Should Boston Pilfer A Division Rival to Replace Alex Bregman in Free Agency?

[notin]

3 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

I'm not paying for Bo. 

We were counting on you to…

[Old Red]

3 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

I'm not paying for Bo. 

I’d be shocked if JH will either. Especially at the numbers being mentioned here, and other places.

[Old Red]

10 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I don't claim to know it all, but one thing I see time and time and time again and every year, repeat, without fail, is all of us severaly underestimating how much guys get paid. 

The reality is, you either want to pay the price of admission......or you do not.

I have no idea what the price of Bichette would be, I'm speculating, so it's a bit interesting the price tag is centerpiece of this conversation but I do know two things to be true. 

- Bichette is going to get paid, likely more than what anyone in here is going to predict. 

- Bichette, like any free agent, would have to be paid more per annum to entice them to sign for less years.  

The Red Sox like to window shop, but paying the price of admission that the big spenders are paying just isn’t going to happen.

[Hugh2]

6 minutes ago, notin said:

That’s why I don’t attach money.  I’m either going to underestimate or overcompensate.  There is no third option.

Trades?  BTV gives me their interpretation of “fair,” and the deals probably are fair.  That doesn’t mean other teams like them.  Sometimes teams don’t want to make fair trades and want to rip you off.  Not much I can do to guess that.

I think it should assumed anytime someone says something like "sign player XYZ to 8 years 200 million" that the years and money can fluctuate from that number.  Unless something thinks it's insanely off, it just seems like noise to go "NO he won't get that exact number" I don't really care. 

My AAV is probably too high for him, but he's probably getting around $220 million. 

[notin]

1 minute ago, Hugh2 said:

I think it should assumed anytime someone says something like "sign player XYZ to 8 years 200 million" that the years and money can fluctuate from that number.  Unless something thinks it's insanely off, it just seems like noise to go "NO he won't get that exact number" I don't really care. 

My AAV is probably too high for him, but he's probably getting around $220 million. 

And years close to 8.  Or more?

i’d give Bo Bichette 8 years before I gave Bregman 6…

[JoeBrady]

47 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

We do this EVERY YEAR, and you guys always undersell what these free agents are going to make.  

Bichette WILL be paid over 200 million.  I'm overpaying to get him off the books at 33 and not paying for him into his late 30's.  If I'm paying him an extra 5-7 million a year to do that....great. 

If you ae going to overpay $6M a year, then you are adding at least $30M to his contract.  You might as well add a year at a cheaper price.  You'd be better off with BA's offer of $240M/8.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

What I've noted over the years about Bichette:

1. too inconsistent at shortstop for a contender, because he heaves away too many throws;

2. takes home run cuts on his first two swings of every AB (mostly vs. the Red Sox), but with two strikes shortens up and makes solid contact.

Bo also fits well into a batting order with a big bopper like Vlad Junior. Bichette would be a natural hitting after Anthony.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, Hitch said:

 

His .907 at the Fens includes a .394 BABIP.  Think more along the lines of 24 HRs and a .290.  Good, but not great.  And his stats at Fenway over the past four years are 1 HR in 90 ABs with a .300 average.  He's more line drive than FB HR type hitter.  I doubt he does anything special at Fenway,

[FredLynn]

3 hours ago, Old Red said:

Agree on Bichette, but I don’t think the Red Sox want to go that long on a contract.

Henry is way too cheap to be able to afford Bichette. He will instruct his staff to claim that they are "interested" in him-maybe "very interested"-then lowball him. Seen this movie before.

[mvp 78]

33 minutes ago, notin said:

We were counting on you to…

Too bad! I have to pay for my own new roof and MLB owners won't even pay for the Rays's! 

[moonslav59]

If we go large and long, it should be for Alonso or Schwarber not Bo.

I'd rather go shorter on Suarez and Hoskins or Polanco & Hoskins than long on Bo.

[mvp 78]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

If we go large and long, it should be for Alonso or Schwarber not Bo.

I'd rather go shorter on Suarez and Hoskins or Polanco & Hoskins than long on Bo.

Large and long for a DH type is what got Devers traded. No way do they do that for Alonso or Schwarber. 

[Old Red]

9 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Large and long for a DH type is what got Devers traded. No way do they do that for Alonso or Schwarber. 

The Red Sox had a lot better chance to sign Flintstone once, and now he’d be to expensive for the Red Sox taste. If Alonso is in demand I can’t see the Red Sox outbidding anyone either. If it’s not for Bregman I just don’t see the Red Sox signing any large, and long contracts.

[notin]

34 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

If we go large and long, it should be for Alonso or Schwarber not Bo.

