The GM thread

[oldtimer]

I more or less agree with everything here. Porcello likely won't be back, but I do expect our starting staff to do a much better job than what they've done so far this year.

 

Kimmi

 

You are taking the optimistic view, but nothing points in the direction of the rotation improving in performance going forward. I hope Sale can at least come part way back to his dominance of the past. I don't see Cashner, Porcello or Price doing the job for us going forwad. Price will be with us in 2020.

[cp176]

Yes. I don't think the make-over has to be as extreme as others.

 

A while back, I posted a list of the top SP'ers by WAR since 2003. Almost every pitcher had a down year or two, most around 30-32, but all except Felix bounced back pretty quickly to have a few good seasons afterwards. The 3 years it took CC was an exception to the trend.

 

I think Sale may be back to a high level by next year, but I realize that may be wishful thinking.

 

I also do not think that this man is done. He throws the ball to hard and the movement on the slider remains. I would never bet against a man with his type of passion. he is having a bad year - I get that - but much of the criticism read about him on this site is ridiculous. Ultimately I think that he will earn his paycheck.

[Hitch]

I've mentioned several times through the season that not being in the play off picture this year would quite possibly be healthier for us long term. I would have looked to have got rid of Price, Porcello, Moreland and kicked the tyres on Betts and JD.

 

The winning streak before the deadline really hurt us with hindsight. We won't be offering a QQ to any of our free agents and lost the chance to get something/ for them.

 

The rest of the season is done. We aren't turning this around.

 

Not the end of the world, we will compete next year, but we missed a possibly good opportunity to re-tool/re-set things with this deadline.

[cp176]

I've mentioned several times through the season that not being in the play off picture this year would quite possibly be healthier for us long term. I would have looked to have got rid of Price, Porcello, Moreland and kicked the tyres on Betts and JD.

 

The winning streak before the deadline really hurt us with hindsight. We won't be offering a QQ to any of our free agents and lost the chance to get something/ for them.

 

The rest of the season is done. We aren't turning this around.

 

Not the end of the world, we will compete next year, but we missed a possibly good opportunity to re-tool/re-set things with this deadline.

 

likely true

[OH FOY]

Wonder what happen if today was the Trade deadline? Just 4 days later. They have been late on everything this year as far as evaluating this team.

[Bellhorn04]

I've mentioned several times through the season that not being in the play off picture this year would quite possibly be healthier for us long term. I would have looked to have got rid of Price, Porcello, Moreland and kicked the tyres on Betts and JD.

 

The winning streak before the deadline really hurt us with hindsight. We won't be offering a QQ to any of our free agents and lost the chance to get something/ for them.

 

The rest of the season is done. We aren't turning this around.

 

Not the end of the world, we will compete next year, but we missed a possibly good opportunity to re-tool/re-set things with this deadline.

 

I don't think it was that big of an opportunity. We weren't going to re-tool with what we got for broken goods like Porcello and Moreland. Trading Price would have been a salary dump which would have mostly resulted in us paying half his salary to play elsewhere.

[Hitch]

I don't think it was that big of an opportunity. We weren't going to re-tool with what we got for broken goods like Porcello and Moreland. Trading Price would have been a salary dump which would have mostly resulted in us paying half his salary to play elsewhere.

 

We might have got flyers for Moreland or Porcello which is more than we will get now. I disagree with Price. We would likely have to pay some of his salary but I think we could have gotten a decent piece back for him and I firmly believe we've seen the best of his contract now. I don't see him aging too well. But he still has value after a decent season and his awesome work in the play offs last year.

 

I just wish the window was today, I think we'd see a quite different line up from tomorrow if so.

[Bellhorn04]

I disagree with Price. We would likely have to pay some of his salary but I think we could have gotten a decent piece back for him and I firmly believe we've seen the best of his contract now. I don't see him aging too well. But he still has value after a decent season and his awesome work in the play offs last year.

 

Price's contract would only be a little more than half over. He's still due more than 100 million. And other teams are probably feeling a little pessimistic about how well he'll age too.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Bellhorn04

[notin]

I've mentioned several times through the season that not being in the play off picture this year would quite possibly be healthier for us long term. I would have looked to have got rid of Price, Porcello, Moreland and kicked the tyres on Betts and JD.

