Red Sox Relief Pitching 2023

[moonslav59]

Who the heck is Mata?

 

Our #5 prospect that was supposed to be ML ready, this year.

 

He was ranked 3rd before his injury.

[Hugh2]

Makes me wonder if anybody is tracking balls and strikes at the minor league spring training facility

 

This is baseball. They track everything.

[mvp 78]

@alexspeier

Red Sox will have RHP Chris Martin make a rehab appearance Thursday in Worcester, with hopes that he’ll be activated this weekend. James Paxton will make another start for the WooSox on Sunday.

 

My guess is Bernardino would be sent down to WOO for Martin. Ort for Paxton when ready in early May?

[Hugh2]

@alexspeier

Red Sox will have RHP Chris Martin make a rehab appearance Thursday in Worcester, with hopes that he’ll be activated this weekend. James Paxton will make another start for the WooSox on Sunday.

 

My guess is Bernardino would be sent down to WOO for Martin. Ort for Paxton when ready in early May?

 

It's weird. Paxton gets all these starts but they threw Bello into the fire after one start and only 2 IP in spring training.

[mvp 78]

It's weird. Paxton gets all these starts but they threw Bello into the fire after one start and only 2 IP in spring training.

 

Bello looked great in his start. Paxton has looked pretty terrible.

[mvp 78]

Bello looked great in his start. Paxton has looked pretty terrible.

 

MiLB Stats:

Bello 1 G, 6 Inn, 4 K, 0 BB, 1.50 ERA, 0.67 WHIP

Paxton 4 G, 11.1 Inn, 14 K, 10 BB, 10.32 ERA, 2.12 WHIP

[Hugh2]

MiLB Stats:

Bello 1 G, 6 Inn, 4 K, 0 BB, 1.50 ERA, 0.67 WHIP

Paxton 4 G, 11.1 Inn, 14 K, 10 BB, 10.32 ERA, 2.12 WHIP

 

1 start in AAA after having 2 IP in spring training. One start against a good team? a bad team? good hitters bad hitters? doesn't matter. He didn't ramp up like everyone else. He should have been given more time.

[mvp 78]

1 start in AAA after having 2 IP in spring training. One start against a good team? a bad team? good hitters bad hitters? doesn't matter. He didn't ramp up like everyone else. He should have been given more time.

 

They thought he was ready? The rotation was in rough shape and needed his help. Now he's back in AAA for another 10 days before he can be called up again.

[moonslav59]

They thought he was ready? The rotation was in rough shape and needed his help. Now he's back in AAA for another 10 days before he can be called up again.

 

Maybe they see Crawford as the better option, if a start is needed in the next 10 days.

[Hugh2]

They thought he was ready? The rotation was in rough shape and needed his help. Now he's back in AAA for another 10 days before he can be called up again.

 

I understand that, and perhaps they didn’t have a better move, I still think it was the wrong move.

 

He pitched two innings in spring training. So he effectively had none. And then they throw him out after one game? All the other Sox starters got about 4 starts. I’m not saying that completely explains away the poor results, but I don’t think you can rule it out either.

[Hugh2]

Also not sure how much “help” they needed rolling with a 6 man rotation.

[Nick]

I do want to see Bello as a starter BUT

 

I'm okay with Bello taking similar route as Whitlock.

 

That is, he can join Winckowski and Kutter as multiple inning guys, going as many as 3 or 4 innings.

 

If Bloom is indeed committed to Sale, Kluber and Paxton, there's no room for Bello.

 

It's about helping the big league team.

 

I really don't see him getting any better going up against AAA competition. And I believe he's better option than Brasier and Ort.

 

AND BELLO HAS SAID AS MUCH. HE THINKS HE BELONGS IN FENWAY. I AGREE.

 

It would be different had he had normal spring training work load and then pitched poorly. But he didn't get the normal workload. But despite that the team decided he was ready to pitch in the majors. Quit being freakin' cowards. Make a decision and stick to it and not tether every other day. Grow a pair, Bloom.

[moonslav59]

I do want to see Bello as a starter BUT

 

I'm okay with Bello taking similar route as Whitlock.

 

That is, he can join Winckowski and Kutter as multiple inning guys, going as many as 3 or 4 innings.

 

If Bloom is indeed committed to Sale, Kluber and Paxton, there's no room for Bello.

 

It's about helping the big league team.

 

I really don't see him getting any better going up against AAA competition. And I believe he's better option than Brasier and Ort.

