Sox Pitching Staff Discussion

[mvp 78]

A parallel to this speculative discussion is the ones we have often had about which moves Ben was responsible for and which he was not responsible for.

 

If he was the GM at the time, he was responsible. The same way Theo was responsible for "feeding the monster."

 

Ben gets the credit for the 2012 trade to right the ship (sorry, A700), bringing in the vets that helped win in 2013 (yay) and then setting fire to the team afterwards (sorry, Kimmi).

[moonslav59]

If he was the GM at the time, he was responsible. The same way Theo was responsible for "feeding the monster."

 

Ben gets the credit for the 2012 trade to right the ship (sorry, A700), bringing in the vets that helped win in 2013 (yay) and then setting fire to the team afterwards (sorry, Kimmi).

 

So, since DD is not the current GM, all that is done now is all Mike Hazen's fault.

 

I never hear his name on this site or in any discussions, but clearly he's an example of how GMs are not always "in charge" of every or evena ny mov es..

[User Name]

^This is a good point.

[mvp 78]

^This is a good point.

 

I'm going to start thanking Larry Lucchino for the 3 WS from now on. Thanks, Larry.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm going to start thanking Larry Lucchino for the 3 WS from now on. Thanks, Larry.

 

The fact is that the Sox FO has been a multi-headed beast since Henry bought the team, and as fans it doesn't get spelled out for us who did what, so we have to draw our own conclusions based on the circumstantial evidence.

 

That's why I was comparing it to the Buch-Miley speculation.

[Spudboy]

I don't understand why it has to be known if Buch was offered or not.

 

The Mariners wanted Miley otherwise they would not have accepted the deal.

[Nick]

At least now, we know it's all on DD.....just the way it should be....someone should be in charge.

[User Name]

I don't understand why it has to be known if Buch was offered or not.

 

The Mariners wanted Miley otherwise they would not have accepted the deal.

 

^You're wrong, because we don't have a formal letter from the Mariners specifying that after weighing the offers consisting of Miley or Buchholz, they decided to choose Miley for obvious reasons like being able to sleep without getting injured, and an awesome beard.

[mvp 78]

At least now, we know it's all on DD.....just the way it should be....someone should be in charge.

 

I get to blame Tom Werner for all the s***** things about NESN. That's all I really care about.

[mvp 78]

^You're wrong, because we don't have a formal letter from the Mariners specifying that after weighing the offers consisting of Miley or Buchholz, they decided to choose Miley for obvious reasons like being able to sleep without getting injured, and an awesome beard.

 

The only letter I have is not notarized. Is that ok?

[User Name]

The only letter I have is not notarized. Is that ok?

 

Nope. /enddiscussion

[harmony]

^You're wrong, because we don't have a formal letter from the Mariners specifying that after weighing the offers consisting of Miley or Buchholz, they decided to choose Miley for obvious reasons like being able to sleep without getting injured, and an awesome beard.

Moments ago from a Seattle Mariner beat reporter who is a former president of the Baseball Writers' Association of America:

I heard both were discussed. I don’t know if they were given a choice. But I THINK Dipoto would have preferred Miley anyway because of their past association in Arizona. Also, the Mariners’ priority at that time was to find a reliable innings-eater, a guy they could depend on for 180 innings. Miley fit that profile far better than Buchholz.

I've asked the Seattle front office to forward to general manager Jerry Dipoto my email inquiring whether the Red Sox gave the Mariners the choice between Wade Miley and Clay Buchholz. I don't expect an answer.:D

[User Name]

Dipoto's a cool cat. We'll get a response.

[Spudboy]

Good stuff Harmony. I hope that you receive a response.

 

You know, as the outstanding group of superfans that Talksox comprises, we should send hundreds of e-mails to the Sox FO telling them what we think. Like lobbyists only we pay with our cable bills.

 

We should work on this!

[mvp 78]

Good stuff Harmony. I hope that you receive a response.

 

You know, as the outstanding group of superfans that Talksox comprises, we should send hundreds of e-mails to the Sox FO telling them what we think. Like lobbyists only we pay with our cable bills.

 

We should work on this!

 

Which sideline reporter do we ask to come back?

[Kimmi]

Is Elias worth anything though? At the moment he looks like just another stiff.

 

I think he could be a very serviceable back end starter. Even without him, though, I like the deal.

[harmony]

I think he could be a very serviceable back end starter. Even without him, though, I like the deal.

A good trade should benefit both teams.

 

Despite this year's disappointments, this trade could still produce the desired results in the end.

[Kimmi]

If he was the GM at the time, he was responsible. The same way Theo was responsible for "feeding the monster."

 

Ben gets the credit for the 2012 trade to right the ship (sorry, A700), bringing in the vets that helped win in 2013 (yay) and then setting fire to the team afterwards (sorry, Kimmi).

 

Don't forget the credit for the wonderful farm system that he preserved from Theo and continued to build on his own.

[Kimmi]

The fact is that the Sox FO has been a multi-headed beast since Henry bought the team, and as fans it doesn't get spelled out for us who did what, so we have to draw our own conclusions based on the circumstantial evidence.

 

That's why I was comparing it to the Buch-Miley speculation.

 

And as I said before, the circumstantial evidence is 'tainted' by each person's biases, and I include myself in that statement.

[Kimmi]

I don't understand why it has to be known if Buch was offered or not.

 

The Mariners wanted Miley otherwise they would not have accepted the deal.

 

It doesn't have to be known. Frankly, I don't really care one way or the other.

 

I just take exception to people making false statements on the matter.

[mvp 78]

Don't forget the credit for the wonderful farm system that he preserved from Theo and continued to build on his own.

 

If I ran the full list of good things and bad things, we'd be here a while.

