Sox signing Wacha

[moonslav59]

Since the start of the 2019 season Michael Wacha has posted an ERA of 5.11 and ERA+ of 80 in 285.1 innings while Martin Perez, who is three months older than Wacha, has posted an ERA of 4.88 and ERA+ of 95 in 341.1 innings.

 

So? Should I care?

 

ERA is so passe.

[Bellhorn04]

So much whinin' over one little signin'.

[notin]

So much whinin' over one little signin'.

 

Well it might fill out the rotation.

 

Opening day, 2022 rotation might be Sale, Eovaldi, Whitlock, Pivetta and Wacha…

[Old Red]

Since the start of the 2019 season Michael Wacha has posted an ERA of 5.11 and ERA+ of 80 in 285.1 innings while Martin Perez, who is three months older than Wacha, has posted an ERA of 4.88 and ERA+ of 95 in 341.1 innings.

 

Both together aren’t worth $7M let alone one of them. That $7M could be put to better use.

[moonslav59]

Yes, but that 5.05 was an improvement from his 6.62 from the year before. What a prize pickup. NOT.

 

This move does not excite me, but let’s give it time. Renfroe, Kike and Whitlock didn’t excite me much either.

[Bellhorn04]

It’s Henry I’m not sure about.

 

It’s about the budget not Bloom to me.

 

So you've lost faith in Henry then.

[harmony]

So? Should I care?

 

ERA is so passe.

Why should anyone care about a bald opinion?

 

FWIW since the start of the 2019 season Michael Wacha has posted 0.8 fWAR and a negative 0.9 bWAR while Martin Perez has posted 2.8 fWAR and 1.7 bWAR.

 

Steamer projects 2022 WAR of 1.2 in 125 innings for Wacha and 1.2 in 120 innings for Perez.

Edited November 27, 2021 by harmony

[Old Red]

So you've lost faith in Henry then.

 

Yes on JH.

[Old Red]

Why should anyone care about a bald opinion?

 

FWIW since the start of the 2019 season Michael Wacha has posted 0.8 fWAR and a negative 0.9 bWAR while Martin Perez has posted 2.8 fWAR and 1.7 bWAR.

 

I would rather have Rich Hill then these two.

[Old Red]

This move does not excite me, but let’s give it time. Renfroe, Kike and Whitlock didn’t excite me much either.

 

Yes, but this guy has pretty much sucked for the last 3 years unlike the other guys.

[moonslav59]

Yes, but this guy has pretty much sucked for the last 3 years unlike the other guys.

 

I won’t disagree, but I trust Bloom to get more right than wrong.

 

$7M seems like too much, but it’s the going rate.

[dgalehouse]

Bloom takes a dump in left field. Moonslav: " Bloom is helping the grounds crew to fertilize the Fenway grass. "

[notin]

Bloom takes a dump in left field. Moonslav: " Bloom is helping the grounds crew to fertilize the Fenway grass. "

 

 

Yeah no one understands why people might have faith in Bloom! I mean, a lot of people predicted last years team would win 75 games!! And damnit, they were all right! And would have been even more right if the Sox didn’t with those 17 other games!! And those 7 postseason games!!

 

Bloom should have earned some credibility last year. Just because he didn’t win a ring doesn’t mean he didn’t do a good job and show he knows what he’s doing…

[notin]

The good: Wacha has seen his FB velocity increase the past two seasons

The question: So? He still really didn’t pitch that well despite throwing harder.

 

The good: Lowest xFIP since his best season.

The question: So? His HR/FB was atrocious and he pitched in the best (for pitchers) home run park in the AL East

 

The good: I agree he’s probably replacing Perez and not ERod.

The question: Why not just upgrade when replacing Perez, too? Also, maybe he’s not replacing ERod, but does that mean Sale is?

[Old Red]

Yeah no one understands why people might have faith in Bloom! I mean, a lot of people predicted last years team would win 75 games!! And damnit, they were all right! And would have been even more right if the Sox didn’t with those 17 other games!! And those 7 postseason games!!

 

Bloom should have earned some credibility last year. Just because he didn’t win a ring doesn’t mean he didn’t do a good job and show he knows what he’s doing…

 

If Bloom had a bigger allowance from daddy JH he probably wouldn’t have made a Whacka move like this, but getting only nickel and dimes these are the kind of moves fans better get used to.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The good: Wacha has seen his FB velocity increase the past two seasons

The question: So? He still really didn’t pitch that well despite throwing harder.

 

The good: Lowest xFIP since his best season.

The question: So? His HR/FB was atrocious and he pitched in the best (for pitchers) home run park in the AL East

 

The good: I agree he’s probably replacing Perez and not ERod.

