Stanton or Votto

[Nick]

Extend Pedroia? I don't think so. $25M is a bargain for Stanton. Sandoval, Hanley and Porcello will come to $60M in savings.

[moonslav59]

Which is why the Red Sox may not land J.D. Martinez or Eric Hosmer.

 

They reset the luxury tax for a reason.

 

It's spending time.

 

The window is closing in 2-3 years.

[moonslav59]

Let me re-state this. Groome has little if any value. Yes, he’s regarded because of his stuff. But there’s a reason for the ridiulculous anagram TINSTAAPP. Pitchers get hurt. Pitchers lose the zone. Pitchers have a ridiculously high flame out rate, especially those highly regarded but at the lower levels of the minors. Add in the character concerns and the injury concerns and Groome gets you next to nothing in a trade. If he stays healthy and blazes through the minors, then that’ll change. There’s a reason why Cashman has been pilfering young arms for big league 40 man roster castoffs. The hit rate is so low that the risk afforded is low enough to overpay. Cashman has had a ridiculous hit rate for now, but it’s bound to correct.

 

We got Pom for Espinoza. Long-away prospects have value.

[moonslav59]

Gammons might be a fool but Stanton will have a say where he plays. Gammons not only one that wrote it. That's why players put that in their contract. The right to Veto any Trade.

Boston is not in rebuilding mode, so they have that going for them.

 

I never said I felt GS would end up here. I'm fully aware of his right to veto a deal.

 

He may not want to come here, and the fact that we have not reached out to his agent does not concern me. (Wouldn't that be collusion anyways?)

 

My point is, we can afford him. He might want to come here to win a ring. He might prefer LA or SF.

 

We have other options, but I'd at least do my due diligence on GS before moving to someone else.

[notin]

I stopped reading this fool years ago.

 

Why? Most of the complaints about stuff he says are complete misquotes or people in denial.

 

I think the Sox will do their due diligence on Stanton. But ultimately Stanton will end up a Dodgers...

[OH FOY]

I never said I felt GS would end up here. I'm fully aware of his right to veto a deal.

 

He may not want to come here, and the fact that we have not reached out to his agent does not concern me. (Wouldn't that be collusion anyways?)

 

My point is, we can afford him. He might want to come here to win a ring. He might prefer LA or SF.

 

We have other options, but I'd at least do my due diligence on GS before moving to someone else.

 

We might have already, but we might 1 of the 5 teams he doesn't want to come too. This was according to Miami writer, I read in work. Might not be Boston either, writer wouldn't say which teams. One thing I'd rather have Stanton than Votto.

Edited November 5, 2017 by OH FOY!

[moonslav59]

Why? Most of the complaints about stuff he says are complete misquotes or people in denial.

 

I think the Sox will do their due diligence on Stanton. But ultimately Stanton will end up a Dodgers...

 

I never like him, and I used to get the Globe everyday for decades.

 

I don't know about other people's complaints about him. I don't live in New England anymore and haven't since '04.

 

[moonslav59]

We might have already, but we might 1 of the 5 teams he doesn't want to come too. This was according to Miami writer, I read in work. Might not be Boston either, writer wouldn't say which teams. One thing I'd rather have Stanton than Votto.

 

I'm fine, if we kick the tires hard and lose out.

 

Guys like GS don't come along often.

[harmony]

We got Pom for Espinoza. Long-away prospects have value.

Teams will be reluctant to repeat that mistake.

[jacksonianmarch]

We got Pom for Espinoza. Long-away prospects have value.

 

Espinoza was a year younger and was doing well in long season. Groome got lit up in A ball had to be demoted, then came back and got lit up again. I wouldn't be surprised to see Groome off the top 100 radar. Espinosa was top 25

[notin]

Teams will be reluctant to repeat that mistake.

 

I bet not...

[moonslav59]

Espinoza was a year younger and was doing well in long season. Groome got lit up in A ball had to be demoted, then came back and got lit up again. I wouldn't be surprised to see Groome off the top 100 radar. Espinosa was top 25

 

Low level prospects are often valued highly by GMs with long plans. Espi was not the first low level prospect to be traded for something good.

 

I realize Groome is no Espi, I admit, but to claim he has little to no value is a stretch.

 

The 19 year old was still ranked 87th at mid season by BA.

 

Yes, Espi got up to #15 mid season 2016 at age 15 with the Padres.

 

 

 

[Kimmi]

Gammons might be a fool but Stanton will have a say where he plays. Gammons not only one that wrote it. That's why players put that in their contract. The right to Veto any Trade.

Boston is not in rebuilding mode, so they have that going for them.

 

I would think the attraction of Boston being a contender would be enough to get Stanton to waive his no trade clause. However, I also think that if he has the opportunity to go to the Dodgers or Giants instead, he would choose them over the Sox. IMO, it's a moot point though.

