Harper and Machado

[dgalehouse]

Everyone wants a bigger slice of the pizza . It' s like that with most things in life . Baseball is no exception.

[Kimmi]

The Marlins did the same thing with Carlis Delgado, but his expensive years were $12-15mill.

 

If the plan was to dump him before the expensive years, it was a serious gamble. I mean, what if no one wanted him at that price? Or if an injury hurts him?

 

If they didn’t want to pay him, wouldn’t it have made sense to trade him when he was still cheap?

 

Sure, it was a gamble, but I don't think he was worried about the possible risks.

 

He knew he wasn't going to be around that much longer.

 

Making that deal probably gave him a few brownie points with the Marlins fans.

[Kimmi]

Joe Sheehan put it well. It was a huh-yoooge mistake by the players association in the last CBA negotiations not to lock in a revenue guarantee. It's what you get when an ex-player is leading them - they were bought off by a couple of roster spots. They only have themselves to blame that the owners - who are ALL clearing $100M before selling a single ticket, are all collectively turning into scrooges.

 

Owners are acting rationally - but it's within a system which does not tie financial success to on field success, where it is basically impossible to not be profitable. Players goals are much more aligned with fans goals - which of course make it perfectly sensible that fans identify with owners much more.

 

I agree that the players only have themselves to blame for agreeing to the current CBA. I'm sure they will go into the next negotiation much the wiser.

 

While I feel that the owners have a right to try to make the largest profit possible, I do also think they have the responsibility to put a quality product on the field. Any owner who does not spend a certain percentage of their revenue on payroll should be penalized, both financially and in terms of draft pick.

[Kimmi]

The deal kept Stanton around for a couple of years at a relatively cheap price before the sale took place.

 

I thought it was actually kind of smart, in a sleazy way.

 

That's a good way to word it, smart, in a sleazy way.

[Kimmi]

He pulled off the same bait and switch with Mark Beurle, Josh Johnson and Jose Reyes.

 

I do recall the Marlins doing that before, I just couldn't recall who the players were.

 

Marlins fans should boycott.

[Bellhorn04]

Well, hopefully this Harper/Machado shakeout is helpful to us in terms of being able to retain Mookie.

[notin]

I do recall the Marlins doing that before, I just couldn't recall who the players were.

 

Marlins fans should boycott.

 

 

They do.

 

The off-season after that firesale, there were pictures of their line for season tickets when they went on sale.

 

Four people.

 

Four.

 

My 11 year olds girls’ softball team draws better than that!! By a lot!!

[sk7326]

I agree that the players only have themselves to blame for agreeing to the current CBA. I'm sure they will go into the next negotiation much the wiser.

 

While I feel that the owners have a right to try to make the largest profit possible, I do also think they have the responsibility to put a quality product on the field. Any owner who does not spend a certain percentage of their revenue on payroll should be penalized, both financially and in terms of draft pick.

 

For me it's simple. The players should lock in a certain percentage and the owners have to make it up to them if they come up short (and sure let it be a range - so the players owe money if it gets over some level). Ultimately players want teams competing - it's good for them. At this point if I'm San Diego - absolutely go in on Harper/Machado - why not? It makes sense given the market.

[Kimmi]

Well, hopefully this Harper/Machado shakeout is helpful to us in terms of being able to retain Mookie.

 

If Harper and Machado fall well short of their initial expectations, this can only help the Sox in trying to retain Mookie as well as some other players.

 

I would be interested to know exactly what types of offers these players currently have on the table, and what the players are holding out for. We may not have heard about them, but I'm guessing that these unsigned big names have some reasonable offers floating around. But like JD last season, they are holding out for the amounts that were speculated before the offseason.

[Kimmi]

They do.

 

The off-season after that firesale, there were pictures of their line for season tickets when they went on sale.

 

Four people.

 

Four.

 

My 11 year olds girls’ softball team draws better than that!! By a lot!!

 

That's 2 more season ticket holders than I thought they would have.

[Kimmi]

For me it's simple. The players should lock in a certain percentage and the owners have to make it up to them if they come up short (and sure let it be a range - so the players owe money if it gets over some level). Ultimately players want teams competing - it's good for them. At this point if I'm San Diego - absolutely go in on Harper/Machado - why not? It makes sense given the market.

 

Agreed. Last season, while good for the Red Sox, was not good for baseball general. There were a handful of powerhouse teams from which you figured the WS Champs would come from, and far too many teams that really didn't have a chance from Opening Day.

