JF.

[Maxbialystock]

Most HRs in Sox system

 

30 Chavis

30 Brentz

28 Devers

24 Barfield

21 HRam

18 Moreland, Beni, Betts

16 Olt

15 Castillo

14 JBJ, Baldwin, Semo

13 Ockimey, J Betts, R Scott, M Dominguez

11 Dalbec, Selsky, Bogusevic

 

RBI

89 Chavis

82 Brentz

78 Betts

77 Devers

75 Ryan Scott

72 Beni & Ockimey

69 Barfield

65 Baldwin

63 Moreland

62 Dominguez

 

 

Vintage. Classic. Simple but thought-provoking stats.

[illinoisredsox]

I don't like either team, but going with the lesser of 2 evils, I hope the Os sweep.

 

Despite my signature proclamation, with the Sox issues against both those teams this year, I want those 7 games going 4-3 one way or the other.

[Maxbialystock]

Sept 1st. Time to take stock. We have a 4 1/2 game lead in the east. We have done that largely with Excellent starting pitching, very good relief pitching 4 or 5 deep, good defense and team speed. Our hitting and run scoring has been below average. Are we vulnerable at this point and if so why?

 

I'd say we are and wouldn't use the excuse of injury, as all teams face similar issues there. Some of our key problems stem from a few key are:

 

Hard Luxury Cap Limit

 

Whille other teams have been able to spend to add power bats and pitching, we have clearly had a mandate to stay below the limit. DD has made some astute moves to pick up Nunez, Fister and Reed and to a lesser extent Davis, all have been with the cap limit in mind. Had that not been true, Castillo would have been brought up instead of going to Davis.

 

Bad Luck with Acquisitions

 

Thornburg and Smith might have helped us a great deal had we gotten their us earlier. So maybe we get something from Smith this year and Thornburgh next. Its either bad luck or lack of due diligence.

 

Underperformance of Key Sox Players

 

While Beni, Moreland, Hanley (now), JBJ, Devers, Pedey, Vaz and Nunez have done as well or better than expected and Leon has done probably close to what we should have expected both Bogey and Betts have not been able to hit even close to what has been hoped for. Bogey looked totally lost at the plate in the seconnd half while Betts hasn't been able to adjust to the way he is being pitched. With the outside part of the plate being targeted, he pops up or hits to center where his balls in play are being caught. Bogey's defense is average while Betts is A+. Without these two hitting we are not going to strike fear into anyone. Is our coaching deficient? Or, are the guys just not as good as we had hoped?

 

Farrell's Moves

 

Is Farrell so constrained by what he has available that he is unable to make moves that might help the club? His bench has proven to be very weak and the Sox have chosen to keep only three players on it with extra pitching instead. Was he instrumental in holding Devers back for as long as they did? And what about placing Bogey and Betts in the middle of the lineup and using Young. Seems to me he continues to try to do the same thing while expecting different results. Maybe there is no better solution as we are so limited with our minors. We will get Pedey and JBJ back very soon and that should help our flexibility. We will see if JF is willing to make moves with the return of those two and also whether the call ups will reflect a need to where we are currently weak.

 

Agree with others, good stuff, thanks. Like moonslav, I think the hitting has underperformed this year with Ortiz no doubt a factor. Blaming Farrell for the wrong lineups to me is silly. There is little or no compelling evidence, especially with this team, that where they are in the order makes a real difference. Betts, for example was terrific last year leading off. Great numbers. He was 2d on the team in rbi's and of course the clear leader in runs scored. Farrell has tried multiple lineups and combinations this year.

 

Holding Devers back??!! He's still 20 for crying out loud. Give me a break.

Edited September 1, 2017 by Maxbialystock

[moonslav59]

Dvers (.899) and Nunez (.895) are now below .900.

 

Here's the updated Sox OPS leader list:

 

.798 Beni- still nobody above .800

.791 Moreland- surprise, surprise!

.784 Pedey- welcome back

.777 Betts- sinking like a lead balloon.

.775 JBJ- welcome back Junior!

.772 HRam- blah

.749 Vaz- maybe the only true bright spot on O

.734 Bogey- talk about cliffs

.713 Young- I tried defending you, and look what we got!

.666 Leon- what a devil!

.484 Holt- time to put him at lead off again!

 

 

[Maxbialystock]

Dvers (.899) and Nunez (.895) are now below .900.

 

Here's the updated Sox OPS leader list:

 

.798 Beni- still nobody above .800

.791 Moreland- surprise, surprise!

.784 Pedey- welcome back

.777 Betts- sinking like a lead balloon.

