A Realistic View at 2017 Part II

[a700hitter]

You went beyond disagreeing, and that's what I called you out on.

 

You said I "contradicted" myself and "back peddled". That's much more than disagreeing.

 

You were either wrong or you misunderstood my position. If there's a third choice, please explain...no better yet, let's just agree to disagree and move on from this battered topic.

Neither. There is a third choice. You are so smart. You figure it out.

[moonslav59]

Neither. There is a third choice. You are so smart. You figure it out.

 

More likely all of the above.

[a700hitter]

More likely all of the above.

You really can't figure it out. Not black and white enough for you?

[moonslav59]

Some possible trade targets...

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/06/top-50-trade-deadline-candidates-for-2017.html#

[moonslav59]

You really can't figure it out. Not black and white enough for you?

 

Yeah, I just don't understand what "neither", "contradict" and "back peddling" mean.

 

That must be it.

[moonslav59]

Some possible trade targets...

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/06/top-50-trade-deadline-candidates-for-2017.html#

 

3B:

#4 Lowrie (and 2B)

#17 T Frazier

 

DH:

#2 JD Martinez (OF)

#6 Yonder Alonso (1B)

#20 J Upton (OF)

 

SP:

#5 Quintana

#10 S. Gray

#33 L Lynn

T#37 E Volquez, C Richars, J Garcia, S Feldman

T#41 Samardzija, Cueto, G Cole, Verlander

T#45 E Santana

#48 M Estrada

 

[Nick]

Our hitters are cure for whatever ails mediocre pitchers.....Do we really want to pay Betts $30M per year?

[oldtimer]

I was unaware that Rutledge was put on the DL with concussion symptoms and that we brought up Tzu-Wei Lin, another small guy as a fill-in infielder. He has been in the minors for a few years and had a 302 average in Portland. Must be a decent fielder but Devers is sitting there while this happens.

[Emp9]

YEAH FARRELL!!!! That's what I want to see Some f***ing fire fcs!!! That call was ********

[a700hitter]

YEAH FARRELL!!!! That's what I want to see Some f***ing fire fcs!!! That call was ********

Farrell got his Irish up with that umpire -- nose to nose. he needs to turn the hat around so he can get closer. The spit was flying. I miss a good argument with an ump.

[moonslav59]

Our hitters are cure for whatever ails mediocre pitchers.....Do we really want to pay Betts $30M per year?

 

By the time Betts reaches free agency, $30M might be a steal.

[moonslav59]

Forget the talk of calling up Castillo for a short stint. Seems weird the rules would basically prevent a player from playing in the bigs for 3 years.

 

MLBTR...

 

Rusney Castillo is playing well at Triple-A but isn’t a likely candidate for a return to the majors for contractual reasons, the Boston Globe’s Alex Speier writes. Thanks to changes made in the new collective bargaining agreement, the Red Sox would have the average annual value of Castillo’s contract (around $10.4MM) counted on their luxury tax calculations through the end of the outfielder’s deal in 2020, even if they called up Castillo for even just one day or dealt him to another deal and ate part of the salary obligations. Between this financial cost and the Sox already being pretty set in the outfield, Castillo may not have a clear path back to the bigs at all for over three years.

[OH FOY]

He doesn't come off the books till 2020. Wow! Has to be the most expensive Minor leaguer in history, or close to it.

If Sale stays steady and Price or Porcello can turn it around, Hanley steps up his game we'll be fine for 2nd half.

Edited June 25, 2017 by OH FOY!

[Bellhorn04]

Forget the talk of calling up Castillo for a short stint. Seems weird the rules would basically prevent a player from playing in the bigs for 3 years.

 

MLBTR...

 

Rusney Castillo is playing well at Triple-A but isn’t a likely candidate for a return to the majors for contractual reasons, the Boston Globe’s Alex Speier writes. Thanks to changes made in the new collective bargaining agreement, the Red Sox would have the average annual value of Castillo’s contract (around $10.4MM) counted on their luxury tax calculations through the end of the outfielder’s deal in 2020, even if they called up Castillo for even just one day or dealt him to another deal and ate part of the salary obligations. Between this financial cost and the Sox already being pretty set in the outfield, Castillo may not have a clear path back to the bigs at all for over three years.

 

The whole situation is kind of sick, isn't it? Castillo is being made rich by his contract and at the same time it's actually preventing him from having any chance to play in the big leagues.