 

The winning streak before the deadline really hurt us with hindsight. We won't be offering a QQ to any of our free agents and lost the chance to get something/ for them.

 

The rest of the season is done. We aren't turning this around.

 

Not the end of the world, we will compete next year, but we missed a possibly good opportunity to re-tool/re-set things with this deadline.

 

Barring a trade of Betts, we didn’t miss much of an opportunity....

[notin]

We might have got flyers for Moreland or Porcello which is more than we will get now. I disagree with Price. We would likely have to pay some of his salary but I think we could have gotten a decent piece back for him and I firmly believe we've seen the best of his contract now. I don't see him aging too well. But he still has value after a decent season and his awesome work in the play offs last year.

 

I just wish the window was today, I think we'd see a quite different line up from tomorrow if so.

 

Would the fliers the Sox got for Porcello and Moreland really be any better than the waiver wire player’s Dombrowski ignores every day?

[Bellhorn04]

We're just trying to make you feel better, Hitch.

[notin]

We're just trying to make you feel better, Hitch.

 

Yeah. Look at it this way. Do you really think Dombrowski would be able to get under-the-radar talent for very replaceable players Porcello or Moreland? The guy’s strength is in dealing away young talent, not in finding it...

[moonslav59]

I also do not think that this man is done. He throws the ball to hard and the movement on the slider remains. I would never bet against a man with his type of passion. he is having a bad year - I get that - but much of the criticism read about him on this site is ridiculous. Ultimately I think that he will earn his paycheck.

 

I do, too.

 

Yes, we took a gamble by signing him after an injury plagued season, but we signed him to less than he would have gotten as a FA last winter.

 

Right now, the signing looks sketchy, but I'm still confident he will earn his money, too.

[moonslav59]

Yeah. Look at it this way. Do you really think Dombrowski would be able to get under-the-radar talent for very replaceable players Porcello or Moreland? The guy’s strength is in dealing away young talent, not in finding it...

 

He could have tried.

 

The problem was that we felt we still had a chance at the WC slot.

[Bellhorn04]

He could have tried.

 

The problem was that we felt we still had a chance at the WC slot.

 

Yeah, the team played a nasty little joke on the front office.

[moonslav59]

Yeah, the team played a nasty little joke on the front office.

 

The funny thing was how the front office thought their little speeches might work on these modern day players.

 

The best motivating factor would have been to trade a star player or acquire a bonafide RP'er- not silly speeches.

[Bellhorn04]

The funny thing was how the front office thought their little speeches might work on these modern day players.

 

The best motivating factor would have been to trade a star player or acquire a bonafide RP'er- not silly speeches.

 

The players shouldn't have needed any motivating.

 

The Yankees did jacksquat at the deadline and look how the team responded.

[notin]

Yeah, the team played a nasty little joke on the front office.

 

Not really. It’s not like the Front Office did anything.

 

And the opportunity to sell was never there. Sure we could have bulked up the farm with more Josh Tobias types. Yippy...

[OH FOY]

Lot of good stuff said this morning.

[FredLynn]

He could have tried.

 

The problem was that we felt we still had a chance at the WC slot.

 

That was an error in judgement. The ONLY way we had a chance at the WC slot is if the guys on the current roster started doing their jobs. And given four months of performance data it was not a reasonable expectation at all. IMO they should have tried to unload some of our current players if they could get a decent return.

[Bellhorn04]

That was an error in judgement. The ONLY way we had a chance at the WC slot is if the guys on the current roster started doing their jobs. And given four months of performance data it was not a reasonable expectation at all. IMO they should have tried to unload some of our current players if they could get a decent return.

 

Yeah, but I think all of us were feeling much better about the team after we pummelled the Yankees in those 3 games. And I don't think any of us foresaw them turning right around and dropping 8 straight.

[Hitch]

Barring a trade of Betts, we didn’t miss much of an opportunity....

 

As I said, I don't think that's true. We could have got good returns for Price and JD imo. Not sure we should have gone that full on if the opportunity arose, but the option would have been nice.

