2022 Bullpen Thread

[Kimmi]

The mvp of this season for the Red Sox could very well end up being the training staff. We have had a ton of injuries.

 

However, when relatively healthy, we were a top 5 American league team.

 

Any time your team is fielding 4 triple a starters and 3 triple a position players, against the likes of Tampa and New York, your record will suffer.

 

The biggest question is how quickly our pro roster will get healthy? Could answer if we are buyers or sellers in the next 10-12 days!

 

Solid post Larry.

[Kimmi]

I think the 2021 Red Sox, who led the division for a long time until a late swoon, were a really good team and much better than the 2022 version. This team has just shown very little fight. I'm not a believer.

 

Believe, MVP, believe.

[mvp 78]

Head to head competition means almost nothing when it comes to the postseason. I understand not wanting to let guys walk away for nothing, but I can't get on board with quitting on the team when they are right in the hunt with almost half the season to go.

 

They are as close to .500 as they are to playoff contention. I just don't see this team as having a real shot in the postseason. They aren't a very strong ballclub. It's not the crapshoot people make it out to be IMO.

 

This team is worse hitting than last year (10th fWAR in 21, now 14th).

 

This team has worse starting pitching than last year (6th fWAR in 21, now 16th).

 

This team has worse relief pitching than last year (9th in fWAR in 21, now 19th).

 

They don't look like a team that is worth putting all your chips on and letting it ride.

[notin]

They are as close to .500 as they are to playoff contention. I just don't see this team as having a real shot in the postseason. They aren't a very strong ballclub. It's not the crapshoot people make it out to be IMO.

 

This team is worse hitting than last year (10th fWAR in 21, now 14th).

 

This team has worse starting pitching than last year (6th fWAR in 21, now 16th).

 

This team has worse relief pitching than last year (9th in fWAR in 21, now 19th).

 

They don't look like a team that is worth putting all your chips on and letting it ride.

 

They’re an admitted long shot, but I don’t think selling makes sense. Rental prices for Eovaldi and Bogaerts may not even exceed draft pick comps.

 

I’d add some pieces, preferably non-rental, and stay in the hunt. And maybe it gets easier if another borderline contender goes into sell mode…

[mvp 78]

They’re an admitted long shot, but I don’t think selling makes sense. Rental prices for Eovaldi and Bogaerts may not even exceed draft pick comps.

I’d add some pieces, preferably non-rental, and stay in the hunt. And maybe it gets easier if another borderline contender goes into sell mode…

 

You think you'd get less than a comp pick for Bogaerts, but that he's going to sign some sort of max deal in the offseason? Huh?

 

That's not how the trade deadline ever works.

[Bellhorn04]

You think you'd get less than a comp pick for Bogaerts, but that he's going to sign some sort of max deal in the offseason? Huh?

 

That's not how the trade deadline ever works.

 

What did the O's get for Machado?

 

Actually, I see they got quite a little grab bag...

[Kimmi]

They are as close to .500 as they are to playoff contention. I just don't see this team as having a real shot in the postseason. They aren't a very strong ballclub. It's not the crapshoot people make it out to be IMO.

 

This team is worse hitting than last year (10th fWAR in 21, now 14th).

 

This team has worse starting pitching than last year (6th fWAR in 21, now 16th).

 

This team has worse relief pitching than last year (9th in fWAR in 21, now 19th).

 

They don't look like a team that is worth putting all your chips on and letting it ride.

 

Just a few short weeks ago, those numbers looked so much better though. If the Sox continue the poor play coming out of the ASB, then we might have different considerations. At the moment, I can't see us being sellers.

 

I wouldn't call it putting all our chips on this team. I'm not expecting Bloom to go all in to win this year. He isn't going to harm the current long term outlook. He might not add to it by trading away all our big players, but he won't harm it.

[mvp 78]

Just a few short weeks ago, those numbers looked so much better though. If the Sox continue the poor play coming out of the ASB, then we might have different considerations. At the moment, I can't see us being sellers.

 

I wouldn't call it putting all our chips on this team. I'm not expecting Bloom to go all in to win this year. He isn't going to harm the current long term outlook. He might not add to it by trading away all our big players, but he won't harm it.

