2018 Red Sox cheating scandal

[notin]

I think you're right, and the current cheating scandal was pretty much a natural consequence of that mentality, plus the easy access to live video.

 

I think Manfred and MLB made a huge blunder not seeing this coming.

 

The next logical step will be teams employing drones to spy on catcher video. As long as teams use hand signals, there is no way to avoid catching them electronically and deciphering them...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I think you're right, and the current cheating scandal was pretty much a natural consequence of that mentality, plus the easy access to live video.

 

I think Manfred and MLB made a huge blunder not seeing this coming.

 

Notice that nobody is actually sorry for doing their jobs; they're just sorry for losing their jobs. Guys are of course apologetic for the spotlight shining onto their respective teams...

 

At first, I predicted other teams would retaliate against their infamous colleagues, but now I just expect business as usual. The former or the latter will go a long way in revealing just how egregious or overblown this whole thing actually is...

[jad]

Notice that nobody is actually sorry for doing their jobs; they're just sorry for losing their jobs. Guys are of course apologetic for the spotlight shining onto their respective teams...

 

At first, I predicted other teams would retaliate against their infamous colleagues, but now I just expect business as usual. The former or the latter will go a long way in revealing just how egregious or overblown this whole thing actually is...

 

Unfortunately, there will always be the "Dempsters" of the world trying to prove that their presumed moral integrity is superior to their talent.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Unfortunately, there will always be the "Dempsters" of the world trying to prove that their presumed moral integrity is superior to their talent.

 

Who gets thrown at first: Bregman, Altuve or Fiers (it would have to be an interleague game in an NL park, and don't be surprised if his club shuffles the rotation so he misses that scheduled start)?

[jacksonianmarch]

My bet is Bregman, if only from the practicality aspect. Altuve is a big base stealer when healthy. Hitting him could be a double.

[jung]

My bet is Bregman, if only from the practicality aspect. Altuve is a big base stealer when healthy. Hitting him could be a double.

 

Nobody needs be thrown at. But if the league continues to just try to shape a narrative which of course compels the other parties of note, Players, Agents, Owners to shape a narrative and in addition does nothing substantive to get their arms around this nonsense then yes I suspect we will see some pretty pissed off parties on all sides take matters into their own hands in a number of ways including MORE electronic and video CHEATING!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

My bet is Bregman, if only from the practicality aspect. Altuve is a big base stealer when healthy. Hitting him could be a double.

 

Ah, an astute one-time head hunter. Once I hit a walk-off HR vs. the top team in our old-mens league. Next time we played them, I led off and their ace threw the first pitch at my ribs, but missed. He had the best control in the league, so I thought he was just warming up... then he got me with the second pitch. You bet I stole on the very first pitch to the next batter, and eventually came around with the first run.

[a700hitter]

Unfortunately, there will always be the "Dempsters" of the world trying to prove that their presumed moral integrity is superior to their talent.

Dempster was a fool.

[notin]

Dempster was a fool.

 

Why? Because he quit when he knew he didn’t have it anymore?

[a700hitter]

Why? Because he quit when he knew he didn’t have it anymore?

Walking away from $12 million makes you a fool in my book. You are free to disagree.

 

He was a double fool for thinking that spending more time with his family would save his marriage. That flopped fast and her first listed ground on the divorce papers was probably that he was a fool for walking away from $12 million.

[notin]

Walking away from $12 million makes you a fool in my book. You are free to disagree.

 

He was a double fool for thinking that spending more time with his family would save his marriage. That flopped fast and her first listed ground on the divorce papers was probably that he was a fool for walking away from $12 million.

 

That his marriage ended did show that he needed to do something about it and he knew he stood to lose a lot more than $12 mill in a divorce. He did make $89 million over his career; I doubt another $12 mill would have changed his standard of living.

 

To me, it looks like he prioritized saving his marriage over one last season of baseball. It just didn’t work out. Maybe it was too little too late?

[a700hitter]

That his marriage ended did show that he needed to do something about it and he knew he stood to lose a lot more than $12 mill in a divorce. He did make $89 million over his career; I doubt another $12 mill would have changed his standard of living.

 

To me, it looks like he prioritized saving his marriage over one last season of baseball. It just didn’t work out. Maybe it was too little too late?

