A Realistic View of the 2025 Red Sox: Part II

[moonslav59]

IMO, a hard choices have to be made, and maybe the deadline is not the right time to make it.

1. We absolutely have to make sure Bregman returns for at least 2026. Somehow-someway: make it happen!

2. I do think teams often overpay more at the deadline than during the winter, so deciding on which vets we want to stick with and who should go is a very important decision to be made. IMO, we should not trade top prospects, and we have logjams at some positions, so it makes sense to do it this summer, even if just for valuable prospects that could be used to acquire vets this summer or this coming winter. (See below.)

3. Decide which prospects are most likely to be impactful and trade some that seem blocked by vets and or other prospects that we have above them.

4. Decide if we need to make changes to our coaching staff and medical staff.

Who should we extend or trade? My opinions...

Extend Bregman, Mayer and Anthony

Trade a vet OF'er: As much as I view Duran as our 3rd or 4th best offensive weapon, I like Abreu, Rafaela & Anthony better. I also think Refsnyder, Jh Garcia and Campbell offer enough depth to cover for the loss of Duran. (My second choice would be Abreu.)

Trade 2-3 mid level prospects, but this is tricky, since we should not just hand them away: I'm thinking Romero (blocked by Mayer, Campbell, Story and Arias, although Romero is closer to being ML ready than Arias) Bleis (blocked by Anthony, Garcia, Campbell and the vets, even if we trade Duran, we still have Rafaela, Abreu, Refsnyder and Masa) and Cespedes (has no true position, but is blocked by the same OF'ers and IF'er listed above) and a pitching prospect or two who could be added to a package that returns a better pitcher (maybe Mullins, Sandlin, Monegro, Uberstine, Wehunt or one of our very young and promising pitchers.) I'm just not sure their trade value is high enough to get back what we need.

Trade Vets that will be free agents, after this year, which means we totally give up on 2025: Chapman, Wilson, Buehler, Giolito, Hendriks, Refsnyder and any vets who do not seem to fit into our future scheme. I doubt anyone wants Yoshida or Story at their costs, but maybe this winter, we can find a taker or just exchange salary dump contracts. Including a prospect or valuable vet in the deal may help, but dumping salary only works, if we spend the savings. trading guys like Houck, Crawford and Murphy probably don't bring back what we need and would risk another result that Sale exemplified, of course on a smaller scale. Trading DHam, Grissom, Weissert, Kelly, Guerrero and the like are not going to be difference-maker trades.

Anyone have any better ideas?

[Nick]

20 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

IMO, a hard choices have to be made, and maybe the deadline is not the right time to make it.

1. We absolutely have to make sure Bregman returns for at least 2026. Somehow-someway: make it happen!

2. I do think teams often overpay more at the deadline than during the winter, so deciding on which vets we want to stick with and who should go is a very important decision to be made. IMO, we should not trade top prospects, and we have logjams at some positions, so it makes sense to do it this summer, even if just for valuable prospects that could be used to acquire vets this summer or this coming winter. (See below.)

3. Decide which prospects are most likely to be impactful and trade some that seem blocked by vets and or other prospects that we have above them.

4. Decide if we need to make changes to our coaching staff and medical staff.

Who should we extend or trade? My opinions...

Extend Bregman, Mayer and Anthony

Trade a vet OF'er: As much as I view Duran as our 3rd or 4th best offensive weapon, I like Abreu, Rafaela & Anthony better. I also think Refsnyder, Jh Garcia and Campbell offer enough depth to cover for the loss of Duran. (My second choice would be Abreu.)

Trade 2-3 mid level prospects, but this is tricky, since we should not just hand them away: I'm thinking Romero (blocked by Mayer, Campbell, Story and Arias, although Romero is closer to being ML ready than Arias) Bleis (blocked by Anthony, Garcia, Campbell and the vets, even if we trade Duran, we still have Rafaela, Abreu, Refsnyder and Masa) and Cespedes (has no true position, but is blocked by the same OF'ers and IF'er listed above) and a pitching prospect or two who could be added to a package that returns a better pitcher (maybe Mullins, Sandlin, Monegro, Uberstine, Wehunt or one of our very young and promising pitchers.) I'm just not sure their trade value is high enough to get back what we need.