 

AND BELLO HAS SAID AS MUCH. HE THINKS HE BELONGS IN FENWAY. I AGREE.

 

It would be different had he had normal spring training work load and then pitched poorly. But he didn't get the normal workload. But despite that the team decided he was ready to pitch in the majors. Quit being freakin' cowards. Make a decision and stick to it and not tether every other day. Grow a pair, Bloom.

 

I don't see more time in AAA as trying to get better by facing lesser batters, but as a sort of spring training he all but missed, totally.

 

There is no way our SP'ers will all stay healthy, and even if they do, my guess is one will continue sucking enough to be replaced by Bello.

 

Since Bello was never going to be allowed to pitch over 160 innings, anyway, what's the hurry? Let's find out which of the other starters doesn't belong or gets hurt, first.

[Old Red]

I’m not going to make any excuses for Bello. He looked the same as when he first come up last year. Kluber, and Sale sucked too coming out of ST, and they got plenty of work in, so you going to make excuses for them too. The only thing I agree with is going down to Worcester won’t make Bello any better in Boston. Also the innings add up just as much down there too.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I’m not going to make any excuses for Bello. He looked the same as when he first come up last year. Kluber, and Sale sucked too coming out of ST, and they got plenty of work in, so you going to make excuses for them too. The only thing I agree with is going down to Worcester won’t make Bello any better in Boston. Also the innings add up just as much down there too.

 

There comes a point where teams have to show faith in young pitchers with good stuff by giving them regular turns through the rotation. Bello has nothing more to prove in AAA.

 

Chances are his development in the bigs will follow a similar trajectory as in the minors. He struggled a bit at a very young age in his first stints in A and AA, then dominated each level the following season. If Bello is allowed to work his way through the ups and downs of a full MLB campaign, soaking up the knowledge of the old pros on the staff, he may emerge as a future ace as early as '24. His arm is already better than the vets Boston is counting on in '23...

[notin]

The Sox, like most teams, will probably need 10 or so starting pitchers this year. They’re keeping Bello where he is for depth, which is the same reason Kluber has not been DFAd. This isn’t about Bello “needing to work” on anything; this is about demoting the guy with options so you can keep everyone… Edited April 27, 2023 by notin

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The Sox, like most teams, will probably need 10 or so starting pitchers this year. They’re keeping Bello where he is for depth, which is the same reason Kluber has not been DFAd. This isn’t about Bello “needing to work” on anything; this is about demoting the guy with options so you can keep your everyone…

 

With one of the worst starting rotations in the majors, hopefully someone in payroll doesn't get to decide that the next option is to leave the Sox' best arm in the minors and instead call up the exoskeleton of Paxton.

[notin]

With one of the worst starting rotations in the majors, hopefully someone in payroll doesn't get to decide that the next option is to leave the Sox' best arm in the minors and instead call up the exoskeleton of Paxton.

 

So you think the Sox are going to pay Paxton $14mill since last year just to rehab and release him?

[Hugh2]

There comes a point where teams have to show faith in young pitchers with good stuff by giving them regular turns through the rotation. Bello has nothing more to prove in AAA.

 

Chances are his development in the bigs will follow a similar trajectory as in the minors. He struggled a bit at a very young age in his first stints in A and AA, then dominated each level the following season. If Bello is allowed to work his way through the ups and downs of a full MLB campaign, soaking up the knowledge of the old pros on the staff, he may emerge as a future ace as early as '24. His arm is already better than the vets Boston is counting on in '23...

 

This was my experience with Bello. I saw him pitch in AA in 2021 and 2022, three times, and BOY what a difference a year made once he got comfortable. I don't think anyone here is giving up on Bello right now, that's not the impression I get from any poster. Maybe a disagreement on where he should be pitching right now. You'd have to be an idiot to give up on that arm.

[Hugh2]

So you think the Sox are going to pay Paxton $14mill since last year just to rehab and release him?

 

I heard after Paxtons first start his velocity was there so the team told him to throw mostly offspeed and breaking pitches afterward. THat was two starts ago, I don't know if they asked him to do that in his last start nor did I look at the pitches thrown but if that is the case....it explains a lot and leaves me less concerned.

[mvp 78]

The Sox, like most teams, will probably need 10 or so starting pitchers this year. They’re keeping Bello where he is for depth, which is the same reason Kluber has not been DFAd. This isn’t about Bello “needing to work” on anything; this is about demoting the guy with options so you can keep your everyone…

 

He had 2 below average starts. I don't think him being sent to AAA is the end of the world here. They are going to run Kluber out there every 5 days at least through the ASB unless he gets injured. I think they are stuck with Sale for the whole season. They aren't going to take Whitlock or Houck out of the rotation right now. Would they really move Pivetta out of the rotation if Bello can't go 5 innings?