 

I just think letting some of these guys walk out of the door for nothing is harming the team. That's how I see. I think it's more important that a failed playoff run. Unfortunately, I'm too glass is half empty on this year's team. I just don't have your optimism this year.

[Bellhorn04]

The way I look at it, 2022 has been mostly a year of suffering. I'd prefer that the suffering isn't totally meaningless.

[mvp 78]

The way I look at it, 2022 has been mostly a year of suffering. I'd prefer that the suffering isn't totally meaningless.

 

Are you saying there's a greater purpose to this? If there is, you need to share.

[Bellhorn04]

Are you saying there's a greater purpose to this? If there is, you need to share.

 

Well, I must admit I was speaking rather selfishly. But of course I always hope for the best for the team and for all of Red Sox Nation.

[mvp 78]

Well, I must admit I was speaking rather selfishly. But of course I always hope for the best for the team and for all of Red Sox Nation.

 

Pain. Just pain.

[Kimmi]

I just think letting some of these guys walk out of the door for nothing is harming the team. That's how I see. I think it's more important that a failed playoff run. Unfortunately, I'm too glass is half empty on this year's team. I just don't have your optimism this year.

 

If I didn't think the Sox had a legitimate chance, I'd with with you on selling. Since I do think they have a legitimate chance, I can't accept us being sellers.

[Kimmi]

The way I look at it, 2022 has been mostly a year of suffering. I'd prefer that the suffering isn't totally meaningless.

 

There has been a lot of suffering when it comes to this year's Red Sox. I am emotionally exhausted from this team. LOL That's why we're fans though.

[mvp 78]

There has been a lot of suffering when it comes to this year's Red Sox. I am emotionally exhausted from this team. LOL That's why we're fans though.

 

I just need a little sign of life. That's all I need.

[moonslav59]

I just need a little sign of life. That's all I need.

 

I'm not there yet, but I'm getting close to thinking even a sign of life might be a false flag, again.

 

To me, the choice of buying or selling will depend mostly on the status of our injured players at deadline time. If they are not looking healthy, and guys like Pivetta, Strahm, Verdugo and Story are still struggling, I'm think the future becomes my higher priority. (I have no idea what Bloom might think.)

 

Yes, this team has shown it can fight back, but it has also shown, more often and too often, that it can implode at any given moment.

[mvp 78]

I'm not there yet, but I'm getting close to thinking even a sign of life might be a false flag, again.

 

That's not an analogy that makes any sense.

[moonslav59]

That's not an analogy that makes any sense.

 

We've seen "signs of life" often this year, only to see a reversal of fortunes to follow.

 

The pattern seems to be a steady up and down trend.

 

If we look good right after the ASB, I'm saying I might not feel like it will be a long lasting trend. I may feel more like I'm expecting a future let down- again.

 

It's just a feel. It's not data based.

 

I had the same feeling in 2019 and gave up on the team very early. Earlier than most. I'm not there yet, but I have deep reservations about this year's team. To me, we need almost all our horses to have a chance, and already it looks like Sale, Kike and Barnes are pretty much done for the majority of the second half of the season. Pivetta might just be going through his normal 2-4 game funk, and will come back. e should know that by the deadline. If he's not looking good, and Wacha, Hill and others on the short term IL are not looking good at the deadline, I'm thinking I'll be leaning towards us being sellers.

 

I have not given up, yet, but I'm not far from that idea.

[mvp 78]

@BeyondtheMnstr

The Red Sox have designated righty Phillips Valdez for assignment and have moved newly acquired outfielder Abraham Almonte onto the 40-man roster.

[JDavis76]

@BeyondtheMnstr

The Red Sox have designated righty Phillips Valdez for assignment and have moved newly acquired outfielder Abraham Almonte onto the 40-man roster.

 

That's a game changer!!!

[moonslav59]

@BeyondtheMnstr

The Red Sox have designated righty Phillips Valdez for assignment and have moved newly acquired outfielder Abraham Almonte onto the 40-man roster.

 

I have more faith in Valdez than Diekman, but with the contracts involved, it's understandable.

 

Besides, maybe Valdez ends up staying in our minors as a non 40 man guy.

