Red Sox Sign Masataka Yoshida

[Maxbialystock]

Are you kidding? I said your comment was very credible.

[mvp 78]

Are you kidding? I said your comment was very credible.

 

"Stunning comment about Kyle Hudson coaching Duran on defense--and very credible."

 

This came across as sarcasm to me.

[moonslav59]

I think good defense combines athleticism, instinct and preparation. I think they are 3 different things.

 

How do you personally spot "instinct?"

 

What does it look like?

 

[Hugh2]

You can’t teach instincts. That’s the definition of instincts…

 

This is 100% accurate. Although to be fair, we probably misuse the word "instincts" a lot when referring to a player's abilities.

[Bellhorn04]

How do you personally spot "instinct?"

 

What does it look like?

 

 

Instinct is about when an outfielder consistently gets "good reads on the ball" and "takes good routes", that type of thing? Some of it could be taught but some would just be natural instincts?

[moonslav59]

Instinct is about when an outfielder consistently gets "good reads on the ball" and "takes good routes", that type of thing? Some of it could be taught but some would just be natural instincts?

 

Kinda what I'm getting at. It's hard to know.

[Bellhorn04]

Kinda what I'm getting at. It's hard to know.

 

Probably easier to spot the guys with bad instincts. Ones who might work hard but still get bad reads and jumps on the ball, and never become good fielders.

[moonslav59]

Probably easier to spot the guys with bad instincts. Ones who might work hard but still get bad reads and jumps on the ball, and never become good fielders.

 

Hard to identify it as being a lack of instincts or skills.

 

It seemed to me, and maybe others, that Duran lacked instincts and could not "be fixed" on D, since "you can't teach/learn instincts."

 

Ellsbury was abe to turn it around, but not overnight- like Duran seemingly just did.

[Maxbialystock]

"Stunning comment about Kyle Hudson coaching Duran on defense--and very credible."

 

This came across as sarcasm to me.

 

It was a stunning comment to me because we rarely read that coaches actually fixed something and I never heard of Kyle Hudson.

 

There is no way, no how "and very credible" can be interpreted as sarcasm.

[Maxbialystock]

I'm sorry but the idea that "instincts" are genetic and therefore cannot be improved upon is just complete and utter horsehockey.

 

Human beings are born with the capacity to read and write, but absolutely none of us can do it without some coaching/teaching. Everything we do that seems instinctual can be improved upon or, if not there at all, compensated for because the human brain is nothing if not incredibly adaptive.

 

As for baseball players, is everyone on this board unaware that the Rays have a terrific system for not only discovering baseball talent, but also for improving it?

 

On the other hand, moonslav has just pointed out that the Red Sox have historically--going back at least 24 years to 1999 if not further--been almost completely incapable of finding and developing good pitchers.

 

We all know that JBJ had a terrific ability to anticipate where a ball was going, but we don't know how much of that was purely instinctual--it was in his genes--and how much was the result of a lot of practice and thought and--heaven forbid--FREAKING COACHING.

 

Ted Williams was a great natural hitter--great eyesight and reflexes--but he was also a student of hitting and practiced it all the time.

 

As for Duran, he's already fast. A scouting report says he has over-relied on his speed. However, the same report says he also has a terrific work ethic and should be able to improve his routes and be an average outfielder.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm sorry but the idea that "instincts" are genetic and therefore cannot be improved upon is just complete and utter horsehockey.

 

Human beings are born with the capacity to read and write, but absolutely none of us can do it without some coaching/teaching. Everything we do that seems instinctual can be improved upon or, if not there at all, compensated for because the human brain is nothing if not incredibly adaptive.

 

As for baseball players, is everyone on this board unaware that the Rays have a terrific system for not only discovering baseball talent, but also for improving it?

 

On the other hand, moonslav has just pointed out that the Red Sox have historically--going back at least 24 years to 1999 if not further--been almost completely incapable of finding and developing good pitchers.

 

We all know that JBJ had a terrific ability to anticipate where a ball was going, but we don't know how much of that was purely instinctual--it was in his genes--and how much was the result of a lot of practice and thought and--heaven forbid--FREAKING COACHING.

 

Ted Williams was a great natural hitter--great eyesight and reflexes--but he was also a student of hitting and practiced it all the time.

 

As for Duran, he's already fast. A scouting report says he has over-relied on his speed. However, the same report says he also has a terrific work ethic and should be able to improve his routes and be an average outfielder.

 

Williams is a good example of success coming from both natural abilities and hard work.

 

Some of it is absolutely genetic. It has to be, no way around it.

 

If there was no genetic factor involved, every hitter who worked hard could be Ted Williams.

[Maxbialystock]

Williams is a good example of success coming from both natural abilities and hard work.

 

Some of it is absolutely genetic. It has to be, no way around it.

 

If there was no genetic factor involved, every hitter who worked hard could be Ted Williams.

 

Completely agree genes are part of it, even a big part.

 

But we are talking about Duran's defense, not a lifetime batting average of .344 and an unreal OPS of 1.116.

