A Realistic View at 2018: Part II

[oldtimer]

Ever.

 

It showed last night and has to be deflating to the Guardians. They had most of their first string on the field and we had mostly backup players on and yet we still beat them. I didn't expect what happened, but there it is.

[moonslav59]

It showed last night and has to be deflating to the Guardians. They had most of their first string on the field and we had mostly backup players on and yet we still beat them. I didn't expect what happened, but there it is.

 

It also shows just how how great our bench has been, pretty much all year.

 

Except for Beeks, our 6-9 SP'er have been extremely successful, in terms of pitching well enough for our team to win.

 

Holt & Nunez have done well replacing Pedey (and Devers). When Betts and others went on the DL, we barely missed a beat.

 

Moreland started the season on the bench. Pearce and Kinsler were both great pick-ups, despite what Buttrey is doing. Even Phillips won a game for us.

 

Now, Lin & Travis are showing life.

 

This team is tight... top to bottom.

 

[moonslav59]

Teenie tiny sample size, but here are the Sox OPS over the last week:

 

10+ PAs, unless noted.

 

1.600 Travis (5 PA)

1.429 Lin (7)

1.313 Holt

1.203 Betts

1.083 JD Martinez

1.000 Devers

.929 Swihart (8)

.875 Nunez (8)

.857 JBJ

.750 Pearce

 

.522 Phillips

.522 Vazquez

.503 Beni

 

.265 Bogey

.222 Leon (9)

.182 Kinsler

 

.000 Moreland (8)

[oldtimer]

It also shows just how how great our bench has been, pretty much all year.

 

Except for Beeks, our 6-9 SP'er have been extremely successful, in terms of pitching well enough for our team to win.

 

Holt & Nunez have done well replacing Pedey (and Devers). When Betts and others went on the DL, we barely missed a beat.

 

Moreland started the season on the bench. Pearce and Kinsler were both great pick-ups, despite what Buttrey is doing. Even Phillips won a game for us.

 

Now, Lin & Travis are showing life.

 

This team is tight... top to bottom.

 

 

It looks like Moreland and Bogey can use a rest. Our catching situation is what it is. Rest may help, but I am skeptical.

[OH FOY]

Gil Hodges once said I don't care if Jerry Grote hits .100, the way he handles our Pitching staff, and plays Defense, makes him a .300 hitter.

 

Tom Seaver said the best Catcher he's ever had.

[moonslav59]

Gil Hodges once said I don't care if Jerry Grote hits .100, the way he handles our Pitching staff, and plays Defense, makes him a .300 hitter.

 

Tom Seaver said the best Catcher he's ever had.

 

You hear this so often from the great pitchers. I know it's just anecdotal evidence, but when you hear it over and over again, I believe it is true.

 

Sandy hitting .180 is 80 points higher than we need!

[moonslav59]

Our biggest need areas for 2019/2020 and our current players/prospects that can play those positions:

 

2B: Pedey, Nunez (2019 only), Holt, Hernandez

Lin, Quiroz, Netzer, Lozada (Chavis?)

 

1B: Moreland (2019 only), Swihart, Holt

Ockimey, Chavis, Travis, Dalbec, Casas

 

3B: Devers, Nunez, Holt, Hernandez

Chavis, Dalbec, Northcut, D Diaz, Castellanos, Granberg

 

SS: Bogey (2019 only), Hernandez (Holt)

Lin, Chatham, A Flores

 

RP: Brasier, Barnes, Workman, Hembree, Thornburg, Smith, Poyner, Scott

(SP>RP?: Wright, Johnson, Velazquez)

Cuevas, Feltman, Lakins, Walden, Gorst, Haley, Shawaryn, Shepherd

 

 

[oldtimer]

Our biggest need areas for 2019/2020 and our current players/prospects that can play those positions:

 

2B: Pedey, Nunez (2019 only), Holt, Hernandez

Lin, Quiroz, Netzer, Lozada (Chavis?)

 

1B: Moreland (2019 only), Swihart, Holt

Ockimey, Chavis, Travis, Dalbec, Casas

 

3B: Devers, Nunez, Holt, Hernandez

Chavis, Dalbec, Northcut, D Diaz, Castellanos, Granberg

 

SS: Bogey (2019 only), Hernandez (Holt)

Lin, Chatham, A Flores

 

RP: Brasier, Barnes, Workman, Hembree, Thornburg, Smith, Poyner, Scott

(SP>RP?: Wright, Johnson, Velazquez)

Cuevas, Feltman, Lakins, Walden, Gorst, Haley, Shawaryn, Shepherd

 

 

 

I would add catcher to that list.