Trade Vets that will be free agents, after this year, which means we totally give up on 2025: Chapman, Wilson, Buehler, Giolito, Hendriks, Refsnyder and any vets who do not seem to fit into our future scheme. I doubt anyone wants Yoshida or Story at their costs, but maybe this winter, we can find a taker or just exchange salary dump contracts. Including a prospect or valuable vet in the deal may help, but dumping salary only works, if we spend the savings. trading guys like Houck, Crawford and Murphy probably don't bring back what we need and would risk another result that Sale exemplified, of course on a smaller scale. Trading DHam, Grissom, Weissert, Kelly, Guerrero and the like are not going to be difference-maker trades.

Anyone have any better ideas?

1 Bregman is a priority. Extend him. How about 6 years at $40M per, defer it so the tax hit is around $30M. We don't care the cash outlay, we only care about the AAV. I think he's just a good hitter especially at Fenway. Good defender at 3b so we don't have to worry about that position. Our window of opportunity realistically starts in 2026. That's when Crochet's 6 year deal begins. We HAVE to take advantage of it....

2 We need one deal at the trade deadline packaging several players to entice someone to return us a team controlled starting pitcher. I don't want all one for one trade get a fringe reliever type.

3 As much as I'm not a big fan of Story, as long as we don't have a legit 2B, we need to keep him. I'd prefer Mayer at SS and Story at 2B. Mayer is our future shortstop. Let him play there. Unfortunately Cora would never go for it. Story is the second coming of Kike Hernandez for Cora. But Bregman, Story and Mayer works for me.

4. We need a legit 1B. I don't care how we do it. Go get him.

5 If we are giving up on 2025, trade Chapman and then sign him as a FA, 2 year $30M.

6 Starting Rotation...give our young arms chance to show us what they have...Houck has no value to trade him. Let him turn back into a reliever. Let him pitch hard for one inning. Kutter will be out.

7 Duran and Chapman should be our big pieces. Throw in couple of prospects and get a solid starter in return with some team controlled. 3 or 4 years would be nice.

8 We are basically down to Crochet, Bello and Dobbins for now. If we can't get any value for him, then we keep Giolito so thins don't get out of hand. 

So in summary, Moon. Extend Bregman, Package Duran, Chapman and couple of prospects to obtain a solid starting pitcher that won't get hurt, lol, trade back Buehler to the Dodgers for prospects, maybe take on his entire salary to get a better return and sign a team controlled 1B.

C Narvaez 1B Trade Acquisition 2B Mayer SS Story 3B Bregman lF Anthony CF Rafaela RF Abreu DH Refsnyder/Yoshida/Gonzalez/Narvaez

SP 1 Crochet SP 2 Trade 3 Bello 4 Dobbins 5 Giolito (we're getting thin with Kutter gone and Houck struggline)

Too tired to think about our bullpen without Chapman. Whitlock is turning into Matt Barnes.

 

[moonslav59]

15 minutes ago, Nick said:

1 Bregman is a priority. Extend him. How about 6 years at $40M per, defer it so the tax hit is around $30M. We don't care the cash outlay, we only care about the AAV. I think he's just a good hitter especially at Fenway. Good defender at 3b so we don't have to worry about that position. Our window of opportunity realistically starts in 2026. That's when Crochet's 6 year deal begins. We HAVE to take advantage of it....

2 We need one deal at the trade deadline packaging several players to entice someone to return us a team controlled starting pitcher. I don't want all one for one trade get a fringe reliever type.

3 As much as I'm not a big fan of Story, as long as we don't have a legit 2B, we need to keep him. I'd prefer Mayer at SS and Story at 2B. Mayer is our future shortstop. Let him play there. Unfortunately Cora would never go for it. Story is the second coming of Kike Hernandez for Cora. But Bregman, Story and Mayer works for me.

4. We need a legit 1B. I don't care how we do it. Go get him.

5 If we are giving up on 2025, trade Chapman and then sign him as a FA, 2 year $30M.

6 Starting Rotation...give our young arms chance to show us what they have...Houck has no value to trade him. Let him turn back into a reliever. Let him pitch hard for one inning. Kutter will be out.

7 Duran and Chapman should be our big pieces. Throw in couple of prospects and get a solid starter in return with some team controlled. 3 or 4 years would be nice.

8 We are basically down to Crochet, Bello and Dobbins for now. If we can't get any value for him, then we keep Giolito so thins don't get out of hand. 