 

I'm sure when they were making the rules nobody imagined a situation exactly like this arising.

[Bellhorn04]

The Castillo situation highlights a big problem with the tax rules. The simple solution would be for contracts like his and Craig's to count as payroll for tax purposes until the player is released.

[Emp9]

The whole situation is kind of sick, isn't it? Castillo is being made rich by his contract and at the same time it's actually preventing him from having any chance to play in the big leagues.

 

I'm sure when they were making the rules nobody imagined a situation exactly like this arising.

 

He'd have to sign-off from his contract and re-structure it significantly. If the Sox do indeed reset their LT Limit this season, there may be something that can be worked out next year. Fat chance though. I's too bad really. I know Castillo used to play some infield (2B i think?) as well as OF. I would've gave him a look at 3B in the minors if his contract wasn't so impossible.

[S5Dewey]

A couple of things...

 

I'm not sure the Player's Assn. would allow him to sign off or restructure. I remember when ARod wanted to come to the Sox and the MLBPA prevented him from restructuring his contract even though both ARod and the Sox wanted him to.

 

Also...

 

I'm trying to figure out why either the PA or the owners would go along with something like this. Other than the guaranteed money, it doesn't seem to be in the best interest of either party.

 

I worked in a labor union all my life and I usually come firmly down on the side of labor but I think the MLBPA has entirely too much power.

[Emp9]

A couple of things...

 

I'm not sure the Player's Assn. would allow him to sign off or restructure. I remember when ARod wanted to come to the Sox and the MLBPA prevented him from restructuring his contract even though both ARod and the Sox wanted him to.

 

Also...

 

I'm trying to figure out why either the PA or the owners would go along with something like this. Other than the guaranteed money, it doesn't seem to be in the best interest of either party.

 

I worked in a labor union all my life and I usually come firmly down on the side of labor but I think the MLBPA has entirely too much power.

 

Yeah, it's not likely. Even so, if the Sox reset LTL this year, that could give them some room to play with, if it's worth it for them (to try and trade him). Even then, It may not even be worth it.

[Maxbialystock]

Who cares about Rusney Castillo? I sure don't. We have a pretty good outfield without him.

 

In a no doubt desperate view to return this thread to a "realistic view of 2017," which is actually the dadgum title, I would like to offer the following thoughts.

 

1. The pitching overall ain't half bad and will likely get even better when Rodriguez returns, hopefully right after the ASG and giving the Sox a rotation of Sale, ERod, Price, Porcello, and Pomeranz. Not too shabby. And a bullpen led by Kimbrel and Kelly, also pretty good. The only real weakness of the pitching I can see is our infield fielding.

 

2. This hitting continues to be problematical as we approach the midway point, 81 games, of the season. This is rare for Sox teams in the John Henry era or any era for that matter. Think about this: last night the Sox announcers said the Sox are 37-10 in games in which they score 4 or more runs. If you will check our W-L percentage you will find it to be way, way below that percentage (37/47= .787).

 

3. Ortiz retirement has demonstrably left a giant hole in the middle of the Sox lineup. Last year we led the AL by 100 runs in the runs scored department, and right now we are ranked 7th. At the same time we are dead last of 15 AL teams in dingers and second in GIDP.

 

4. Although we actually have a decent array of hitters in Betts, Bogaerts, Beni, Moreland, Pedroia, and now even JBJ, HanRam is woefully lacking as the DH and the C and 3B positions are bad enough opposing pitchers see them as tantamount to having to pitchers (a la the national league) at the end of the batting order.

 

5. Nevertheless, right now the Sox are neck and neck with the Yankees for 1st in the AL East and in first place in the AL for a wild card slot.

[OH FOY]

Here's the problem with me about Craig and Castillo. Money I could care less. These clowns have tons. They are blocking the other Prospects, even the DH role at Triple AAA is important.

If not in their future because of contract, they should be released. Mistake made move on, no reason to hold up other kids.

2 mistakes don't make a right.

[Emp9]

Vaz is batting .285 and Leon is batting almost .250 on the season. I wouldn't blame too much on our catchers. We need a big 2nd half from HanRam no doubt. But it's possible. It's also possible that we add a bat at the deadline. Also, I'd seriously consider rearranging this batting order. XB and Beni need to lead-off games, not Betts. I think we'd see more consistency if that we're to happen.