The question: Why not just upgrade when replacing Perez, too? Also, maybe he’s not replacing ERod, but does that mean Sale is?

 

Wacha doesn't have to carry the staff, but he should at least carry a tune. Otherwise, peeps who like music aren't going to like this tradeoff.

 

If you watched Sox games on NESN the last month of the season, you'd know Perez gave up a singing career to be a professional pitcher. He told us that in the commercial they ran 78 times a day (but not 78 rpm).

[Hugh2]

If Bloom had a bigger allowance from daddy JH he probably wouldn’t have made a Whacka move like this, but getting only nickel and dimes these are the kind of moves fans better get used to.

 

I think you have it reversed. The fact that Bloom can spend $7 million on 5th/6th/swing type pitcher alludes to the Sox not being afraid to go over the luxury tax in 2022, which has been reported before. Expect more moves.

[moonslav59]

Bloom takes a dump in left field. Moonslav: " Bloom is helping the grounds crew to fertilize the Fenway grass. "

 

Maybe.

 

He did with Perez, Richards and others. He got some right, too.

[Nick]

I think it's a great signing. He misses bats. He ended the season on a good note. He abandoned his cutter for his curveball. He's willing to make changes. He's going to work on his cutter this off season. Change up is his bread and butter.

 

Full season of Sale will replace E Rod. I would bet on Sale to have better year than E Rod.

 

Eovaldi and Pivetta returns.

 

Wacha replaces Perez, and he'll be better, book it.

 

Whitlock will be better than Richards, so will Houck.

 

Our starting pitching is better and we saved $25M in the process.

 

I love Bloom.

[Nick]

Cot's has Sox now at $187,450 including projected arbitration raises for 9 players. (Yanks at $220M, they're already over)

 

JD $22M and Price $16M come off the books after this season.

 

Eovaldi, Vaz and Kike all will be free agents along with newly signed Wacha.

 

We could decided to go spend one year early, giving Sox at minimum $38M plus whatever we're under the luxury tax, if any, with new CBA.

Edited November 28, 2021 by Nick

[Old Red]

I think it's a great signing. He misses bats. He ended the season on a good note. He abandoned his cutter for his curveball. He's willing to make changes. He's going to work on his cutter this off season. Change up is his bread and butter.

 

Full season of Sale will replace E Rod. I would bet on Sale to have better year than E Rod.

 

Eovaldi and Pivetta returns.

 

Wacha replaces Perez, and he'll be better, book it.

 

Whitlock will be better than Richards, so will Houck.

 

Our starting pitching is better and we saved $25M in the process.

 

I love Bloom.

 

A great signing for a pitcher with a 5+ ERA? OMG. I don’t care how he finished the season, and he didn’t miss to many bats with the mentioned 5+ ERA. Houck, and Whitlock are not replacing anybody. They were already there, and neither is Sale. We haven’t saved any money yet, and if anything wasted $7M, and we still need to add pitching. Good pitching. Boy the way people are spinning things just to make this signing look good is unbelievable. I would have resigned E Rod, but it looks like they didn’t offer anything more than the QO, which is a bad sign to me.

[notin]

A great signing for a pitcher with a 5+ ERA? OMG. I don’t care how he finished the season, and he didn’t miss to many bats with the mentioned 5+ ERA. Houck, and Whitlock are not replacing anybody. They were already there, and neither is Sale. We haven’t saved any money yet, and if anything wasted $7M, and we still need to add pitching. Good pitching. Boy the way people are spinning things just to make this signing look good is unbelievable. I would have resigned E Rod, but it looks like they didn’t offer anything more than the QO, which is a bad sign to me.

 

Sale only pitched 42 innings. Counting him as an addition is ok.

 

I’m not too on board with Wacha. Bloom does have some credibility in my eyes, but Wacha was all Lao on my “do not touch” list. So wait and see if my only approach.

 

I suppose the good news is in the (unlikely?) event the Sox bring in another starting pitcher on an MLB deal, it’s good news for the current bullpen construction, since it would actually mean Houck and Whitlock stay put…

[Old Red]

Sale only pitched 42 innings. Counting him as an addition is ok.

 

I’m not too on board with Wacha. Bloom does have some credibility in my eyes, but Wacha was all Lao on my “do not touch” list. So wait and see if my only approach.

 

I suppose the good news is in the (unlikely?) event the Sox bring in another starting pitcher on an MLB deal, it’s good news for the current bullpen construction, since it would actually mean Houck and Whitlock stay put…

 

The bullpen needs the most help, and the bad part is not knowing what you can get from Barnes if anything.