[jacksonianmarch]

The problem with taking a revenue percentage is the books are private for the most part and the number can be a moving target. If the players want to really make inroads, they need to shorten the pre-arb and arb process to 4 years. That will see a massive influx of free agents in the 24-26 age range and make contracts go bonkers. It will also really pare down the team friendly extensions these young guys sign to lock in a real payday but heavily underpay the kids as they mature

[Bellhorn04]

The problem with taking a revenue percentage is the books are private for the most part and the number can be a moving target. If the players want to really make inroads, they need to shorten the pre-arb and arb process to 4 years. That will see a massive influx of free agents in the 24-26 age range and make contracts go bonkers. It will also really pare down the team friendly extensions these young guys sign to lock in a real payday but heavily underpay the kids as they mature

 

2 years pre-arb + 2 years arb makes sense to me.

[notin]

The problem with taking a revenue percentage is the books are private for the most part and the number can be a moving target. If the players want to really make inroads, they need to shorten the pre-arb and arb process to 4 years. That will see a massive influx of free agents in the 24-26 age range and make contracts go bonkers. It will also really pare down the team friendly extensions these young guys sign to lock in a real payday but heavily underpay the kids as they mature

 

 

Or the owners will tighten their collective purse strings even more and off-seasons will be endlessly tedious, salaries will deflate further, and the average retirement age will be younger...

[notin]

That's 2 more season ticket holders than I thought they would have.

 

 

It’s entirely possible one of those people thought the line was for an ATM and another was waiting to mug him...

[Northern Star]

The problem with taking a revenue percentage is the books are private for the most part and the number can be a moving target. If the players want to really make inroads, they need to shorten the pre-arb and arb process to 4 years. That will see a massive influx of free agents in the 24-26 age range and make contracts go bonkers. It will also really pare down the team friendly extensions these young guys sign to lock in a real payday but heavily underpay the kids as they mature

 

Why would the owners agree to this? The whole point is to have the player under contract for a reasonable amount of time commeasurable to their investment.

[Northern Star]

Talk of the Marlins ticket line reminds me of a guy who was spotted trying to scalp Rays tickets. When the stadium was always 1/3 empty.

[notin]

Now the Giants are in on Harper. This ought to speed tings up...

[Northern Star]

Now the Giants are in on Harper. This ought to speed tings up...

 

Let's see if they end up bidding against themselves, a la Texas and A-Rod.

[Slasher9]

rumor has it that the Yankees offer to Machado was for $200MM

[moonslav59]

rumor has it that the Yankees offer to Machado was for $200MM

 

For 8 years? 7?

[Slasher9]

For 8 years? 7?

 

unclear at this point:

 

New York has made an offer to Machado for $220 million over seven to eight years, according to baseball analyst and former MLB general manager Jim Duquette.

[moonslav59]

Is Washington's initial offer still on the table?

 

If yes, why hasn't he taken it already?

[notin]

unclear at this point:

 

New York has made an offer to Machado for $220 million over seven to eight years, according to baseball analyst and former MLB general manager Jim Duquette.

 

Ah Jim Duquette. The man who actually made all of the mistakes everyone attributes to Steve Phillips...

[notin]

unclear at this point:

 

New York has made an offer to Machado for $220 million over seven to eight years, according to baseball analyst and former MLB general manager Jim Duquette.

 

The rumors were unconfirmed as of yesterday. Has there been a new development since?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pinstripealley.com/platform/amp/2019/2/10/18218843/mlb-yankees-news-manny-machado-offer-j-t-realmuto-gary-sanchez-luke-voit-prospects

[Bellhorn04]

There's another report floating out there that the White Sox offer to Machado was 8/250 (rather than the 7/175 originally reported).

[Slasher9]

The rumors were unconfirmed as of yesterday. Has there been a new development since?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pinstripealley.com/platform/amp/2019/2/10/18218843/mlb-yankees-news-manny-machado-offer-j-t-realmuto-gary-sanchez-luke-voit-prospects

 

i dont think so. i hope he ends up costing them more than $220MM....

[BillyWilliams]

https://www.12up.com/posts/6292572-jim-duquette-walks-back-manny-machado-yankees-rumor-in-major-way?view_source=leagues_page&view_medium=[mlb]

[jacksonianmarch]

The Yanks may have been in on Machado, but once we inked Lemahieu, our cap number rose past the first lux tax line. Signing Manny or Harper would put us over or dangerously close to that final barrier. I don't think Cashman will ever cross that with the draft penalty attached. I can definitively say we are out on either of them unless we trade off a commensurate contract.

[notin]

So Brett Lawrie, out of baseball sonce 2016, signed a contract before Harper and Machado. How many more names will come of of the recycle bin before these two actually sign somewhere?