.775 JBJ- welcome back Junior!

.772 HRam- blah

.749 Vaz- maybe the only true bright spot on O

.734 Bogey- talk about cliffs

.713 Young- I tried defending you, and look what we got!

.666 Leon- what a devil!

.484 Holt- time to put him at lead off again!

 

 

 

Great stuff.

[moonslav59]

Agree with others, good stuff, thanks. Like moonslav, I think the hitting has underperformed this year with Ortiz no doubt a factor. Blaming Farrell for the wrong lineups to me is silly. There is little or no compelling evidence, especially with this team, that where they are in the order makes a real difference. Betts, for example was terrific last year leading off. Great numbers. He was 2d on the team in rbi's and of course the clear leader in runs scored. Farrell has tried multiple lineups and combinations this year.

 

Holding Devers back??!! He's still 20 for crying out loud. Give me a break.

 

He put a sub .500 OPS guy leading off, not once, not twice, but 5 times!

 

'Nuff said.

[Bellhorn04]

He put a sub .500 OPS guy leading off, not once, not twice, but 5 times!

 

'Nuff said.

 

He doesn't go on tiny sample sizes.

[moonslav59]

He doesn't go on tiny sample sizes.

 

LOL. Good one.

 

Maybe JF should have tried Marrero at clean-up five times...small sample size!

[Bellhorn04]

LOL. Good one.

 

Maybe JF should have tried Marrero at clean-up five times...small sample size!

 

Marrero is a career black hole.

[moonslav59]

Marrero is a career black hole.

 

Yes, that's why I'm surprised JF never used DM in the 4 slot!

[moonslav59]

Pedey & Barnes activated. Swihart, Travis, Elias & Maddox called up. So far, Brentz has not been added to the 40 man.

[mvp 78]

Brentz will be up Sept 5th when the PawSox season ends. Shows you what they think of him though...

[moonslav59]

Brentz will be up Sept 5th when the PawSox season ends. Shows you what they think of him though...

 

Who gets axed off the 40 man?

 

Owens?

 

Martin?

 

Marrero?

 

[mvp 78]

Who gets axed off the 40 man?

 

Owens?

 

Martin?

 

Marrero?

 

 

Boyer

[mvp 78]

Also, if Elias is pitching, it's time to turn off the game. That's the white flag.

[illinoisredsox]

Who gets axed off the 40 man?

 

Owens?

 

Martin?

 

Marrero?

 

 

 

Won't be Owens; they are sending him to the Arizona Fall League. They aren't doing that with the intent of releasing him, at least as of now. Might be his last shot, though. If he shows nothing in the AFL, he's be gone by spring.

 

Johnson is going to the AFL as well, along with Chavis.

 

My guess would be Martin.

 

Lin and Marrero will be up Tuesday, as will Smith.

[oldtimer]

Brentz will be up Sept 5th when the PawSox season ends. Shows you what they think of him though...

 

heres what is said about the rules for call up.

 

What does Sept. 1 mean for postseason rosters?

If a player is to be eligible for a team's postseason roster, he must be in its organization as of 11:59 p.m. ET on Aug. 31. Specifically, players must be on the 40-man roster, the 60-day disabled list or the bereavement/family medical emergency list at that time.

[mvp 78]

heres what is said about the rules for call up.

 

What does Sept. 1 mean for postseason rosters?

If a player is to be eligible for a team's postseason roster, he must be in its organization as of 11:59 p.m. ET on Aug. 31. Specifically, players must be on the 40-man roster, the 60-day disabled list or the bereavement/family medical emergency list at that time.

 

However, if a club wants to add a player who was not on the 40-man roster but was in the organization, it can petition the Commissioner's Office if that player is replacing someone who has been on the 60-day DL for at least 60 days.

[moonslav59]

Won't be Owens; they are sending him to the Arizona Fall League. They aren't doing that with the intent of releasing him, at least as of now. Might be his last shot, though. If he shows nothing in the AFL, he's be gone by spring.

 

Johnson is going to the AFL as well, along with Chavis.

 

My guess would be Martin.

 

Lin and Marrero will be up Tuesday, as will Smith.

I thought Owens would be gone by Rule 5 day anyways!

[Kimmi]

Despite my signature proclamation, with the Sox issues against both those teams this year, I want those 7 games going 4-3 one way or the other.

 

Not me. I want the Yankees out. NOW!

[Kimmi]

LOL. Good one.

 

Maybe JF should have tried Marrero at clean-up five times...small sample size!

 

He could have put a weak hitting pitcher in the clean up spot all season and only cost the team about 15 (or was it 18?) runs.