So in summary, Moon. Extend Bregman, Package Duran, Chapman and couple of prospects to obtain a solid starting pitcher that won't get hurt, lol, trade back Buehler to the Dodgers for prospects, maybe take on his entire salary to get a better return and sign a team controlled 1B.

C Narvaez 1B Trade Acquisition 2B Mayer SS Story 3B Bregman lF Anthony CF Rafaela RF Abreu DH Refsnyder/Yoshida/Gonzalez/Narvaez

SP 1 Crochet SP 2 Trade 3 Bello 4 Dobbins 5 Giolito (we're getting thin with Kutter gone and Houck struggline)

Too tired to think about our bullpen without Chapman. Whitlock is turning into Matt Barnes.

 

The thing is, generally, trading for rentsls happens at the deadline. Trading for controlled pitchers happens in the winter.

Trading Duran and Chapman would be for prospects, not some solid SP'er, because the team acquiring these two will be a playoff bound team in need of said pitcher. Maybe a three way deal can get it done: Duran & Chapman to team A, prospects from team A and us to team B, and a solid Sp'er to us.

[Duran Is The Man]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

The thing is, generally, trading for rentsls happens at the deadline. Trading for controlled pitchers happens in the winter.

Trading Duran and Chapman would be for prospects, not some solid SP'er, because the team acquiring these two will be a playoff bound team in need of said pitcher. Maybe a three way deal can get it done: Duran & Chapman to team A, prospects from team A and us to team B, and a solid Sp'er to us.

just what we need: to give up very good players for a roll of the dice on a prospect. jezzus. then this winter we'll be looking for a closer and a lead-off hitter. don't get me wrong, i'm ok with trades but i'm sick and freakin' tired of trading good players for crap. and then HOPING they produce.

[Larry Cook]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

The thing is, generally, trading for rentsls happens at the deadline. Trading for controlled pitchers happens in the winter.

I agree with this 100 percent! 
 

but this year is unique in that we have quality major league talent with years of control that should allow us to get a contending team’s best pitching prospect!! 

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

3 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

IMO, a hard choices have to be made, and maybe the deadline is not the right time to make it.

1. We absolutely have to make sure Bregman returns for at least 2026. Somehow-someway: make it happen!

2. I do think teams often overpay more at the deadline than during the winter, so deciding on which vets we want to stick with and who should go is a very important decision to be made. IMO, we should not trade top prospects, and we have logjams at some positions, so it makes sense to do it this summer, even if just for valuable prospects that could be used to acquire vets this summer or this coming winter. (See below.)

3. Decide which prospects are most likely to be impactful and trade some that seem blocked by vets and or other prospects that we have above them.

4. Decide if we need to make changes to our coaching staff and medical staff.

Who should we extend or trade? My opinions...

Extend Bregman, Mayer and Anthony

Trade a vet OF'er: As much as I view Duran as our 3rd or 4th best offensive weapon, I like Abreu, Rafaela & Anthony better. I also think Refsnyder, Jh Garcia and Campbell offer enough depth to cover for the loss of Duran. (My second choice would be Abreu.)

Trade 2-3 mid level prospects, but this is tricky, since we should not just hand them away: I'm thinking Romero (blocked by Mayer, Campbell, Story and Arias, although Romero is closer to being ML ready than Arias) Bleis (blocked by Anthony, Garcia, Campbell and the vets, even if we trade Duran, we still have Rafaela, Abreu, Refsnyder and Masa) and Cespedes (has no true position, but is blocked by the same OF'ers and IF'er listed above) and a pitching prospect or two who could be added to a package that returns a better pitcher (maybe Mullins, Sandlin, Monegro, Uberstine, Wehunt or one of our very young and promising pitchers.) I'm just not sure their trade value is high enough to get back what we need.

Trade Vets that will be free agents, after this year, which means we totally give up on 2025: Chapman, Wilson, Buehler, Giolito, Hendriks, Refsnyder and any vets who do not seem to fit into our future scheme. I doubt anyone wants Yoshida or Story at their costs, but maybe this winter, we can find a taker or just exchange salary dump contracts. Including a prospect or valuable vet in the deal may help, but dumping salary only works, if we spend the savings. trading guys like Houck, Crawford and Murphy probably don't bring back what we need and would risk another result that Sale exemplified, of course on a smaller scale. Trading DHam, Grissom, Weissert, Kelly, Guerrero and the like are not going to be difference-maker trades.