[Slasher9]

Hey DD. This is your weekly reminder to go ahead and trade for Giancarlo. You have my blessing. DO IT. DO IT NOW!

Thank you.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Do we even know that the Red Sox are willing to play Benintendi in CF? If I had to guess the Red Sox starting nine next year, I would go with:

 

1b) Hosmer (I'm not supporting this, just saying that the rumors have been pretty clear about the Red Sox's interest).

2b) M.Hernandez (with the C.Sale for Kopech/Moncada trade, 2b will likely be a position of weakness for the Red Sox for years to come. Thanks, Dave).

SS) Bogaerts

3b) Devers

LF) Benintendi

CF) Bradley

RF) Betts

C) Vazquez

DH) Hanley

 

Bench:

Swihart (I think he is the backup C in 2018).

Brentz

Marrero (good friends with Hosmer, the Red Sox main target, it appears).

Holt??? (He might not make the final 25 man roster. The Red Sox might puruse a DH/1b type instead, another bat who can DH from time to time and give them a little extra thump).

 

When Pedroia returns, he could go to DH rather than 2b.

Edited November 5, 2017 by Fan_since_Boggs

[notin]

I'll try a crazy one.

C: Vazquez

1b: Abreu (acquired for Bradley and Swihart)

2b: Yollmer Sanchez (acquired for Bradley and Swihart)

3b: Devers

ss: Bogaerts

LF: JD Martinez

CF: Benintendi

RF: Betts

DH: Hanley

 

SP: Price , Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, Wright

BP: Kimbrel, Smith, Thornburg, Kelly, Barnes, Johnson, Scott

Bench: Holt, Hernandez, Leon and Castillo

 

Not my plan, but I could see something similar...

[moonslav59]

Do we even know that the Red Sox are willing to play Benintendi in CF? If I had to guess the Red Sox starting nine next year, I would go with:

 

1b) Hosmer (I'm not supporting this, just saying that the rumors have been pretty clear about the Red Sox's interest).

2b) M.Hernandez (with the C.Sale for Kopech/Moncada trade, 2b will likely be a position of weakness for the Red Sox for years to come. Thanks, Dave).

SS) Bogaerts

3b) Devers

LF) Benintendi

CF) Bradley

RF) Betts

C) Vazquez

DH) Hanley

 

Bench:

Swihart (I think he is the backup C in 2018).

Brentz

Marrero (good friends with Hosmer, the Red Sox main target, it appears).

Holt??? (He might not make the final 25 man roster. The Red Sox might puruse a DH/1b type instead, another bat who can DH from time to time and give them a little extra thump).

 

When Pedroia returns, he could go to DH rather than 2b.

 

I'm sure DD would rather keep JBJ in CF and Beni in RF, but if we acquire Stanton of JD Martinez, then trading JBJ for a SP'er might make sense.

 

I'm not high on Hosmer at all. He's not the answer at clean-up. He's not a plus fielder anymore. He'll want and get 5+ years. That's too many years to commit to a marginal 1Bman- a position of usual strength and power in MLB.

 

I get the trepidation on Moustakas. I get not wanting to further deplete the farm to get Stanton. I get how signing JD Martinez to 6 years, at his age, and hurting our fine OF defense or benching HRam, so he can play DH is not ideal either.

 

I'm wondering, if trying to go the shortest terms possible while still getting impact-ful talent might be the way to go.

 

1B Santana for 3 years

RP Bryan Shaw for 3 years

2B Kendrick for 1 year

then maybe help at DH (Duda) or a mid-level SP'er (Lynn/Holland).

 

I'm not sure if this is enough, but there's less risk of a 4-5 year bust.

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

I'll try a crazy one.

C: Vazquez

1b: Abreu (acquired for Bradley and Swihart)

2b: Yollmer Sanchez (acquired for Bradley and Swihart)

3b: Devers

ss: Bogaerts

LF: JD Martinez

CF: Benintendi

RF: Betts

DH: Hanley

 

SP: Price , Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, Wright

BP: Kimbrel, Smith, Thornburg, Kelly, Barnes, Johnson, Scott

Bench: Holt, Hernandez, Leon and Castillo

 

Not my plan, but I could see something similar...

 

3 years of JBJ for 2 years of Abreu would likely get us Yollmer, too.

 

I'm just thinking why not just sign JD, Santana and Shaw and trade JBJ for a SP'er (Carrasco at $26.5M/3 with 2 options counted?).