 

Would the fliers the Sox got for Porcello and Moreland really be any better than the waiver wire player’s Dombrowski ignores every day?

 

 

I'm talking about lightening in a bottle attempts with youngsters. They are most certainly more valuable to us than having Porcello and Moreland here now. We might have got something decent for Bradley, too.

 

I take your point about it not exactly being a talent of DD's, but I'm sure somebody in the analytics department could have steered him in the right direction. It would have been better to have the option, for sure.

 

We're just trying to make you feel better, Hitch.

 

Ha! I don't feel too bad. I'm not too down on this year. I feel we will rebound and be contenders next year. The year after that, and the one after that however.... I'm not so sure on.

[Hitch]

Yeah, but I think all of us were feeling much better about the team after we pummelled the Yankees in those 3 games. And I don't think any of us foresaw them turning right around and dropping 8 straight.

 

Yeah, you cant criticise for the decisions they made at the time. Selling while being in and around the WC spot would have caused riots.

[notin]

As I said, I don't think that's true. We could have got good returns for Price and JD imo. Not sure we should have gone that full on if the opportunity arose, but the option would have been nice.

 

 

 

 

I'm talking about lightening in a bottle attempts with youngsters. They are most certainly more valuable to us than having Porcello and Moreland here now. We might have got something decent for Bradley, too.

 

I take your point about it not exactly being a talent of DD's, but I'm sure somebody in the analytics department could have steered him in the right direction. It would have been better to have the option, for sure.

 

I don’t think you get much of anything for Price or Moreland and you probably have to pay enough of Price’s deal that it’s not even worth trading him.

 

I wish the guys in the analytics department would key in on a pitcher or two that’s hit the waiver wire. I bet that you could assemble half of a staff and bullpen from waiver wire claims this year that has outperformed the Sox rotation and pen...

[Slasher9]

I also do not think that this man is done. He throws the ball to hard and the movement on the slider remains. I would never bet against a man with his type of passion. he is having a bad year - I get that - but much of the criticism read about him on this site is ridiculous. Ultimately I think that he will earn his paycheck.

 

i wouldnt be surprised if his competitiveness ended up taking him to a miami clinic this offseason....

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Dombrowski had the gumption to know that this team wasn't worth improving at the deadline by trading a top prospect. Dombrowski held on to his prospects and, if I"m not mistaken, didn't go over the high luxury tax threshold. So, the Red Sox don't lose 10 spots in the draft.

 

At this point, the Red Sox are looking at an early 20s first round pick, and if things go really bad for them (I would shut down Price and Sale early this year) they could end up with a pick in the 15-20 range.

[moonslav59]

Dombrowski had the gumption to know that this team wasn't worth improving at the deadline by trading a top prospect. Dombrowski held on to his prospects and, if I"m not mistaken, didn't go over the high luxury tax threshold. So, the Red Sox don't lose 10 spots in the draft.

 

At this point, the Red Sox are looking at an early 20s first round pick, and if things go really bad for them (I would shut down Price and Sale early this year) they could end up with a pick in the 15-20 range.

 

The Cashner trade proved we didn't have to trade a top prospect to get a decent pitcher.

 

DD chose to send a message to the team. It didn't work.

 

The Eovaldi & Pearce re-signings killed us due to their injuries.

 

DD's earlier big signings appear to be fading or mildly declining (Price, Sale, JD & Moreland).

 

I'm glad we won a ring, so I'm fine with what DD did, but I will not sugar coat the mess the "win now" strategy has put us in now and going forward.

 

[notin]

The following players need to play every day: Marco Hernandez, Sam Travis

 

Brian Johnson needs to join the rotation.

 

Might as well see if there’s a future in any of them...

[Noles_1335]

Why is it that every hit we give up is a rocket... 7 hits and 3 homers I think... see ya Dana

[moonslav59]

The following players need to play every day: Marco Hernandez, Sam Travis

 

Brian Johnson needs to join the rotation.

 

Might as well see if there’s a future in any of them...

 

I'd also start stretching out Eovaldi and DHern.