 

Ben did a great job with the farm system in terms of positional players. He did a terrible job at finding pitchers, something Theo was able to do.

[mvp 78]

Porcello's ERA is 3.66. Iortiz, your thoughts?

[oldtimer]

Sean O'Sullivan is reportedly out with a bad knee as of yesterday. Who will be our starters going forward? We will get through the All Star break but after that we will need to put up 4th and 5th starters during the late July, August grind. Can at least one of our AAA guys be coached and brought forward to at least give a representative performance?

[Bellhorn04]

Sean O'Sullivan is reportedly out with a bad knee as of yesterday.

 

Jesus Christ.

[Kimmi]

Sean O'Sullivan is reportedly out with a bad knee as of yesterday. Who will be our starters going forward? We will get through the All Star break but after that we will need to put up 4th and 5th starters during the late July, August grind. Can at least one of our AAA guys be coached and brought forward to at least give a representative performance?

 

O'Sullivan was place on the DL to make room for Ziegler.

 

So, who gets the start on the 19th?

[FredLynn]

Sean O'Sullivan is reportedly out with a bad knee as of yesterday. Who will be our starters going forward? We will get through the All Star break but after that we will need to put up 4th and 5th starters during the late July, August grind. Can at least one of our AAA guys be coached and brought forward to at least give a representative performance?

 

Phantom injury I suspect. O'Sullivan's value is pretty low. And someone had to be put on the DL or demoted to make room for Ziegler. I doubt this is a serious injury or even a real one. And apparently ERod is being reactivated:

 

"Michael Silverman ✔ @mikesilvermanbb

Eduardo Rodriguez will be activated to start 2nd-half opener in NY @yankees this Friday. Followed by Wright and Price."

 

As for the 19th, we do not need another starter then. Not until the 23rd. And here is what Farrell had to say about it:

 

"Michael Silverman ✔ @mikesilvermanbb

Farrell said plan is to have Buchholz in rotation in second half. First start unknown right now, no rush for 5th starter until July 23."

 

Oh goody. Clay Buchholz back in the rotation. Its the sort of thing nightmares are made of.

Edited July 10, 2016 by FredLynn

[NativeBostonian]

Phantom injury I suspect. O'Sullivan's value is pretty low. And someone had to be put on the DL or demoted to make room for Ziegler. I doubt this is a serious injury or even a real one. And apparently ERod is being reactivated:

 

"Michael Silverman ✔ @mikesilvermanbb

Eduardo Rodriguez will be activated to start 2nd-half opener in NY @yankees this Friday. Followed by Wright and Price."

 

As for the 19th, we do not need another starter then. Not until the 23rd. And here is what Farrell had to say about it:

 

"Michael Silverman ✔ @mikesilvermanbb

Farrell said plan is to have Buchholz in rotation in second half. First start unknown right now, no rush for 5th starter until July 23."

 

Oh goody. Clay Buchholz back in the rotation. Its the sort of thing nightmares are made of.

 

They are a glutton for punishment if they bring Eduardo Rodríguez back up. O'Sullivan wasn't blowing anyone away. But, he kept the team in the game. Something that this team's 4th and 5th starters haven't been able to do. If this really isn't an injury and they are just trying to find a way to get him off the roster, they are the stupidest mother f***ers on the face of the earth.

[Nick]

They are a glutton for punishment if they bring Eduardo Rodríguez back up. O'Sullivan wasn't blowing anyone away. But, he kept the team in the game. Something that this team's 4th and 5th starters haven't been able to do. If this really isn't an injury and they are just trying to find a way to get him off the roster, they are the stupidest mother f***ers on the face of the earth.

 

If you mean giving up 4 runs in 5 innings keeping us in the game, then ok.

 

I APPLAUD SOX FO.....THEY ARE MOVING WITH SENSE OF URGENCY...You have to pay close attention to what DD says....He doesn't believe there's anyone out there at a reasonable asking price that PROJECTS out to have higher ceiling than E Rod. SOX wants to find out right away if there's any chance E ROD can be salvaged for balance of 2016. Same goes for Buchy. IF IT FAILS, they will go sign HILL.

 

DD thinks we can win this thing. He's looking under every rock for help. He's a no non-sense old school guy with a style. It's time Buchy take off his panties and put a big boy boxers.

[NativeBostonian]

If you mean giving up 4 runs in 5 innings keeping us in the game, then ok.

 

I APPLAUD SOX FO.....THEY ARE MOVING WITH SENSE OF URGENCY...You have to pay close attention to what DD says....He doesn't believe there's anyone out there at a reasonable asking price that PROJECTS out to have higher ceiling than E Rod. SOX wants to find out right away if there's any chance E ROD can be salvaged for balance of 2016. Same goes for Buchy. IF IT FAILS, they will go sign HILL.

 

DD thinks we can win this thing. He's looking under every rock for help. He's a no non-sense old school guy with a style. It's time Buchy take off his panties and put a big boy boxers.

 

E-Rod gives up more then that in just one f***ing inning. Stop with the f***ing insanity. Rodríguez needs more time in the minors. One f***ing start down there isn't going to fix him.

[FredLynn]

E-Rod gives up more then that in just one f***ing inning. Stop with the f***ing insanity. Rodríguez needs more time in the minors. One f***ing start down there isn't going to fix him.

 

Lets keep this real. Last year ERod, in 121 IP, had an ERA of 3.85, and an ERA+ of 110. At the beginning of this year he got hurt. So far he has pitched just 29 innings in just 6 games. Are you really ready to give up on him already? We gave Buchholz 10+ starts before declaring him a disaster. Aside from the fact that right now there is no better option than ERod-who last year was very good-its simply too early to give up on him. Six starts? Really?