 

Whoopie!!!

[Old Red]

No more Streakman. No more Robles. Which one of Bloom’s cracker jacks prizes will be next?

[Hugh2]

No more Streakman. No more Robles. Which one of Bloom’s cracker jacks prizes will be next?

 

Relief pitchers are always a crapshoot, besides the best of the best.

 

Robles was acquired for Schraffts who is currently laying eggs in AA. Robles was also pretty good for the Sox down the stretch last year including the playoffs. He served his purpose……perhaps a little too long.

[mvp 78]

No more Streakman. No more Robles. Which one of Bloom’s cracker jacks prizes will be next?

 

If Bloom was unable to unload the full Diekman contract, I’m happy.

[mvp 78]

Relief pitchers are always a crapshoot, besides the best of the best.

 

Robles was acquired for Schraffts who is currently laying eggs in AA. Robles was also pretty good for the Sox down the stretch last year including the playoffs. He served his purpose……perhaps a little too long.

 

Scherff

[Larry Cook]

If Bloom was unable to unload the full Diekman contract, I’m happy.

 

I give Hang’em Chaim an “A plus” on the diekman trade, regardless of who the player to be named is.

[Old Red]

Barnes has looked better lately, and it couldn’t have come at a better time with Houck looks like being out for some time, and Whitlock, and Schreiber both been worked hard the last few weeks. Don’t know if Barnes can keep it up, but will be huge if he can.

[notin]

I give Hang’em Chaim an “A plus” on the diekman trade, regardless of who the player to be named is.

 

He was named Reese McGuire…

[moonslav59]

If Bloom was unable to unload the full Diekman contract, I’m happy.

 

If he had just traded him for air, I'd have been happy. We saved $4M, next year.

 

Getting McGuire, a decent back-up catcher with possibilities for being better just adds icing to the cake.

 

The overall view of Bloom's deadline deals seems to be coming more into focus and favor among fans and posters.

 

We also added 4 prospects and lost Groome:

 

16. E Valdez: may compete for the 2B and DH openings, next year.

26. Wilyer Abreu: adding some OF depth we sorely needed

56. Corey Rosier: more OF depth with some upside on O

57. Max Ferguson: low level middle IF'er

 

Now that Hosmer is paid for, he has a +6.5 value on BTV.

McGuire is at +2.4

Pham is listed at -1.5

 

Prospects added:

2.1 W Abreu

1.8 Rosier

1.2 E Valdez

1.2 Ferguson

 

 

Draftees:

8.7 Romero

6.5 Coffey

2.1 Anthony

 

Traded away:

+3.5 Groome (prospect)

0.0 Vazquez

-4.3 Diekman

??? PTBNL for Pham

 

 

[moonslav59]

If he had just traded him for air, I'd have been happy. We saved $4M, next year.

 

Getting McGuire, a decent back-up catcher with possibilities for being better just adds icing to the cake.

 

The overall view of Bloom's deadline deals seems to be coming more into focus and favor among fans and posters.

 

We also added 4 prospects and lost Groome:

 

16. E Valdez: may compete for the 2B and DH openings, next year.

26. Wilyer Abreu: adding some OF depth we sorely needed

56. Corey Rosier: more OF depth with some upside on O

57. Max Ferguson: low level middle IF'er

 

Now that Hosmer is paid for, he has a +6.5 value on BTV.

McGuire is at +2.4

Pham is listed at -1.5

 

Prospects added:

2.1 W Abreu

1.8 Rosier

1.2 E Valdez

1.2 Ferguson

 

 

Draftees:

8.7 Romero

6.5 Coffey

2.1 Anthony

 

Traded away:

+3.5 Groome (prospect)

0.0 Vazquez

-4.3 Diekman

??? PTBNL for Pham

 

 

 

Total Trade BTV net?

+10.4 MLB talent (Hosmer/Pham/McGuire)

-4.3 MLB talent (Vaz & Diekman)

+14.7 Net gain

 

Prospects: +2.8 (pending PTBNL)

+6.3 (Abreu, Valdez, Rosier & Ferguson)

-3.5 Groome + PTBNL

 

TOTAL +17.5