 

And we're not even talking about Duran being as good as, say, JBJ. We just need him to be average. He's already got speed and a work ethic. Apparently--and this comes as a huge surprise to me--he even has some coaching.

[notin]

This is 100% accurate. Although to be fair, we probably misuse the word "instincts" a lot when referring to a player's abilities.

 

Not sure why we don’t just use the word “abilities”.

 

It’s funny how the baseball community likes to over-explain some things and still misses out on how complicated they really are…

[mvp 78]

Not sure why we don’t just use the word “abilities”.

 

It’s funny how the baseball community likes to over-explain some things and still misses out on how complicated they really are…

 

It's easy to fall into 1970's scout brain. It's just the terminology that has been around the game for a long time.

[Bellhorn04]

Not sure why we don’t just use the word “abilities”.

 

This does makes sense.

[moonslav59]

It seems like we all know guys who just seem to pick up a sport easily and naturally, without much effort.

 

I'm not trying to define "instincts" as not involving effort and practice, and it is a hard term to understand.

 

To me, anticipation is a big part of baseball "instincts," but even that can be viewed as a skill- like an defender watching pitch location, bat angle and timing of the swing to figure out what direction the ball will likely be hit. Maybe he begins leaning that way before the hit. On the batting end, I think so much is related to eyesight and and the brain's ability to recognize spatial things and moving objects. Is that a skill, an ability or an instinct?

[Bellhorn04]

It seems like we all know guys who just seem to pick up a sport easily and naturally, without much effort.

 

I'm not trying to define "instincts" as not involving effort and practice, and it is a hard term to understand.

 

To me, anticipation is a big part of baseball "instincts," but even that can be viewed as a skill- like an defender watching pitch location, bat angle and timing of the swing to figure out what direction the ball will likely be hit. Maybe he begins leaning that way before the hit. On the batting end, I think so much is related to eyesight and and the brain's ability to recognize spatial things and moving objects. Is that a skill, an ability or an instinct?

 

As notin said, we have a tendency to take complicated things and try to make them simpler than they are. The lines between some of these things are not clear.

[moonslav59]

As notin said, we have a tendency to take complicated things and try to make them simpler than they are. The lines between some of these things are not clear.

 

I totally agree. And then you have a guy like Ted, who certainly had a natural gift but also worked super hard at maximizing his potential. He seemed to have instincts, ability and skills, but which was which and how much of each created who he was?

 

There is no answer.

 

Trying to just define these terms could take pages and pages of back and forths.

[Bellhorn04]

I totally agree. And then you have a guy like Ted, who certainly had a natural gift but also worked super hard at maximizing his potential. He seemed to have instincts, ability and skills, but which was which and how much of each created who he was?

 

There is no answer.

 

Trying to just define these terms could take pages and pages of back and forths.

 

Absolutely. To me guys like Williams and Nolan Ryan are what you call freaks of nature. Nobody else who could do what they did, no matter how hard they worked and studied. It's obvious there are some qualities you're either born with or not.

[moonslav59]

I hope Yoshida can keep this up.

 

His approach hints at a yes, but in baseball, one never knows.

[sk7326]

I hope Yoshida can keep this up.

 

His approach hints at a yes, but in baseball, one never knows.

 

He has been making good contact - which was always the question ... just because that has not always been a given going from NPB to MLB. I don't know how much more there is - but this version of the player is totally worth $18M/yr, even if it'd probably be better as a full time DH.

[moonslav59]

He has been making good contact - which was always the question ... just because that has not always been a given going from NPB to MLB. I don't know how much more there is - but this version of the player is totally worth $18M/yr, even if it'd probably be better as a full time DH.

 

Once Turner's time is up, he likely will be used there much more often.

[Nick]

JD went from sometime outfielder to full time DH during his 4 year deal.

 

Yoshida is younger and it's nice to know he can play left field even during his 4th and 5th year.

[moonslav59]

JD went from sometime outfielder to full time DH during his 4 year deal.

 

Yoshida is younger and it's nice to know he can play left field even during his 4th and 5th year.

 

The big plus is there is no longer a need to make him play OF in NL parks.

[Nick]

The big plus is there is no longer a need to make him play OF in NL parks.

 

I am now glad we didn't sign Schwarber.

[moonslav59]

I am now glad we didn't sign Schwarber.

 

I think a lot of Sox fans are coming around to the same position.

[notin]

I think a lot of Sox fans are coming around to the same position.

 

2023 YTD

 

Schwarber -.693 OPS

Bogaerts - .787 OPS

Yoshida - .871 OPS

[moonslav59]

2023 YTD

 

Schwarber -.693 OPS

Bogaerts - .787 OPS

Yoshida - .871 OPS

 

Hell, Turner has those two beat.

[redsoxrules]

Yoshida has a .8 WAR so far. Don't get too excited just yet.

[moonslav59]

Yoshida has a .8 WAR so far. Don't get too excited just yet.

 

His D drags down the WAR, and we knew about that, but your point still stands.