Anyone have any better ideas?

If the Sox trade Chapman, they're also giving up on '26. They should extend him through '26.

[moonslav59]

4 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

just what we need: to give up very good players for a roll of the dice on a prospect. jezzus. then this winter we'll be looking for a closer and a lead-off hitter. don't get me wrong, i'm ok with trades but i'm sick and freakin' tired of trading good players for crap. and then HOPING they produce.

Nobody likes trading good players for crap. Some see the Devers trade as a salary dump and or clubhouse issue deal, and that's why we got crap. The salary savings being spent wisely is something we all doubt- both in terms of actually being spent and the "wisely" part. The Betts trade is beyond further debate, but we all hate that it happened.

My point is this: we don't look like a winning team, unless we go full buy mode at the deadline and trade away several good and maybe some top prospects, and even then, nothing is guaranteed. We can play it half way and sell moderate prospects that look blocked for moderate and short term gains that likely get us nowhere near a ring. Or we sell. We trade every free agent to be, except maybe Bregman, who we extend, and we make a strategic choice on which excess OF'er to trade. As much as I hate to see Duran traded, I think he makes the most sense, and a deadline trade means for prospects, unless we involve a third team and get a pitcher. (But, most likely only pitcher rentals are available- not the Crochet type of trade.)

I know it sucks, but to me, it might be the only way we can get a quick turn around and be winners in 2026.

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

I agree with this 100 percent! 
 

but this year is unique in that we have quality major league talent with years of control that should allow us to get a contending team’s best pitching prospect!! 

Trading for a pitching prospect is different than a Crochet-like deal. 

I'm not against trading for Abel or Painter. A trade centered on Duran might get it done, but they may ask for Arias and Tolle, too, if not a big 3.

Would you trade Duran, Campbell and Mullins for Abel or Painter?

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

If the Sox trade Chapman, they're also giving up on '26. They should extend him through '26.

He's not signed for 26, nor do we have an option.

We can trade him and then sign him in 2026. It's rare, but we could,

From the sounds of many here, what sort of chance do we have, in 2025, even if we became all-in buyers?

By all in, does than mean trade 2 of the top 3 prospects plus guys like Arias, Garcia, Tolle, Bleis and Cespedes? Ro two of the top 3 and 3 of the next 5 or 6?

The worst choice, to me, is another half way choice.

[Bellhorn04]

As one of the blogsters at Over the Monster put it, the Red Sox have become Groundhog Day.

[Randy Red Sox]

On 6/23/2025 at 5:38 AM, TheSplinteredSplendor said:

I disagree, with devers gone and no other proven big bats in the line-up, it makes it very difficult to carry another black hole.

Sox are a complete disaster. Mired into a .500 team at best year after year. Top prospects are all here and all are struggling.  As always our pitching stinks and our offence especially after the Devers giveaway stinks too.

[Randy Red Sox]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

He's not signed for 26, nor do we have an option.

We can trade him and then sign him in 2026. It's rare, but we could,

From the sounds of many here, what sort of chance do we have, in 2025, even if we became all-in buyers?

By all in, does than mean trade 2 of the top 3 prospects plus guys like Arias, Garcia, Tolle, Bleis and Cespedes? Ro two of the top 3 and 3 of the next 5 or 6?

The worst choice, to me, is another half way choice.

other than Mayer our top prospects have all seen their trade value drop

[Randy Red Sox]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Nobody likes trading good players for crap. Some see the Devers trade as a salary dump and or clubhouse issue deal, and that's why we got crap. The salary savings being spent wisely is something we all doubt- both in terms of actually being spent and the "wisely" part. The Betts trade is beyond further debate, but we all hate that it happened.

My point is this: we don't look like a winning team, unless we go full buy mode at the deadline and trade away several good and maybe some top prospects, and even then, nothing is guaranteed. We can play it half way and sell moderate prospects that look blocked for moderate and short term gains that likely get us nowhere near a ring. Or we sell. We trade every free agent to be, except maybe Bregman, who we extend, and we make a strategic choice on which excess OF'er to trade. As much as I hate to see Duran traded, I think he makes the most sense, and a deadline trade means for prospects, unless we involve a third team and get a pitcher. (But, most likely only pitcher rentals are available- not the Crochet type of trade.)