You are free to have your opinion. I agree with his wife that the guy is a fool.

 

Ryne Sandberg walked away from his 2 biggest contract years to save his marriage. At that time, I made 2 predictions. First, that he would be headed for divorce within 6 months and second, that he would be back begging for his job the following season. She filed for divorce within 3 weeks and he begged the Cubs for $1 million the following season having forfeited $13 million. If your marriage doesn't work when you spend some time apart and you are rich, more time together isn't the answer.

 

As far as their lifetime earnings go, a fool and his money shall soon part. Many major leaguers go broke after making big money during their careers. It's a long list. Sandberg and Dempster got a good head start on going broke the way they handled the end of their careers. You can say whatever you like about them, but I think they are 2 fools.

[Bellhorn04]

You are free to have your opinion. I agree with his wife that the guy is a fool.

 

Ryne Sandberg walked away from his 2 biggest contract years to save his marriage. At that time, I made 2 predictions. First, that he would be headed for divorce within 6 months and second, that he would be back begging for his job the following season. She filed for divorce within 3 weeks and he begged the Cubs for $1 million the following season having forfeited $13 million. If your marriage doesn't work when you spend some time apart and you are rich, more time together isn't the answer.

 

As far as their lifetime earnings go, a fool and his money shall soon part. Many major leaguers go broke after making big money during their careers. It's a long list. Sandberg and Dempster got a good head start on going broke the way they handled the end of their careers. You can say whatever you like about them, but I think they are 2 fools.

 

Dempster has an estimated net worth of $50 million.

 

(Still a fool, I know...)

[jad]

Well, if I had a wife and kids (which I do not have and do not want), I would certainly value my relationship with them more than I would value $12 million (which I also do not have and do not want).

[notin]

You are free to have your opinion. I agree with his wife that the guy is a fool.

 

Ryne Sandberg walked away from his 2 biggest contract years to save his marriage. At that time, I made 2 predictions. First, that he would be headed for divorce within 6 months and second, that he would be back begging for his job the following season. She filed for divorce within 3 weeks and he begged the Cubs for $1 million the following season having forfeited $13 million. If your marriage doesn't work when you spend some time apart and you are rich, more time together isn't the answer.

 

As far as their lifetime earnings go, a fool and his money shall soon part. Many major leaguers go broke after making big money during their careers. It's a long list. Sandberg and Dempster got a good head start on going broke the way they handled the end of their careers. You can say whatever you like about them, but I think they are 2 fools.

 

Actually from what I heard, Sandberg’s story was the opposite.

 

He knew he was headed for divorce, as his wife was cheating on him with his teammates (allegedly among the offenders was Rafael Palmeiro). He “retired” from baseball to keep her from getting any of his salary. Once the divorce was finalized, he resumed his career.

 

I don’t know why Dempster’s marriage fell apart. With ball players, there are always reasons. Too much time apart? Infidelity? But if his wife left him for walking away from $12mill after he already earned $89mill, he was right to get away from that gold digger...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Actually from what I heard, Sandberg’s story was the opposite.

 

He knew he was headed for divorce, as his wife was cheating on him with his teammates (allegedly among the offenders was Rafael Palmeiro). He “retired” from baseball to keep her from getting any of his salary. Once the divorce was finalized, he resumed his career.

 

I don’t know why Dempster’s marriage fell apart. With ball players, there are always reasons. Too much time apart? Infidelity? But if his wife left him for walking away from $12mill after he already earned $89mill, he was right to get away from that gold digger...

 

Now here's one area where most humans can agree on using the word "cheaters" -- except, that is, for ballplayers who insist that groupies are part of the game...

[a700hitter]

Actually from what I heard, Sandberg’s story was the opposite.

 

He knew he was headed for divorce, as his wife was cheating on him with his teammates (allegedly among the offenders was Rafael Palmeiro). He “retired” from baseball to keep her from getting any of his salary. Once the divorce was finalized, he resumed his career.

 

I don’t know why Dempster’s marriage fell apart. With ball players, there are always reasons. Too much time apart? Infidelity? But if his wife left him for walking away from $12mill after he already earned $89mill, he was right to get away from that gold digger...

Sandberg's public statements at the time were different, but even if your version is correct, he was even a bigger fool. Half of $14 million is greater than the $2 million he got when he came back.

