Red Sox trade Hunter Renfroe in trade involving Jackie Bradley Jr

[Old Red]

The really stupid part of the anti-metric cord is they still cling to metrics but they pretend they don’t…

 

Eye test is all I need, and all I ever will.

[moonslav59]

Let’s get back to when Real Men with Real Beards ran the Red Sox while they Chewed Tobacco and Raw Steel and randomly Capitalized Letters in the Middle of Sentences !!

 

And the team also went 86 years without a title!!

 

MSGA!

 

Make the Sox Great Again!

[moonslav59]

Let’s get back to when Real Men with Real Beards ran the Red Sox while they Chewed Tobacco and Raw Steel and randomly Capitalized Letters in the Middle of Sentences !!

 

And the team also went 86 years without a title!!

 

God, I miss the days we "forgot" to send Fisk his contract on time.

[notin]

Eye test is all I need, and all I ever will.

 

So you never mention ERA?

[Old Red]

So you never mention ERA?

 

ERA has been around way before analytics were even thought of. I’m not really big on it though.

[moonslav59]

So you never mention ERA?

 

ERA is just some nerd's fabrication, as is BA.

[Old Red]

ERA is just some nerd's fabrication, as is BA.

 

I prefer the old Sporting News box scores myself.

[notin]

Eye test is all I need, and all I ever will.

 

Has the Eye Test noticed how horrific the Sox outfield defense has been since Bradley was DFAd?

 

The mistake wasn’t trading for Bradley; it was DFAing him…

[notin]

I prefer the old Sporting News box scores myself.

 

Didn’t they stop printing that like 10 years ago?

[redsoxrules]

Has the Eye Test noticed how horrific the Sox outfield defense has been since Bradley was DFAd?

 

The mistake wasn’t trading for Bradley; it was DFAing him…

 

Bradley has already f***ed up quite a few plays with the Jay's already on defense. And yes the mistake was trading for him. Renfroe alone is out producing the Sox outfield this year

[redsoxrules]

Jay's already looking to release JBJ. They are looking at Billy Hamilton. That's how bad he is.

[moonslav59]

Has the Eye Test noticed how horrific the Sox outfield defense has been since Bradley was DFAd?

 

The mistake wasn’t trading for Bradley; it was DFAing him…

 

lmao!

[Old Red]

Has the Eye Test noticed how horrific the Sox outfield defense has been since Bradley was DFAd?

 

The mistake wasn’t trading for Bradley; it was DFAing him…

 

Yes the eye test has noticed that, and on the game thread last night I suggested Dugy back in LF, Kike in CF, and the Ref Man in RF with Pham the DH.

[Old Red]

Didn’t they stop printing that like 10 years ago?

 

I liked the Old Sporting News that was actually a news paper with pages of box scores.

[jad]

Those of you deriding the "eye-test," please explain in plain language how the various WARs differ; things like 'fielding runs above average,' 'base-running runs' (how does that differ from 'runs scored'?), positional adjustment and easily quantifiable things like that.

[Bellhorn04]

Those of you deriding the "eye-test," please explain in plain language how the various WARs differ; things like 'fielding runs above average,' 'base-running runs' (how does that differ from 'runs scored'?), positional adjustment and easily quantifiable things like that.

 

I'll just tackle the base-running one.

 

The principle is that over the course of a season, good/fast base-running is going to result in more runs than bad/slow base-running. Mookie Betts is going to produce more runs with his feet than J. D. Martinez, for example. That's easy enough to understand. The WAR calculations attempt to determine exactly how many runs a good base-runner has added, compared to a baseline player-the infamous "replacement player". The replacement player is sort of the same thing we hear called an AAAA player.

[Bellhorn04]

I liked the Old Sporting News that was actually a news paper with pages of box scores.

 

I loved the Old Sporting News. I also loved Baseball Digest.

 

Now here's a question: is reading a box score part of the eye-test?

[Hugh2]

Those of you deriding the "eye-test," please explain in plain language how the various WARs differ; things like 'fielding runs above average,' 'base-running runs' (how does that differ from 'runs scored'?), positional adjustment and easily quantifiable things like that.

 

Why do you need fans to explain this to you when you can look it up. It would be like asking your uncle to explain vaccines to you instead of your doctor. WAR is a very understandable concept, it’s formulation is no secret and you can easily look it up and understand it yourself. This just screams bating, if you have a problem with WAR, why not specifically state what that problem is and how’s its calculation is flawed

[cp176]

I loved the Old Sporting News. I also loved Baseball Digest.