 

It's Pivetta/Houck vs Bello. Pivetta provides innings and gives the overused bullpen a little break. Houck has been arguably the best Sox starter this season. Why take him out of the rotation for Bello? I'm not sure Bello would be better than what Houck is currently doing.

[mvp 78]

I heard after Paxtons first start his velocity was there so the team told him to throw mostly offspeed and breaking pitches afterward. THat was two starts ago, I don't know if they asked him to do that in his last start nor did I look at the pitches thrown but if that is the case....it explains a lot and leaves me less concerned.

 

Is he treating these appearances like Spring Training outings and just "working on stuff?"

[Hugh2]

Is he treating these appearances like Spring Training outings and just "working on stuff?"

 

Thats what I heard about his second start, I have no ideal about his 3rd but you would think that is why the team would ask him to do that. Perhaps they think his other pitches are lagging behind the fastball. It sounds a little weird to me at this point, he should be up to speed by now after his 4th start.

[moonslav59]

I’m not going to make any excuses for Bello. He looked the same as when he first come up last year. Kluber, and Sale sucked too coming out of ST, and they got plenty of work in, so you going to make excuses for them too. The only thing I agree with is going down to Worcester won’t make Bello any better in Boston. Also the innings add up just as much down there too.

 

Bello pitched once in ST'ing. It wasn't about him and other "sucking" come out of ST'ing: it was about Bello having virtually no ST'ing at all.

[moonslav59]

There comes a point where teams have to show faith in young pitchers with good stuff by giving them regular turns through the rotation. Bello has nothing more to prove in AAA.

 

Chances are his development in the bigs will follow a similar trajectory as in the minors. He struggled a bit at a very young age in his first stints in A and AA, then dominated each level the following season. If Bello is allowed to work his way through the ups and downs of a full MLB campaign, soaking up the knowledge of the old pros on the staff, he may emerge as a future ace as early as '24. His arm is already better than the vets Boston is counting on in '23...

 

The minors are often used for other things than a "proving ground." It is also a place players go to rehab or get back into a groove, after missing time on the field.

[notin]

He had 2 below average starts. I don't think him being sent to AAA is the end of the world here. They are going to run Kluber out there every 5 days at least through the ASB unless he gets injured. I think they are stuck with Sale for the whole season. They aren't going to take Whitlock or Houck out of the rotation right now. Would they really move Pivetta out of the rotation if Bello can't go 5 innings?

 

It's Pivetta/Houck vs Bello. Pivetta provides innings and gives the overused bullpen a little break. Houck has been arguably the best Sox starter this season. Why take him out of the rotation for Bello? I'm not sure Bello would be better than what Houck is currently doing.

 

 

In the rare event everyone is healthy, Bello will be in Worcester. Not sure who goes to the bullpen, but I’m fine with sending anyone if it means demoting Ort…

[notin]

The minors are often used for other things than a "proving ground." It is also a place players go to rehab or get back into a groove, after missing time on the field.

 

AAA is also where many teams stash the 26-36 spots on their roster…

[moonslav59]

So you think the Sox are going to pay Paxton $14mill since last year just to rehab and release him?

 

Paxton made $6M in 2022 and will make $4M in 2023.

 

I'm sure the plan was never to rehab and release, but if he never shows he has regained his stuff, it could happen. (My guess is they give him a chance.)

[moonslav59]

AAA is also where many teams stash the 26-36 spots on their roster…

 

True, and maybe that's all Bello will amount to, but I see this as Spring Training II for Bello.

[Nick]

My argument is not Bello starting or not.

 

My argument is keeping Bello in AAA just as an emergency starter, to be available if a major league starter gets hurt. It has nothing to do with his performance apparently and Cora said so as much.

 

What logic is that? We are going to keep one of our 13 best pitchers on the farm? This is NOT the Rays team. We are in last place. And to think we have the LUXURY of keeping one of our top 13 pitchers RIGHT NOW on the farm?

 

So Bello is going to PAY THE PRICE because our current starters are bunch of pussies?

 

I'd fire our baseball people. I'm just getting tired of missteps. I'll say the same to Moon. It's idiotic to keep him 'stretched' IN CASE OF AN INJURY to someone else. We already have Kutter in that role.

Edited April 27, 2023 by Nick