I'd rather go shorter on Suarez and Hoskins or Polanco & Hoskins than long on Bo.

Alonso will be 31.  Schwarber will be 33.  Bichette will be 28.  And will play a position more difficult to get production at…

[moonslav59]

50 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Large and long for a DH type is what got Devers traded. No way do they do that for Alonso or Schwarber. 

I've said over and over, I doubt we sign Alonso or Schwarber. I'll even add Bichette to the list. What I'm saying is we should.

If they don't want to go "long" then sign Suarez, Hoskins, Merrill Kelly, Matz and trade for Ryan. None of them should be "large AND long."

(Maybe sub Polanco for Suarez.)

[Hugh2]

1 hour ago, JoeBrady said:

If you ae going to overpay $6M a year, then you are adding at least $30M to his contract.  You might as well add a year at a cheaper price.  You'd be better off with BA's offer of $240M/8.

I suppose it's all a matter of perspective, many teams value lowering the term of a contract and are willing to pay more per to do so. 

[Hugh2]

I understand Bichette may be a long shot, or Boston won't shell out the money needed to sign him. 

But why do people keep assuming he's playing SS? If I'm signing Bo, it's to play 2nd or 3rd. 

 

[moonslav59]

28 minutes ago, notin said:

Alonso will be 31.  Schwarber will be 33.  Bichette will be 28.  And will play a position more difficult to get production at…

I don't see Bichette as a plus on D, so it's not a multi level plus.

Sure, getting BO production at 2B vs what we've gotten over the years would be a big boost, but now that Devers is gone, what are we looking at for projected OPS at 1B and DH?

Our 1B position hit .690. Masa was under .690. There is great room for upgrades there, too.

Your point is well taken. Fixing 2B is harder to do than fixing DH and 1B, long term.

[moonslav59]

Just now, Hugh2 said:

 

But why do people keep assuming he's playing SS? If I'm signing Bo, it's to play 2nd or 3rd. 

 

Agreed, but then again, I had hoped Bogey would moveto 2B or 3B, when we signed Story.

I hoped Devers moved to 1B several years ago.

Now, I hope the move Story to 2B, and even think 3B would be better than SS.

[Hugh2]

Just now, moonslav59 said:

Agreed, but then again, I had hoped Bogey would moveto 2B or 3B, when we signed Story.

I hoped Devers moved to 1B several years ago.

Now, I hope the move Story to 2B, and even think 3B would be better than SS.

Well as of right now, either Mayer or Story is playing SS, and the other one may very well be playing 3B depending on how things shake up. 

Right now we only have Mayer/Story for 3 positions and even those two guys (as high as I am on them) have not been glowing examples of health.  

It feels an infielder, at least one, is a must.  And I certianly want a guy of starting caliber.  We should expect that as a fan base too. 

[moonslav59]

2 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Well as of right now, either Mayer or Story is playing SS, and the other one may very well be playing 3B depending on how things shake up. 

Right now we only have Mayer/Story for 3 positions and even those two guys (as high as I am on them) have not been glowing examples of health.  

It feels an infielder, at least one, is a must.  And I certianly want a guy of starting caliber.  We should expect that as a fan base too. 

Oh, I'm totally behind adding a major bat to the infield. In fact, I've been begging for two- both being better hitters than Bo.

Alonso & Suarez

Alonso & Polanco

Suarez & Polanco (and maybe Hoskins, too.)

Even if we got Schwarber, I'd still want a couple infielders, but we'd likely have to settle on Suarez or Planco, at best (not 2) or Torres, Rengifo, Willi Castro or sign a guy like Merrill Kelly and then trade for K Marte.

I'm not arguing Bichette is too expensive. I'm arguing for better offense value and spending more.

[notin]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I don't see Bichette as a plus on D, so it's not a multi level plus.

Sure, getting BO production at 2B vs what we've gotten over the years would be a big boost, but now that Devers is gone, what are we looking at for projected OPS at 1B and DH?

Our 1B position hit .690. Masa was under .690. There is great room for upgrades there, too.

Your point is well taken. Fixing 2B is harder to do than fixing DH and 1B, long term.

The Sox 2b hit .670.  
 

At first base, the upgrade is over what the Sox got from Toro/Romy.  Not too difficult IMO.

I di like the idea of Bichette and Bell on the right side as opposed to Alonso and ? Hamilton/Romy again?  Hamilton/Grissom?  Or sign Rengifo, who is really a self-platooning Hamilton? 

[moonslav59]

5 minutes ago, notin said:

The Sox 2b hit .670.  

Yes, I mentioned this in a recent post. 1B was .690. DH without Devers was___?

We have enormous potential to improve at an of those slots, while also trying to keep 3B from becoming like one of those slots.