[a700hitter]

Here's the problem with me about Craig and Castillo. Money I could care less. These clowns have tons. They are blocking the other Prospects, even the DH role at Triple AAA is important.

If not in their future because of contract, they should be released. Mistake made move on, no reason to hold up other kids.

2 mistakes don't make a right.

They should justly be released and sent away with their huge checks. We have no need for them and there is zero prospect of utilizing either one in a trade. They are just wasting everyone's time and taking up AAA roster spots for players with futures. Enough already. DD bite the bullet on these huge mistakes of Cherries. Ben really was terrible. He threw around tons of money at useless assets.

[notin]

Here's the problem with me about Craig and Castillo. Money I could care less. These clowns have tons. They are blocking the other Prospects, even the DH role at Triple AAA is important.

If not in their future because of contract, they should be released. Mistake made move on, no reason to hold up other kids.

2 mistakes don't make a right.

 

I would disagree.

 

AAA isn't a big development step like other levels. The average age of players is usually 27-29ish and many of the players in the AAA leagues are already on 40-man rosters while they wait out someone above them getting hurt.

 

AAA is more about depth than development. ...

[notin]

That said, I wouldn't complain if Craig or Castillo were sent packing.

 

But if the Sox are going to release minor leaguers, 40-man roster spots are more valuable than AAA DH roles. Who there should go?

[OH FOY]

Devers at Portland he is flip-flopping with Chavis at 3rd base and DH. That's stupid. Dominquez stinks, bring up Devers. Sure some growing pains, but, at least he'll be growing. Edited June 25, 2017 by OH FOY!

[notin]

Who cares about Rusney Castillo? I sure don't. We have a pretty good outfield without him.

 

In a no doubt desperate view to return this thread to a "realistic view of 2017," which is actually the dadgum title, I would like to offer the following thoughts.

 

1. The pitching overall ain't half bad and will likely get even better when Rodriguez returns, hopefully right after the ASG and giving the Sox a rotation of Sale, ERod, Price, Porcello, and Pomeranz. Not too shabby. And a bullpen led by Kimbrel and Kelly, also pretty good. The only real weakness of the pitching I can see is our infield fielding.

 

2. This hitting continues to be problematical as we approach the midway point, 81 games, of the season. This is rare for Sox teams in the John Henry era or any era for that matter. Think about this: last night the Sox announcers said the Sox are 37-10 in games in which they score 4 or more runs. If you will check our W-L percentage you will find it to be way, way below that percentage (37/47= .787).

 

3. Ortiz retirement has demonstrably left a giant hole in the middle of the Sox lineup. Last year we led the AL by 100 runs in the runs scored department, and right now we are ranked 7th. At the same time we are dead last of 15 AL teams in dingers and second in GIDP.

 

4. Although we actually have a decent array of hitters in Betts, Bogaerts, Beni, Moreland, Pedroia, and now even JBJ, HanRam is woefully lacking as the DH and the C and 3B positions are bad enough opposing pitchers see them as tantamount to having to pitchers (a la the national league) at the end of the batting order.

 

5. Nevertheless, right now the Sox are neck and neck with the Yankees for 1st in the AL East and in first place in the AL for a wild card slot.

 

The only reason the Sox might be holding on to Craig and Castillo is that both have 3b experience. ...

[notin]

Devers at Portland he is flip-flopping with Chavis at 3rd base and DH. That's stupid.

 

Someone needs to go to make room for Devers. Noe Ramirez?

[OH FOY]

You cant release Craig? Make room at 3rd for Devers, and make Dominquez a DH?

[moonslav59]

The whole situation is kind of sick, isn't it? Castillo is being made rich by his contract and at the same time it's actually preventing him from having any chance to play in the big leagues.

 

I'm sure when they were making the rules nobody imagined a situation exactly like this arising.

 

It sounds like the new contract made it worse not better.

[a700hitter]

I would disagree.

 

AAA isn't a big development step like other levels. The average age of players is usually 27-29ish and many of the players in the AAA leagues are already on 40-man rosters while they wait out someone above them getting hurt.

 

AAA is more about depth than development. ...

But they don't even provide depth options. First of all, they are both terrible. Second, they will never bring up either one of them because of the financial implications which would be so costly that it would behoove them to acquire a real major leaguer.