 

Now here's a question: is reading a box score part of the eye-test?

 

Answer = Did you use your eyes? Good to see that we are starting to come full circle here. I'm all about momentum and clutch as well. There has always been only so much this brain could hold. Box scores worked pretty well for me and still do actually.

[Bellhorn04]

Answer = Did you use your eyes? Good to see that we are starting to come full circle here. I'm all about momentum and clutch as well. There has always been only so much this brain could hold. Box scores worked pretty well for me and still do actually.

 

You have to use your eyes to read every stat there is. Ergo, advanced stats are part of the eye-test. Done.

[cp176]

You have to use your eyes to read every stat there is. Ergo, advanced stats are part of the eye-test. Done.

 

Limit your statistical reading. Too much of anything can be a bad thing. Pick 4 stats that you like the most and go with them. Keeps headaches to a minimum. Plus the fact that you might not become a pain in the ass to others by trying to impress them with a solid grasp of possibly some useless information.

[Bellhorn04]

Limit your statistical reading. Too much of anything can be a bad thing. Pick 4 stats that you like the most and go with them. Keeps headaches to a minimum. Plus the fact that you might not become a pain in the ass to others by trying to impress them with a solid grasp of possibly some useless information.

 

Some people find the "all I need is the eye-test" people a real pain in the ass too.

 

I think we all just need to accept each others' different views.

[Bellhorn04]

At the end of the day, all Red Sox fans like the same thing-Red Sox wins. And hate the same thing-Red Sox losses.

 

The rest is just stuff to jabber about for entertainment purposes.

[Old Red]

Some people find the "all I need is the eye-test" people a real pain in the ass too.

 

I think we all just need to accept each others' different views.

 

I’m all for that. I have no problem with all the analytics, but to me what always threw people in a lather is when I have done many times, and said I don’t need analytics to know what’s going on, and the eye test is good enough for me. Bloom is another good example of just accepting each other’s different views. Like I have said also if just agreeing to disagree happened some of the subjects wouldn’t be beaten to death, and it getting personal maybe wouldn’t happen.

[Old Red]

At the end of the day, all Red Sox fans like the same thing-Red Sox wins. And hate the same thing-Red Sox losses.

 

The rest is just stuff to jabber about for entertainment purposes.

 

Well said, and agree 100%.

[Hugh2]

When it comes to evaluating talent teams use both methods. Statistics gives insights the eye tests can not and is not as subjective, it’s absolute. The eye test shows us things not seem in the stats, the WHY at times. Also, the quality of the eyes matter too, we don’t see Jack thru the TV.

[cp176]

Some people find the "all I need is the eye-test" people a real pain in the ass too.

 

I think we all just need to accept each others' different views.

 

i've been called a pain in the ass by many and i am completely comfortable with it. I wonder if others posting here prolifically can say the same?

[jad]

Why do you need fans to explain this to you when you can look it up. It would be like asking your uncle to explain vaccines to you instead of your doctor. WAR is a very understandable concept, it’s formulation is no secret and you can easily look it up and understand it yourself. This just screams bating, if you have a problem with WAR, why not specifically state what that problem is and how’s its calculation is flawed

 

I have looked it up of course. Many times. And you still did not answer in plain language how you calculate base-running. And how your calculations differ from 'the eye test'. Here, for example, is one of many explanations of how 'runs scored' is calculated: "For batting runs we use a linear weights system based on Tom Tango's wOBA (weighted on-base average) framework, but we add a number of improvements to our calculation of wRAA (weighted runs above average)." Please explain that in a manner that will convince an average reader that you understand it.

[notin]

I liked the Old Sporting News that was actually a news paper with pages of box scores.

 

Yes. That’s been out of print for 10-15 years.

 

Of purse box scores are nothing but metrics…

[Bellhorn04]

I have looked it up of course. Many times. And you still did not answer in plain language how you calculate base-running. And how your calculations differ from 'the eye test'. Here, for example, is one of many explanations of how 'runs scored' is calculated: "For batting runs we use a linear weights system based on Tom Tango's wOBA (weighted on-base average) framework, but we add a number of improvements to our calculation of wRAA (weighted runs above average)." Please explain that in a manner that will convince an average reader that you understand it.

 

We've been over this so many times. I don't have to know how everything in my car works in order to drive it. I accept that it's been designed and built by people who have all the expertise in that area. That's the way the world works.