 

C: Vaz

1B: Santana

2B: H Kendrick>Pedey

3B: Devers

SS: Bogey

LF: Martinez

CF: Beni

RF: Betts

DH: HRam>Pedey

 

SP: Sale, Price, Sale, Pom, Carrasco, Porcello, Wright

RP: Kimbrel, Shaw, Smith, Kelly, Barnes, Scott, Workman, Maddox>Thornburg

 

[a700hitter]

3 years of JBJ for 2 years of Abreu would likely get us Yollmer, too.

 

I'm just thinking why not just sign JD, Santana and Shaw and trade JBJ for a SP'er (Carrasco at $26.5M/3 with 2 options counted?).

 

C: Vaz

1B: Santana

2B: H Kendrick>Pedey

3B: Devers

SS: Bogey

LF: Martinez

CF: Beni

RF: Betts

DH: HRam>Pedey

 

SP: Sale, Price, Sale, Pom, Carrasco, Porcello, Wright

RP: Kimbrel, Shaw, Smith, Kelly, Barnes, Scott, Workman, Maddox>Thornburg

 

How can you count on Kendrick and Pedey not being on the DL at the same time. Kendrick always seems to miss big chunks of every season.

[moonslav59]

How can you count on Kendrick and Pedey not being on the DL at the same time. Kendrick always seems to miss big chunks of every season.

 

I just threw his name out there. There is probably someone more dependable.

 

I'm actually okay with Hernandez/Lin/marrero/Holt, as long as we fill our 2 of our other high need areas with top quality players.

[mvp 78]

Espinoza was a year younger and was doing well in long season. Groome got lit up in A ball had to be demoted, then came back and got lit up again. I wouldn't be surprised to see Groome off the top 100 radar. Espinosa was top 25

 

You really don't know what you are talking about. He was injured to start the year and missed 2 months. They pushed him down to Lowell for 3 starts due to injury, not due to him getting lit up.

[Slasher9]

you really don't know what you are talking about. He was injured to start the year and missed 2 months. They pushed him down to lowell for 3 starts due to injury, not due to him getting lit up.

 

fake news!

[mvp 78]

fake news!

 

The SoxProspects podcast is funded by the Russian oligarchy! Sad!

[Carpin]

3 years of JBJ for 2 years of Abreu would likely get us Yollmer, too.

 

I'm just thinking why not just sign JD, Santana and Shaw and trade JBJ for a SP'er (Carrasco at $26.5M/3 with 2 options counted?).

 

C: Vaz

1B: Santana

2B: H Kendrick>Pedey

3B: Devers

SS: Bogey

LF: Martinez

CF: Beni

RF: Betts

DH: HRam>Pedey

 

SP: Sale, Price, Sale, Pom, Carrasco, Porcello, Wright

RP: Kimbrel, Shaw, Smith, Kelly, Barnes, Scott, Workman, Maddox>Thornburg

 

 

I don't think JBJ will get you a pitcher like Carrasco, you will need far more than that

[moonslav59]

I don't think JBJ will get you a pitcher like Carrasco, you will need far more than that

 

Maybe, but Carrasco has injury history, the Guardians have an OF issue and a rare surplus of SP'ers.

[Bellhorn04]

Maybe, but Carrasco has injury history, the Guardians have an OF issue and a rare surplus of SP'ers.

 

Carrasco was one of the best pitchers in baseball this year and is under control for 3 more years. He's got too much value right now to be traded for a return of JBJ.

[moonslav59]

Carrasco was one of the best pitchers in baseball this year and is under control for 3 more years. He's got too much value right now to be traded for a return of JBJ.

 

My bad. I keep confusing these two, because at one time I wanted both.

 

I meant Salazar with his injury history.

 

Sorry.

 

Yes, Carrasco would not be offered for JBJ, Swihart and Travis.

[Carpin]

My bad. I keep confusing these two, because at one time I wanted both.

 

I meant Salazar with his injury history.

 

Sorry.

 

Yes, Carrasco would not be offered for JBJ, Swihart and Travis.

 

There you might have a match, still think you might need to throw a mid level prospects and the Guardians might listen

[moonslav59]

There you might have a match, still think you might need to throw a mid level prospects and the Guardians might listen

 

They might like Travis, but they could have Ockimey, if they preferred. I'm not sure they like EE at 1B, and they are losing Santana.

 

I might add Chavis, but I'd have to think about it.

[Behindenemylines]

Stanton wants out, wants to play for a contender. There is no evidence that Votto wants out.

 

I would rather have Stanton, he is younger than Votto, but I'm skeptical the Red Sox can acquire him without giving up something like Devers or Beinintendi. Will the Marlins really move Stanton as a salary dump? If yes, I'm all in. If not, the Red Sox don't have the minor talent to acquire him.

 

I agree. If you loss Devers or Benni (Two young power hitting contracts that the Sox have control of for the next 5 to 6 years) then its not hard to make the trade.