3B? Mayer hit .674. (Romy FT or platoon w Mayer)

DH? Masas under .690.

2B? Mayer at .674 or DHam .590/Campbell .664/Sogard .661 (Romy FT or platoon with Mayer?)

1B: Lowe at .790 but he likely is not back and the rest were pathetic, except for Romy.

I'm willing to let Mayer and Romy platoon at 2B or 3B, if we fill 2 other infield slots in a major way. I'm not sure Bregman & Hoskins is "major" enough for me, but even that might be asking too much from JH & Co.

If we upgraded DH with someone like Schwarber or Alonso, then I'd be fine with going lighter at 1B and 2B/3B.

[mvp 78]

15 minutes ago, notin said:

The Sox 2b hit .670.  
 

At first base, the upgrade is over what the Sox got from Toro/Romy.  Not too difficult IMO.

I di like the idea of Bichette and Bell on the right side as opposed to Alonso and ? Hamilton/Romy again?  Hamilton/Grissom?  Or sign Rengifo, who is really a self-platooning Hamilton? 

Even just Mayer playing fulltime should increase the batting order slot that 2b occupied if Breggie is signed. 

Agree that 1b should be an easy upgrade somehow. 

[moonslav59]

10 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Even just Mayer playing fulltime should increase the batting order slot that 2b occupied if Breggie is signed. 

The way Romy hit RHPs, last year, he might be the choice at 2B, if we don't upgrade. He could also platoon with Mayer at 2B or at 1B with ____ or at DH with Masa, but I doubt we want to platoon Mayer. (Maybe Masa, too.)

I'm not trying to be a downer, here. I have some high hopes on some improvements from younger players and projected higher PAs from many, but I just don't feel comfortable hoping on improvements and better health as the plan.

[mvp 78]

32 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

The way Romy hit RHPs, last year, he might be the choice at 2B, if we don't upgrade. He could also platoon with Mayer at 2B or at 1B with ____ or at DH with Masa, but I doubt we want to platoon Mayer. (Maybe Masa, too.)

I'm not trying to be a downer, here. I have some high hopes on some improvements from younger players and projected higher PAs from many, but I just don't feel comfortable hoping on improvements and better health as the plan.

I'd platoon Mayer because he's not good vs LHP. 

[moonslav59]

13 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

I'd platoon Mayer because he's not good vs LHP. 

So far, yes, and since Romy can play 2B and 3B, it's a perfect fit. Masa is not a clear platoon guy. If Casas plays, he's not either, so that links Romy to Mayer. 

Ref could be brought back to platoon for Duran or Abreu, but we have Campbell & Garcia to do that. The problem there would be stunting their growth just to get them to start 30-35% of all games.

I'm fine with giving a slot to Mayer-Romy (2B or 3B,) but we have to go bold at the other 2 open infield slots.

I know you like Breggie-Hoskins, and that's okay to me, but it looks like status quo, once you figure in injury projections and possible downticks from some vets. If we could somehow dump about 1/3 of Masa's contract and add a better DH (one with more power) I'd be okay with your infield choices. Of course, I'd like Schwarber, but realistically, maybe it could be O'Hearn or Ozuna.

[mvp 78]

O'Hearn doesn't do it for me.

Ozuna had a down year last year and serious off field incidents. Players love him though. Anything more than 2 years would be CRAZY.

[moonslav59]

41 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

O'Hearn doesn't do it for me.

Ozuna had a down year last year and serious off field incidents. Players love him though. Anything more than 2 years would be CRAZY.

Both are far down on my wish list, but I tried to find two FAs better than masa and not terribly expensive.

Last 3 years:

.867 Ozuna (.756 in '25 and turns 35 real soon.)

.866 Schwarber

.827 Alonso

.809 Naylor

(.803 Casas)

.796 Bregman

.788 O'Hearn

.780 B Lowe

.778 Bichette

.775 Suarez

.774 O'Neill

(.762 Masa)

.754 Moncada

.732 Hoskins

ISO

3. Schwarber .280

11. Alonso .252

19. Ozuna .235

35. Suarez .223

38. B Lowe .221

(49. Casas .211)

[JoeBrady]

6 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Both are far down on my wish list, but I tried to find two FAs better than masa and not terribly expensive.

Last 3 years:

.867 Ozuna (.756 in '25 and turns 35 real soon.)

.866 Schwarber

.827 Alonso

.809 Naylor

(.803 Casas)

.796 Bregman

.788 O'Hearn

.780 B Lowe

.778 Bichette

.775 Suarez

.774 O'Neill

(.762 Masa)

So we're trying to upgrade 1B and DH, and 2 of the top 12 are the guys we are trying to replace?