I know it sucks, but to me, it might be the only way we can get a quick turn around and be winners in 2026.

with all the utmost respect Moon did you not say the same thing at this point in 2023 and 2024?

 

[Larry Cook]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Trading for a pitching prospect is different than a Crochet-like deal. 

I'm not against trading for Abel or Painter. A trade centered on Duran might get it done, but they may ask for Arias and Tolle, too, if not a big 3.

Would you trade Duran, Campbell and Mullins for Abel or Painter?

To get painter, I have no problem giving up any prospects not named Mayer or Anthony 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Larry Cook said:

To get painter, I have no problem giving up any prospects not named Mayer or Anthony 

I'm not totally sold on any prospect pitcher.

[Maxbialystock]

9 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

IMO, a hard choices have to be made, and maybe the deadline is not the right time to make it.

1. We absolutely have to make sure Bregman returns for at least 2026. Somehow-someway: make it happen!

2. I do think teams often overpay more at the deadline than during the winter, so deciding on which vets we want to stick with and who should go is a very important decision to be made. IMO, we should not trade top prospects, and we have logjams at some positions, so it makes sense to do it this summer, even if just for valuable prospects that could be used to acquire vets this summer or this coming winter. (See below.)

3. Decide which prospects are most likely to be impactful and trade some that seem blocked by vets and or other prospects that we have above them.

4. Decide if we need to make changes to our coaching staff and medical staff.

Who should we extend or trade? My opinions...

Extend Bregman, Mayer and Anthony

Trade a vet OF'er: As much as I view Duran as our 3rd or 4th best offensive weapon, I like Abreu, Rafaela & Anthony better. I also think Refsnyder, Jh Garcia and Campbell offer enough depth to cover for the loss of Duran. (My second choice would be Abreu.)

Trade 2-3 mid level prospects, but this is tricky, since we should not just hand them away: I'm thinking Romero (blocked by Mayer, Campbell, Story and Arias, although Romero is closer to being ML ready than Arias) Bleis (blocked by Anthony, Garcia, Campbell and the vets, even if we trade Duran, we still have Rafaela, Abreu, Refsnyder and Masa) and Cespedes (has no true position, but is blocked by the same OF'ers and IF'er listed above) and a pitching prospect or two who could be added to a package that returns a better pitcher (maybe Mullins, Sandlin, Monegro, Uberstine, Wehunt or one of our very young and promising pitchers.) I'm just not sure their trade value is high enough to get back what we need.

Trade Vets that will be free agents, after this year, which means we totally give up on 2025: Chapman, Wilson, Buehler, Giolito, Hendriks, Refsnyder and any vets who do not seem to fit into our future scheme. I doubt anyone wants Yoshida or Story at their costs, but maybe this winter, we can find a taker or just exchange salary dump contracts. Including a prospect or valuable vet in the deal may help, but dumping salary only works, if we spend the savings. trading guys like Houck, Crawford and Murphy probably don't bring back what we need and would risk another result that Sale exemplified, of course on a smaller scale. Trading DHam, Grissom, Weissert, Kelly, Guerrero and the like are not going to be difference-maker trades.

Anyone have any better ideas?

Nope.  But I sure like yours, if only because they show how difficult this business is.  

 

[Maxbialystock]

2 hours ago, Randy Red Sox said:

with all the utmost respect Moon did you not say the same thing at this point in 2023 and 2024?

 

He probably did.  The difference between this team and those is that this team picked up 4 excellent players--Bregman, Crochet, Chapman, and Narvaez--in the offseason and seemed headed in the right direction.  Plus Campbell, Mayer, and Anthony all looked like they were ready to contribute.  

But a lot has happened in the first 3 months:  Devers traded.  $103M of the $192M payroll is on the IL, including Bregman our MVP.  The bullpen has collapsed.  The rotation still has Crochet, Bello, and Giolito, but Crochet is way more reliable and pitches way more innings. Campbell sent back to Worcester to work on hitting and defense.  Mayer and Anthony both show great promise, but haven't yet delivered.  

[moonslav59]

35 minutes ago, Maxbialystock said:

Nope.  But I sure like yours, if only because they show how difficult this business is.  

 

I absolutely am disgusted to be for a firesale. Kicking the can sucks.