[notin]

Sandberg's public statements at the time were different, but even if your version is correct, he was even a bigger fool. Half of $14 million is greater than the $2 million he got when he came back.

 

And my version could be some Chicago urban legend.

 

But it sounded more like spite rather than financial common sense was the motivation. The only thing it really explains that’s otherwise a big question is why the Cubs traded away Palmeiro after his All Star rookie season. And even then, it seems like that might have happened too early.

 

I do believe he got $5mill when he came back. Over 2 years, but it’s not like he was going to get 2 years anywhere else...

[a700hitter]

And my version could be some Chicago urban legend.

 

But it sounded more like spite rather than financial common sense was the motivation. The only thing it really explains that’s otherwise a big question is why the Cubs traded away Palmeiro after his All Star rookie season. And even then, it seems like that might have happened too early.

 

I do believe he got $5mill when he came back. Over 2 years, but it’s not like he was going to get 2 years anywhere else...

He skipped a year and got $2 million the year he returned. By the following year after that, he would have already been divorced before he signed that contract and it would not have been a marital asset. He cost himself at least $5 million -- Half of $14 million less the $2 million in his return year.

[notin]

He skipped a year and got $2 million the year he returned. By the following year after that, he would have already been divorced before he signed that contract and it would not have been a marital asset. He cost himself at least $5 million -- Half of $14 million less the $2 million in his return year.

 

Yeah I think spite was a motivator. This story allludes to what I was saying. I think his book “Second to Home” is the origin of the story, but I can’t verify that since I’m not going to read it...

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1995-05-07-9505070405-story,amp.html

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I like Sandburg's poetry better... or is that another Chicago Hall of Famer?

[notin]

I like Sandburg's poetry better... or is that another Chicago Hall of Famer?

 

You’re thinking of the South Sider...

[S5Dewey]

 

I don’t know why Dempster’s marriage fell apart. With ball players, there are always reasons. Too much time apart? Infidelity?

 

I used to be friends with a woman whose 1st husband played A-Ball in the Cubs organization and she pointed out to me that being a player's wife isn't as glamorous as it seems. He got drafted by the Cubs and she followed him to Illinois but came back home to her family because he was never at home. He got cut during the 1971 season but never got over the fact that he wasn't good enough to be a major leaguer. He died of acute alcoholism about 3 years ago.

 

As she said, being a ball player's wife certainly isn't for everyone. When the player is on the road they're alone and when the team is at home their husband is at the park every day. They raise the kids alone and manage the day to day operation of the home alone. In addition they have to be ready to move to another city if the player gets traded so they never get to set down any roots.

 

Then if the players is wildly successful they get to live a lavish lifestyle.. alone... until the player retires. If he didn't stay in baseball long enough to become a multi-millionaire they often end up selling cars and reliving their Glory Days, basking in the perks that come from having been major league players. It's not for everyone, for sure. I'm surprised there aren't more divorces than there are.

[jung]

I used to be friends with a woman whose 1st husband played A-Ball in the Cubs organization and she pointed out to me that being a player's wife isn't as glamorous as it seems. He got drafted by the Cubs and she followed him to Illinois but came back home to her family because he was never at home. He got cut during the 1971 season but never got over the fact that he wasn't good enough to be a major leaguer. He died of acute alcoholism about 3 years ago.

 

As she said, being a ball player's wife certainly isn't for everyone. When the player is on the road they're alone and when the team is at home their husband is at the park every day. They raise the kids alone and manage the day to day operation of the home alone. In addition they have to be ready to move to another city if the player gets traded so they never get to set down any roots.

 

Then if the players is wildly successful they get to live a lavish lifestyle.. alone... until the player retires. If he didn't stay in baseball long enough to become a multi-millionaire they often end up selling cars and reliving their Glory Days, basking in the perks that come from having been major league players. It's not for everyone, for sure. I'm surprised there aren't more divorces than there are.

 

The curve is really steep for baseball players. I was never more than an average scholastic player and the best college players of my time were just waaaaaay better than I was, particularly at the plate. Then that is not the steepest part of the bellcurve, far from it. The steepest part of the curve is between A and AAA ball and then between AAA and the ML's. That is mainly driven by the difference in the pitchers you see as you go through a career.