[Yaz Fan Since 67]

I am still trying to figure out how this Red Sox team has won 105 games. I'm not even convinced it's the best Sox team in my life time yet here they are ready to set the all time win total record. It's just been a magical year and a whole lot of fun to watch.

[Nick]

I am still trying to figure out how this Red Sox team has won 105 games. I'm not even convinced it's the best Sox team in my life time yet here they are ready to set the all time win total record. It's just been a magical year and a whole lot of fun to watch.

 

It's stupid I know but we just score more runs than opposing team night after night. When pitching sucks, we outfit the other team. When we don't hit, we pitch even better.

[Kimmi]

Here's how the AL playoff teams rank by Pythagorean W-L, and how many games they have over or underplayed that mark.

 

Astros 104-50 -7

 

Red Sox 99-56 +6

 

Yankees 93-61 +2

 

Guardians 93-61 -7

 

As 91-64 +3

 

Not that it means much at this point, but the Red Sox have been a bit lucky, while the Astros and the Guardians a bit unlucky.

[notin]

I am still trying to figure out how this Red Sox team has won 105 games. I'm not even convinced it's the best Sox team in my life time yet here they are ready to set the all time win total record. It's just been a magical year and a whole lot of fun to watch.

 

What would you say was the best Sox team?

 

If not this one, I go with the 1978 team that had four Hall of Famers (Yaz, Rice, Fisk, Eckersley) and a couple other Hall-worthy players (Tiant, Evans)...

[Bellhorn04]

What would you say was the best Sox team?

 

If not this one, I go with the 1978 team that had four Hall of Famers (Yaz, Rice, Fisk, Eckersley) and a couple other Hall-worthy players (Tiant, Evans)...

 

And another, Lynn, who was MVP in 1975 and 4th in MVP voting in 1979.

 

Star-wise, there's no topping that team.

[notin]

And another, Lynn, who was MVP in 1975 and 4th in MVP voting in 1979.

 

Star-wise, there's no topping that team.

 

Not to mention a four-time All Star Gold Glove (in 1979) shortstop in Rick Burleson who might be one of the most under appreciated Sox players in the past half century...

[Bellhorn04]

Not to mention a four-time All Star Gold Glove (in 1979) shortstop in Rick Burleson who might be one of the most under appreciated Sox players in the past half century...

 

If the idiots didn't trade him that might not be the case.

[moonslav59]

I would add catcher to that list.

 

I firmly believe our catcher position is one of our great strengths. Hitting is a small fraction of a catcher's value to his team. Plus, I doubt our catchers hit .550 next year, as a whole.

 

Here is our catcher outlook:

 

Leon, Vazquez, Swihart

O Hernandez, R Baldwin, Kole Cottam

 

 

[Bellhorn04]

I firmly believe our catcher position is one of our great strengths. Hitting is a small fraction of a catcher's value to his team. Plus, I doubt our catchers hit .550 next year, as a whole.

 

Here is our catcher outlook:

 

Leon, Vazquez, Swihart

O Hernandez, R Baldwin, Kole Cottam

 

 

In addition, it's one of the positions we're not spending piles and piles of money on, and you need some of those.

[moonslav59]

In addition, it's one of the positions we're not spending piles and piles of money on, and you need some of those.

 

True, and we'll need this more and more as the next seasons approach.

 

Signing a FA catcher or trading for one will take away from what we can do at high need areas.

 

Our catching position is NOT a need area at all.

 

Yes, I'd like more offense from our catchers, but offense is so far down on the list of what is the most valuable skills a good catcher needs.

[Kimmi]

True, and we'll need this more and more as the next seasons approach.

 

Signing a FA catcher or trading for one will take away from what we can do at high need areas.

 

Our catching position is NOT a need area at all.

 

Yes, I'd like more offense from our catchers, but offense is so far down on the list of what is the most valuable skills a good catcher needs.

 

Completely agree.

[moonslav59]

Completely agree.

 

I'm sure our pitchers agree, too.

[cp176]

I would add catcher to that list.

 

I tend to agree with you. If a slightly better than average catcher who can hit just a little bit is available out there, I would not be surprised at all if one of the two are gone before next year. At this point in time, I don't see what makes Vazquez particularly valuable to this team moving forward. Leon I guess I get. He is and has been a better receiver than Vazquez for some time now. Maybe Vazquez's contract makes him the one who stays but trading him for an upgrade somewhere else would not bother me at all. I was particularly less than impressed with him the other night when i watched E-rod continually hit his mitt which was placed inches outside of the inside corner of the plate. I kind of thought that maybe he would bring it in to the zone after about the fifth time - nope.