I don't see anyway we can added 3-4 pieces and get back in this thing, so every trade should be about maximizing the assets we can have this summer to trade and spend to fill the biggest needs we have. Assuming we keep Bregman, trade Duran, Campbell, Casas, Arias & Sandlin for Skenes and trade all of FAs to be for prospects that can be flipped in a winter trade, this would be the framework:

SP: Crochet, Skenes, Sandoval, Bello, Dobbins

RP: ______, _____, Slaten, Whitlock, Houck, Crawford, Fitts, Weissert

C: Narvaez, Wong or _____

1B: ______ (Toro)

2B: Story or Mayer (DHam)

SS: Mayer or Story (Romero)

3B: Bregman (Grissom)

LF: Anthony (Refsnyder)

CF: Rafaela (Garcia)

RF: Abreu- Refsnyder (Garcia)

DH: Garcia-Romy (Yoshida)

[moonslav59]

3 hours ago, Randy Red Sox said:

with all the utmost respect Moon did you not say the same thing at this point in 2023 and 2024?

I did in 2023. I think I wanted us to buy in '24- just not top prospects.

I'm not happy having to repeat myself. This sucks for all Sox fans from all sides of the spectrum.

[moonslav59]

36 minutes ago, Maxbialystock said:

He probably did.  The difference between this team and those is that this team picked up 4 excellent players--Bregman, Crochet, Chapman, and Narvaez--in the offseason and seemed headed in the right direction.  Plus Campbell, Mayer, and Anthony all looked like they were ready to contribute.  

But a lot has happened in the first 3 months:  Devers traded.  $103M of the $192M payroll is on the IL, including Bregman our MVP.  The bullpen has collapsed.  The rotation still has Crochet, Bello, and Giolito, but Crochet is way more reliable and pitches way more innings. Campbell sent back to Worcester to work on hitting and defense.  Mayer and Anthony both show great promise, but haven't yet delivered.  

The biggest difference is that we had nobody really good to trade. The better ones were hurt. 

In theory, Bregman could be traded, but I'm all for extending him. Chapman is a better trade chip than Jansen was in '24. Wilson maybe better than Martin. While Duran is not a FA to be, he'll bring way more back than O'Neill might have brought us. I'm not sure about rumors of teams wanting Buehler, but so be it. Gio should being more than Buehler. Ref won't bring much, but someone might really need a top 10 MLB batter vs LHPs.

We could get enough prospects from trading these guys to make a nice winter trade.

I know, I know, why should we expect we do well on winter trades and signings, this time around?

What's the alternative? Just give up?

I know, I know, the mob wants a complete blow-up and start over. Not me.

[Duran Is The Man]

5 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Trading for a pitching prospect is different than a Crochet-like deal. 

I'm not against trading for Abel or Painter. A trade centered on Duran might get it done, but they may ask for Arias and Tolle, too, if not a big 3.

Would you trade Duran, Campbell and Mullins for Abel or Painter?

for an unproven prospect? hell no.

[vjcsmoke]

On 6/26/2025 at 5:46 PM, Larry Cook said:

The young lineup will have ups and downs!!!

but first things first, we have to fix the rotation!! We need a number 2 starter desperately!!!! (And a number 3, unless you think giolita is for real) 

Giolito was another bad signing. Red Sox are going nowhere fast and have assured themselves missing the playoffs again after trading away their best player for peanuts yet again. Giants pitcher Harrison is a decent prospect but who knows how long until he will be ready for MLB action?

losing to the blue jays 9-0 is simply embarrassing. 3-7 after devers trade now. My prediction is pain. Nobody looks good right now.

[vjcsmoke]

9 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

I absolutely am disgusted to be for a firesale. Kicking the can sucks.

I don't see anyway we can added 3-4 pieces and get back in this thing, so every trade should be about maximizing the assets we can have this summer to trade and spend to fill the biggest needs we have. Assuming we keep Bregman, trade Duran, Campbell, Casas, Arias & Sandlin for Skenes and trade all of FAs to be for prospects that can be flipped in a winter trade, this would be the framework:

SP: Crochet, Skenes, Sandoval, Bello, Dobbins

RP: ______, _____, Slaten, Whitlock, Houck, Crawford, Fitts, Weissert

C: Narvaez, Wong or _____

1B: ______ (Toro)

2B: Story or Mayer (DHam)

SS: Mayer or Story (Romero)

3B: Bregman (Grissom)

LF: Anthony (Refsnyder)

CF: Rafaela (Garcia)

RF: Abreu- Refsnyder (Garcia)

DH: Garcia-Romy (Yoshida)

What are the indications that Skenes is even available?