 

Sale only pitched 42 innings yes, but he was already in the rotation, so counting him as an addition is a bit of a stretch outside of getting more innings from him. You still need to add more bodies.

[Bellhorn04]

A great signing for a pitcher with a 5+ ERA? OMG. I don’t care how he finished the season, and he didn’t miss to many bats with the mentioned 5+ ERA. Houck, and Whitlock are not replacing anybody. They were already there, and neither is Sale. We haven’t saved any money yet, and if anything wasted $7M, and we still need to add pitching. Good pitching. Boy the way people are spinning things just to make this signing look good is unbelievable. I would have resigned E Rod, but it looks like they didn’t offer anything more than the QO, which is a bad sign to me.

 

Jesus, Red, listen to yourself for a second. You're freaking out because Bloom signed a guy with a 5 ERA for $7 mill.

 

Then you're saying we should have paid E-Rod the $77 mill Detroit did. What was his ERA in 2021? Oh yeah, 4.74.

 

So I guess having an ERA a tick under 5 is worth an extra $70 mill.

 

Too funny.

[Nick]

A great signing for a pitcher with a 5+ ERA? OMG. I don’t care how he finished the season, and he didn’t miss to many bats with the mentioned 5+ ERA. Houck, and Whitlock are not replacing anybody. They were already there, and neither is Sale. We haven’t saved any money yet, and if anything wasted $7M, and we still need to add pitching. Good pitching. Boy the way people are spinning things just to make this signing look good is unbelievable. I would have resigned E Rod, but it looks like they didn’t offer anything more than the QO, which is a bad sign to me.

 

Why don't you think outside of the box for change?

 

I'm comparing season opening rotation 2021 vs 2022. Was Sale in the rotation? NO.

 

You don't ever consider monetary aspect of roster building. You probably want to sign Devers to long extension, no? Something has to give Old Red.

 

OMG, ERA as Moon has said is meaningless stats. How do you know he didn't miss many bats? Aren't you on RECORD saying you don't give a damn about analytics? Did you watch him pitch? Have you seen his miss bats numbers?

 

Houck and Whitlock are not replacing anybody? You do know that Houck started in 2021? Whitlock used to be a starter until his arm surgery? Sox babied him last year right?

 

Why not try to win without going over the luxury tax limit?

 

We have about $23M to buy some quality relievers if the tax stays at $210M.

 

You are in that group of posters always complaining about lack young starters produced by the Sox. Then you get a Whitlock and a Houck and you jettisoned them to the pen.

 

OMG, Why can't we have young guys in our rotation?

Edited November 28, 2021 by Nick

[moonslav59]

A great signing for a pitcher with a 5+ ERA? OMG. I don’t care how he finished the season, and he didn’t miss to many bats with the mentioned 5+ ERA. Houck, and Whitlock are not replacing anybody. They were already there, and neither is Sale. We haven’t saved any money yet, and if anything wasted $7M, and we still need to add pitching. Good pitching. Boy the way people are spinning things just to make this signing look good is unbelievable. I would have resigned E Rod, but it looks like they didn’t offer anything more than the QO, which is a bad sign to me.

 

Sale could give us 100-150 more innings, so one could view that as coming close to replacing ERod, but it still leaves a slot open. I doubt Bloom is done, so I’m waiting to grade Bloom for the winter.

[Old Red]

Jesus, Red, listen to yourself for a second. You're freaking out because Bloom signed a guy with a 5 ERA for $7 mill.

 

Then you're saying we should have paid E-Rod the $77 mill Detroit did. What was his ERA in 2021? Oh yeah, 4.74.

 

So I guess having an ERA a tick under 5 is worth an extra $70 mill.

 

Too funny.

 

Are you saying Whack a is as good as E Rod?? I’m not going just by ERA, but Whack a is no E Rod.

[moonslav59]

The bullpen needs the most help, and the bad part is not knowing what you can get from Barnes if anything.

 

Sale only pitched 42 innings yes, but he was already in the rotation, so counting him as an addition is a bit of a stretch outside of getting more innings from him. You still need to add more bodies.

 

You think Bloom is done?

[Bellhorn04]

Are you saying Whack a is as good as E Rod?? I’m not going just by ERA, but Whack a is no E Rod.

 

If you're not going just by ERA, stop pounding away about Wacha's ERA.

[moonslav59]

Are you saying Whack a is as good as E Rod?? I’m not going just by ERA, but Whack a is no E Rod.

 

Well, you only mentioned ERA and him not missing bats when he actually has a very good missed bat rate, but you don’t want to hear about analytics.

 

I doubt many view Wacha as ERod’s replacement, and if Bloom does, then you will not be alone in thinking we will be worse, next year with our rotation.