[moonslav59]

I tend to agree with you. If a slightly better than average catcher who can hit just a little bit is available out there, I would not be surprised at all if one of the two are gone before next year. At this point in time, I don't see what makes Vazquez particularly valuable to this team moving forward. Leon I guess I get. He is and has been a better receiver than Vazquez for some time now. Maybe Vazquez's contract makes him the one who stays but trading him for an upgrade somewhere else would not bother me at all. I was particularly less than impressed with him the other night when i watched E-rod continually hit his mitt which was placed inches outside of the inside corner of the plate. I kind of thought that maybe he would bring it in to the zone after about the fifth time - nope.

 

I certainly understand the frustration with Vaz. I feel it, too. I'm hopeful this is just an off year (D & O), but if he keeps playing like this, his defense is not outweighing his poor offense. He either need to get back up over .700 or get his defensive act back together.

 

Since he just signed the contract, I'm thinking we give him one more year. I'm also thinking Leon is going to remain Sale & Price's caddy for at least another season.

[OH FOY]

Good you got some sleep tonight.

[jacksonianmarch]

Going out and getting higher priced players ain’t happening. Ramos is probably the prize on the open market and he isn’t making it to Boston. Your catching situation is far from ideal, but their defense is solid and you don’t need offense from the position with the rest of your lineup humming

[Nick]

Red Sox 32 29 26 23 12 11

Guardians 31 31 29 26 18 12

Astros 33 32 31 29 22 5

Yankees 31 28 26 23 13 10

Oakland 27 20 16 16 15 11

 

# of starts by AL playoff teams. Advantage Houston?

[Nick]

Going out and getting higher priced players ain’t happening. Ramos is probably the prize on the open market and he isn’t making it to Boston. Your catching situation is far from ideal, but their defense is solid and you don’t need offense from the position with the rest of your lineup humming

 

3B position was not as productive as I'd hoped but you have to let Devers play. Need some youth and cheap options on your 25 man squad. Our starting pitching appears fragile from health standpoint. Last year it was Price, this year it's Sale and E Rod.

[Nick]

True, and we'll need this more and more as the next seasons approach.

 

Signing a FA catcher or trading for one will take away from what we can do at high need areas.

 

Our catching position is NOT a need area at all.

 

Yes, I'd like more offense from our catchers, but offense is so far down on the list of what is the most valuable skills a good catcher needs.

 

Delta at catching spot between highest and the lowest rated player is not as great as delta at 3B position as an example.

[oldtimer]

True, and we'll need this more and more as the next seasons approach.

 

Signing a FA catcher or trading for one will take away from what we can do at high need areas.

 

Our catching position is NOT a need area at all.

 

Yes, I'd like more offense from our catchers, but offense is so far down on the list of what is the most valuable skills a good catcher needs.

 

Watching the game last night tells me our offense is shakier than you suggest. Moreland and Kinsler are in slumps, Devers can be hot or cold, Beni will not pull the ball 90% of the time, our catchers don't hit, JBJ is swinging for the fences. Yes, Cora could have put in JDM, Holt, Nunez or Swihart into the game last night when 1 hit would have won it, but our offense was stagnant except for Mookie

[moonslav59]

Watching the game last night tells me our offense is shakier than you suggest. Moreland and Kinsler are in slumps, Devers can be hot or cold, Beni will not pull the ball 90% of the time, our catchers don't hit, JBJ is swinging for the fences. Yes, Cora could have put in JDM, Holt, Nunez or Swihart into the game last night when 1 hit would have won it, but our offense was stagnant except for Mookie

 

Again, why do people assume those players that are slumping will continue to do so?

 

A player's recent week, 2 weeks or even 2 month sample size is not a good indicator of what is to come. Yes, it is part of the equation, but not the dominant one.

 

You don't throw out great results from our staff just to try and gain a little bit of offense from the catcher position.

 

I'm hopeful Moreland and Kinsler turn things around, but we do have Devers showing life, and Pearce hitting righties better than ever. We also have Nunez and Holt taking up some slack.

 

I'm confident our offense will be fine. Maybe, I'm just being a homer, but our guys are getting some rest, and I think that should help.

[Yaz Fan Since 67]

What would you say was the best Sox team?

 

If not this one, I go with the 1978 team that had four Hall of Famers (Yaz, Rice, Fisk, Eckersley) and a couple other Hall-worthy players (Tiant, Evans)...

 

Those Manny/Ortiz/Pedro/Schill teams come to mind too. Those teams had Teck behind the plate, he handled pitchers ever bit as well as this group does and he wasn't a black hole in the lineup. And those teams had far better pens.

Edited September 24, 2018 by Yaz Fan Since '67