[Bellhorn04]

Brandon Walter, who was outright released by the Sox in 2024, is with Houston now.  In 5 starts he has pitched 29.2 innings with a 3.34 ERA and a 1.05 WHIP. 

[Nick]

14 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Nobody likes trading good players for crap. Some see the Devers trade as a salary dump and or clubhouse issue deal, and that's why we got crap. The salary savings being spent wisely is something we all doubt- both in terms of actually being spent and the "wisely" part. The Betts trade is beyond further debate, but we all hate that it happened.

My point is this: we don't look like a winning team, unless we go full buy mode at the deadline and trade away several good and maybe some top prospects, and even then, nothing is guaranteed. We can play it half way and sell moderate prospects that look blocked for moderate and short term gains that likely get us nowhere near a ring. Or we sell. We trade every free agent to be, except maybe Bregman, who we extend, and we make a strategic choice on which excess OF'er to trade. As much as I hate to see Duran traded, I think he makes the most sense, and a deadline trade means for prospects, unless we involve a third team and get a pitcher. (But, most likely only pitcher rentals are available- not the Crochet type of trade.)

I know it sucks, but to me, it might be the only way we can get a quick turn around and be winners in 2026.

I'm not sure we got 'crap' back. Assuming big part was a salary dump of Devers (in management's point of view, they are using 'bad teammate' as an excuse but I think it was the money).

We picked up a reliever, possibly a backend guy that throws 100 mph, Jordan Hicks with 2 years of team control after 2025 (yep, we're paying him $12M, more than Chapman, let that sink in how good of an acquisition Chapman was).

Kyle Harrison was highly thought of only a year ago. We have 4 more years of team control after 2025. We got couple of more guys.

I like to think we got more than a 'crap'.

[Nick]

Assuming Chapman is gone, who are our backend guys for 2026?

We are collecting hard throwers who can't throw strikes, or it seems.

1. Justin Slaten, 5 yrs of team control

2 Greg Weissert, 5 yrs of team control

3 Jordan Hicks, 3 yrs of team control

4 Jorge Alcala, 2 yrs of team control

5 Garret Whitlock (he's in my doghouse)

6 Louis Guerrero, 6 yrs of team control

7 Bernardino, 5 yrs of team control

7 Tanner Houck, we used to think he could be our closer

8  Kutter Crawford, we used to think he could be our closer

If we sell at trade deadline, it's time to start Realistic View, 2026 Part I

 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Brandon Walter, who was outright released by the Sox in 2024, is with Houston now.  In 5 starts he has pitched 29.2 innings with a 3.34 ERA and a 1.05 WHIP. 

The Astros have a secret they have kept hidden for many years.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, vjcsmoke said:

What are the indications that Skenes is even available?

Not that I've heard of, but I'd rather overpay for a guy like him than a top pitching prospect.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Nick said:

I'm not sure we got 'crap' back. Assuming big part was a salary dump of Devers (in management's point of view, they are using 'bad teammate' as an excuse but I think it was the money).

We picked up a reliever, possibly a backend guy that throws 100 mph, Jordan Hicks with 2 years of team control after 2025 (yep, we're paying him $12M, more than Chapman, let that sink in how good of an acquisition Chapman was).

Kyle Harrison was highly thought of only a year ago. We have 4 more years of team control after 2025. We got couple of more guys.

I like to think we got more than a 'crap'.

We'll see, and within the context of giving up Devers, I still think the return looks like Crap.

I was higher on Dugo and Jeter Downs than Harrison & Hicks, and look where they got us.

[Nick]

1 minute ago, moonslav59 said:

We'll see, and within the context of giving up Devers, I still think the return looks like Crap.

I was higher on Dugo and Jeter Downs than Harrison & Hicks, and look where they got us.

Like I said, it was a salary dump. Because the Giants took 100% of his contract, our return was going to be less. Yes, you maybe right.  Hey check out my post on 'Old is New Again'....I'd love to hear your thoughts. Maybe you've read the article.