 

If you ask me, ML ballplayers are aliens from outer space. They are simply that much better than the rest of us.

 

IMO, first among them at the plate, Ted Williams. First among them from the mound, Nolan Ryan. In both cases, just my opinion much biased by having seen both play. In Nolan's case, having seen him pitch up close at the peak of his talents and his maturity as a pitcher. The effect on me......staggering. Saw Sandy too. He was fantastic. But nothing at least to me was as earth shaking as watching Ryan up close at his peak when he would really cut it loose.

Edited January 26, 2020 by jung

[Bellhorn04]

Because it is part of a replay system that does not work. It is boring. It takes too long to employ and it leads to this nonsense of slo-mo of a runner crossing the bag while we are looking for a nanosecond when he might have lost contact with the bag while the fielder held the tag. That is just nonsense baseball. Its nonsense. That is particularly nonsensical given the plastic bases which nobody can hang onto. Plus it provides a ready tool to employ in game real time video and electronics to cheat!

 

I want three play types reviewed and I want MLB to determine if they will or won't review. I want HR's, questionable catches, plays at the plate and thats it. I want no more of THE HAND held up by Managers while we wait with our thumbs up our asses. Let the Managers go out and argue calls again. Much more interesting, much more entertaining and much more in the spirit of the game.

 

Here's what I think would happen if you took away the teams' right to request any replay reviews.

 

Just about every night and day there would be blown calls that don't get overturned, that impact games, and a large number of fans (think: game threads) would be screaming and cursing about it and wondering why the hell MLB would have done such a stupid thing.

[Bellhorn04]

IMO, first among them at the plate, Ted Williams. First among them from the mound, Nolan Ryan. In both cases, just my opinion much biased by having seen both play. In Nolan's case, having seen him pitch up close at the peak of his talents and his maturity as a pitcher. The effect on me......staggering. Saw Sandy too. He was fantastic. But nothing at least to me was as earth shaking as watching Ryan up close at his peak when he would really cut it loose.

 

Ryan was definitely a freak of nature (as was Williams of course).

 

Ryan just had an incredible body to throw as hard as he did for as many innings as he did and not to break down.

[jung]

Here's what I think would happen if you took away the teams' right to request any replay reviews.

 

Just about every night and day there would be blown calls that don't get overturned, that impact games, and a large number of fans (think: game threads) would be screaming and cursing about it and wondering why the hell MLB would have done such a stupid thing.

 

Granted I am depending on the league to care enough about its product to honestly determine if a review is called for for the three play types I want to see reviewed. But all in, I will take that over the nonsensical replay implementation we have now even without the side issues that come with it. The side issues just push it over the top for me.

[Bellhorn04]

Granted I am depending on the league to care enough about its product to honestly determine if a review is called for for the three play types I want to see reviewed.

 

You might actually end up with more reviews that way. At least with manager reviews there's a limit.

[jung]

Ryan was definitely a freak of nature (as was Williams of course).

 

Ryan just had an incredible body to throw as hard as he did for as many innings as he did and not to break down.

 

Once Nolan's body matured into his talent it was over. I just could not see how to deal with him from the batter's box. Obviously the guys that actually had to try couldn't do much with him either.

 

Nolan was well out of the Mets organization when his body matured to meet his talent.

 

Ted for his part somehow figured out how to take a classic RH hitter's swing and flip it to the LH side of the plate which is not even remotely easy. I don't know what is more amazing to me. That is determined that he should do it or that he put in the work effort to make it happen and perfect that stance and stroke from the Left Side. Now I was too young to know exactly what Ted was doing. But after watching enough of him I finally got old enough to figure it out. It gave Ted the ridiculous advantage of having a RH hitter's swing hitting from the Left side in the main against RH pitchers. The results speak for themselves as his splits are just ridiculous. Combine that with his selectivity from the plate and you have a monster on your hands. I shudder to think what his career numbers would be if he actually played as opposed to going off to military service.

[jung]

You might actually end up with more reviews that way. At least with manager reviews there's a limit.

 

I will take more reviews if they are conducted quickly and only in the three categories I have identified. Hard to imagine you would have more if they stuck to those three categories. As it is now if the Manager if out of reviews, he will go out on the field and whine to the umps that they should conduct an Ump's prerogative review.